Iran refuses to meet nuclear deadline

[Leafless]

And I love the EXCUSE it gives:

"Iran sits on the world's second biggest oil and gas reserves, but says it wants to build a network of nuclear power plants to prepare for the day when its energy supplies run out and to ensure it maximises energy exports in the meantime."

Give me a break!

As if a country would TOTALLY DEPLETE its own oil reserves without saving any for its own requirements.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200702/s1850738.htm

[Figleaf]

And I love the EXCUSE it gives:

"Iran sits on the world's second biggest oil and gas reserves, but says it wants to build a network of nuclear power plants to prepare for the day when its energy supplies run out and to ensure it maximises energy exports in the meantime."

Give me a break!

As if a country would TOTALLY DEPLETE its own oil reserves without saving any for its own requirements.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200702/s1850738.htm

Well, if you accept/ignore the extent to which it's a pretext to protect a march toward nuclear arms, it's also a very sensible development strategy. Iran (along with many others) forsees the end of the oil economy and intends to use its oil wealth to take care of its future. Makes sense.

[Borg]

As much as I am not a supporter of Iran and their nuke policy, they are a nation - they have the right to self determination. Even if it pisses off the4 rest of the world.

This country will do as it pleases until it is forced - probably by war - to toe the line presented by the major powers.

Borg

[Leafless]

As much as I am not a supporter of Iran and their nuke policy, they are a nation - they have the right to self determination. Even if it pisses off the4 rest of the world.

Borg

Developing a nuclear bomb is a moral thing to do ahead of a tattered economy?

There is nothing moral about what Iran is doing or considering it a legal right is a matter of opinion.

They are presenting an invitation to catrostrophic conditions upon themselves.

[Borg]

Leafless - you had better get out the gun and start pointing it at a whole bunch of countries.

Countries receiving international aide and developing vast militaries, nuke programs, space programs and such - hmmm ......

China, India and Pakistan come immediately to mind.

Economy in tatters? Well the three above have enough of an economy that they could supply aide to Canada rather than receive it. Yet they all have people dying of hunger and disease, living in shacks and no fresh water.

As for Iran - it is their business and no one elses. You admit they have vast oil reserves. They will develop those reserves in their own good time.

What a country does - whether you or I like it - is that country's business. When that country does more than - repeat more than - threaten neighbours - well, then it is time for the world community to act.

Canada has the ability to go nuke - but has not exercised that ability. If it did - would it be pressured into stopping that production?I wonder. Another time and another topic I suppose.

Borg

As much as I am not a supporter of Iran and their nuke policy, they are a nation - they have the right to self determination. Even if it pisses off the4 rest of the world.

Borg

Developing a nuclear bomb is a moral thing to do ahead of a tattered economy?

There is nothing moral about what Iran is doing or considering it a legal right is a matter of opinion.

They are presenting an invitation to catrostrophic conditions upon themselves.

[marcinmoka]

They have the right to pursue said policy if their intentions were legit. But I doubt that.

After all, why did they refuse the Russian offer for nuclear fuel, one which would not produce quantities of fissile material?

[Borg]

No argument from me on your points.

However - who is going to stop them?

Americans? The boards would howl in protest.

Isreal? The boards would howl in protest.

United Nations? Not a chance.

They are a nation unto themselves - just as we are. They have a right to self determination.

And of course we have a right to bomb the hell out of them when they step over the line.

My question is - Will they?

Time will tell.

Pre-emptive strike? Smart but politically it would be like cutting off your head to save your life.

Borg

They have the right to pursue said policy if their intentions were legit. But I doubt that.

After all, why did they refuse the Russian offer for nuclear fuel, one which would not produce quantities of fissile material?

[marcinmoka]

Pre-emptive strike? Smart but politically it would be like cutting off your head to save your life.

Don't know if you read my little opinion piece I just posted, but I genuinely believe there will be a pre-emptive air strike carried out by Israel once Netanyahu gets into power. And they will receive the "secretive" support from the Saudis. They have too much to lose if Iran goes nuclear.

[Catchme]

And I love the EXCUSE it gives:

"Iran sits on the world's second biggest oil and gas reserves, but says it wants to build a network of nuclear power plants to prepare for the day when its energy supplies run out and to ensure it maximises energy exports in the meantime."

Give me a break!

As if a country would TOTALLY DEPLETE its own oil reserves without saving any for its own requirements.

Well, actually Canada is doing that exact thing, we are totally depleting our own oil reserves, and not saving any for our own requirements. We import most of the oil we use and export all most all to the USA.

This is a very smart move on Iran's part, forward thinking to use nuclear power as opposed to burning oil for hydro electric purposes. Moreover, they are decreasing GHG emissions and by burying the reactors are decreasing any potential future environmental impact.

As for their seeking nuclear arms, well again that is their business, if they are in fact doing so. Other countries (India Pakistan) have done so, without receiving all the posturing the USA is doing with Iran.

[Borg]

Jumpin' Judas Priest Bald Headed !!!! - catchme and I actually agree on something.

I need to go and re-examine my life - immediately. I must have made a wrong turn somewhere and not realized it.

Borg

[Borg]

I would say that I did not read your piece, but I agree there will be a hit.

There will be great wailing and gnashing of teeth and threats by countries from all over the globe.

