Eisenhowers warning came true

[Guthrie]

If the adopted solution proves to be stupid, then it will likely be changed...by Americans.

So, you are admitting that the US position is stupid?

What part of "If" do you not understand?

There is no room for an, 'IF,' where you think there is -- not that you'll understand.

[August1991]

If the adopted solution proves to be stupid, then it will likely be changed...by Americans.

So, you are admitting that the US position is stupid?

What part of "If" do you not understand?

You wrote "if it proves to be stupid". I have presented compelling evidence that the current US security policy for the US Canada border is precisely that.

The US Homeland Security seems to agree with me since State of Washington residents won't require passports to cross the border.

But this is neither here nor there and we're not lawyers arguing about the meanings of words.

My simple point was that the current US administration is making mistakes in providing security to the American public. I admire your idealism in believing that it will soon correct for its mistakes.

[bush_cheney2004]

How can you "see" it? It's several thousand kilometres long.

The same way Homeland Security can see it....aviation.

[bush_cheney2004]

My simple point was that the current US administration is making mistakes in providing security to the American public. I admire your idealism in believing that it will soon correct for its mistakes.

Then why didn't you say as much? All US administrations have made mistakes in providing such security (including Eisenhower's). Tell us something we don't already know.

Canada is feeling the bite:

In 2003, a series of disasters - the war in Iraq, SARS, BSE, West Nile virus and the eastern power outage - followed closely on the heels of 9/11. Now record fuel prices are impacting both the supply and demand sides of tourism worldwide and the dollar has soared by 31 percent. In 2004 inbound overnight travel from the United States to Canada was down 1.2 million visitors. Now Canada could face another tightening of the border. Remember just over 20 percent of US citizens hold passports.

[Guthrie]

when you say, 'we,' who do you mean?

do you mean former submarine spies?

because, when Americans look at border security, they see not just mistakes but an abandonment of responsibility by an adminstration made up almost entirely of greedy fascists who have stolen billions claiming they were going to safeguard America at the same time America's safeguards have been decimated

[August1991]

The same way Homeland Security can see it....aviation.

That's a joke, right?

They've got dogs too. And motion detectors.

You have to see the border along the St-Lawrence River where the Indians bring contraband cigarettes. (There are Mohawks on opposite sides.)

Or how about the St. Croix river between NB and Maine?

Then there's all that empty space in North Dakota and Saskatchewan.

Finally, there's the sheer volume of stuff crossing the "official" border that can't be held up for long.

Let me try a comparison that I'm sure you'll appreciate. The borders between France, Germany, Belgium and Holland no longer exist. Europeans, professionals when it comes to borders, worry far more about the entry points to the continent.

Maybe Americans will eventually come around to the same viewpoint.

[Guthrie]

The same way Homeland Security can see it....aviation.

That's a joke, right?

They've got dogs too. And motion detectors.

You have to see the border along the St-Lawrence River where the Indians bring contraband cigarettes. (There are Mohawks on opposite sides.)

Or how about the St. Croix river between NB and Maine?

Then there's all that empty space in North Dakota and Saskatchewan.

Finally, there's the sheer volume of stuff crossing the "official" border that can't be held up for long.

Let me try a comparison that I'm sure you'll appreciate. The borders between France, Germany, Belgium and Holland no longer exist. Europeans, professionals when it comes to borders, worry far more about the entry points to the continent.

Maybe Americans will eventually come around to the same viewpoint.

maybe he meant, 'flying spy submarines'

[bush_cheney2004]

They've got dogs too. And motion detectors.

You have to see the border along the St-Lawrence River where the Indians bring contraband cigarettes. (There are Mohawks on opposite sides.)

Or how about the St. Croix river between NB and Maine?

Then there's all that empty space in North Dakota and Saskatchewan.

Finally, there's the sheer volume of stuff crossing the "official" border that can't be held up for long.

Let me try a comparison that I'm sure you'll appreciate. The borders between France, Germany, Belgium and Holland no longer exist. Europeans, professionals when it comes to borders, worry far more about the entry points to the continent.

Maybe Americans will eventually come around to the same viewpoint.

And maybe they won't...it's America's decision, not Canada's.

Those European "professionals" still require an EU Passport, no?

If the stupidity of patrolling and enforcing Canada's sovereignty in the North is worth votes for Grits or Tories, it is damn well good enough for Americans. LOL!

Update:

I see they caught another Canadian illegal trying to get into the Promised Land on a Niagara ice floe. Meanwile, back at Nunavut, a Canadian patrol sets out to police the entire Arctic to enforce sovereignty.

http://tinyurl.com/33bh6s

[August1991]

Those European "professionals" still require an EU Passport, no?

No, they don't. Not between France and Germany.

The US and Canada can control who enters our continent. We cannot control who crosses between our countries - and we shouldn't try.

America's Homeland Security starts when a person arrives in North America, and the Americans would be wise to understand this - and our negotiators to remind Americans of this.

[PolyNewbie]

People are waking up. 911 exposes the underbelly of the beast.

[Guthrie]

Those European "professionals" still require an EU Passport, no?

No, they don't. Not between France and Germany.

The US and Canada can control who enters our continent. We cannot control who crosses between our countries - and we shouldn't try.

America's Homeland Security starts when a person arrives in North America, and the Americans would be wise to understand this - and our negotiators to remind Americans of this.

all of the EU borders which cross from one EU country to another can be crossed without a passport

[ScottSA]

The US and Canada can control who enters our continent. We cannot control who crosses between our countries - and we shouldn't try.

America's Homeland Security starts when a person arrives in North America, and the Americans would be wise to understand this - and our negotiators to remind Americans of this.

The lynchpin of this thesis is that US and Canadian immigration and visa monitoring would have to be identical. You cannot simply announce an identical result without engineering an identical endeavor. You would be wise to understand that what you are asking the Americans to understand is that they have to run Canada's security system for it, since Canada seems unwilling to do it. And that brings up the "s" word the canadian left is so concerned about whenever the topic of the giant to the south comes up for discussion.

In any event, the US is not going to throw open its Canadian border anymore than it's going to throw open its Mexican border, until it feels comfortable with Canadian immigration and visitor procedures.

[VJ2]

The US and Canada can control who enters our continent. We cannot control who crosses between our countries - and we shouldn't try.

America's Homeland Security starts when a person arrives in North America, and the Americans would be wise to understand this - and our negotiators to remind Americans of this.

The lynchpin of this thesis is that US and Canadian immigration and visa monitoring would have to be identical. You cannot simply announce an identical result without engineering an identical endeavor. You would be wise to understand that what you are asking the Americans to understand is that they have to run Canada's security system for it, since Canada seems unwilling to do it. And that brings up the "s" word the canadian left is so concerned about whenever the topic of the giant to the south comes up for discussion.

In any event, the US is not going to throw open its Canadian border anymore than it's going to throw open its Mexican border, until it feels comfortable with Canadian immigration and visitor procedures.

Maybe canada should run the American security system. There is already condiderable co-operation between the two- with billions of dollars a day in trade you can't expect draconian measure to work. Canpass and Nexus are steps in the right direction

[Moonlight Graham]

If you like speeches by dead presidents, Teddy Roosevelt said we should "Walk softly and carry a big stick", like this one:

http://navysite.de/cvn/cvn71.jpg

Big sticks cost lots of money.

The U.S. is walking with 40 giant sticks, with dozens more hidden under their bed. I think its gone overboard.

And about that walking softly part, not going so good...

[bush_cheney2004]

The U.S. is walking with 40 giant sticks, with dozens more hidden under their bed. I think its gone overboard.

And about that walking softly part, not going so good...

It wants to go overboard....the very definition of America is excess.

Walking softly happens at the UN where diplomats may engage in vigorous foreplay.