Some - perhaps many of those who will be condemning publicly - will be privately very supportive.

Borg

Pre-emptive strike? Smart but politically it would be like cutting off your head to save your life.

Don't know if you read my little opinion piece I just posted, but I genuinely believe there will be a pre-emptive air strike carried out by Israel once Netanyahu gets into power. And they will receive the "secretive" support from the Saudis. They have too much to lose if Iran goes nuclear.

[GostHacked]

Does anyone recall the fuel shortage of the early 1970's in the United States? How can anyone (like the USA) criticize Iran with how they do their stuff, when there was a fuel shortage at that time? I guess someone did not forsee the downturn (actually it seemed to have beenb predicted in the 20's and 30's about the oil shortage in the 70's).

Canada is using much of it's natural resources to get some of that oil out of the Alberta oil fields. Natural gas is used to heat the oil to extract it from the dirt. Overall this produces a net loss in overall energy output through oil. Using up too much natural gas to extract the oil, then using machines that use oil to work in order to get the oil out of the ground. Just seems like an overall net loss in consumable energy.

Leafless

Developing a nuclear bomb is a moral thing to do ahead of a tattered economy?

Well the Iranians never said it was for military purposes. They have always claimed it was for civilian use. So you really cannot bitch about that part.

marcinmoka

They have the right to pursue said policy if their intentions were legit. But I doubt that.

After all, why did they refuse the Russian offer for nuclear fuel, one which would not produce quantities of fissile material?

Maybe they discovered other scientific methods of getting nuclear energy. Possible?!? Indeed. Iran at best in my estimates are about 5 years away from getting enough nuclear material to make ONE bomb. Chances are they would test that bomb to make sure their science is sound. Or else things go wrong.

So, I am going to bring up North Korea here. Why have they not been invaded since they stated they have a nuclear weapon? Nothing but 6 party talks to get NK to stop. The US knows they cannot deal with NK alone in this aspect, so it has to present the threat to the rest of east Asia is order to get things done.

Why was North Korea nothing but diplomatic talks and Iran it seems to be about the push to war. I guess strategicly/economicly/resources NK does not have anything the United States want's. Considering it is an AXIS OF EVIL (muuaaaahahahaha) along with Iran, should they not face the same scrutiny? Or is this another matter of botched up.... correction SEXED UP INTEL which later turns out to be false?

[Leafless]

Well, actually Canada is doing that exact thing, we are totally depleting our own oil reserves, and not saving any for our own requirements. We import most of the oil we use and export all most all to the USA.

This is a very smart move on Iran's part, forward thinking to use nuclear power as opposed to burning oil for hydro electric purposes. Moreover, they are decreasing GHG emissions and by burying the reactors are decreasing any potential future environmental impact.

As for their seeking nuclear arms, well again that is their business, if they are in fact doing so. Other countries (India Pakistan) have done so, without receiving all the posturing the USA is doing with Iran.

Canada has tons of oil and how can you say "Canada is doing that exact thing, we are totally depleting our own oil reserves, and not saving any for our own requirements" as we are no where near any sort of danger point concerning elimination of our oil supply.

The oil we import is a higher grade oil.

Other countries have indeed acquired nuclear facilities, but none have publicly announced their intention to obliterate another country, such as what Iran has done.

I guess you also think that the world is not as fortunate to have a 'world order', enforced by an allegiance of free countries and assume the world would function perfectly well, without this protection.

[Figleaf]

Pre-emptive strike? Smart but politically it would be like cutting off your head to save your life.

Don't know if you read my little opinion piece I just posted, but I genuinely believe there will be a pre-emptive air strike carried out by Israel once Netanyahu gets into power. And they will receive the "secretive" support from the Saudis. They have too much to lose if Iran goes nuclear.

I hope you're wrong, since it's a recipe for disaster. No viable level of airstrikes is likely to prevent Iran from eventually acheiving the bomb. All air strikes will do is serve as a pretext for using it once they get it.

[marcinmoka]

I hope you're wrong, since it's a recipe for disaster. No viable level of airstrikes is likely to prevent Iran from eventually acheiving the bomb. All air strikes will do is serve as a pretext for using it once they get it

And they don't create any now pretexts to use it now?

Even if it sets them back a decade, it's a success.

But what do you mean by viable level of air strikes? There are 4 key sites, plus 3 major research sites, and with the exception of the Natanz facility, are located much closer to Iran's borders. Getting in will be easy, getting out, not so.

Out of curiosity, did you read the whole piece? i.e. wider spread implications of Shi'a rejuvination?

[Figleaf]

I hope you're wrong, since it's a recipe for disaster. No viable level of airstrikes is likely to prevent Iran from eventually acheiving the bomb. All air strikes will do is serve as a pretext for using it once they get it

And they don't create any now pretexts to use it now?

Iran creating its own pretexts provides in with much less persuasive power that if external forces give them those pretexts by attacking them.

Even if it sets them back a decade, it's a success.

It would be a very narrow and questionable success.

But more importantly, it wouldn't set them back that far. Surely, after the example of Iraq, they know Israel might try to bomb them at any time, so if they've got any wits at all, they have bunkered everything very heavily, and dispersed it to numerous sites.

[marcinmoka]

But more importantly, it wouldn't set them back that far. Surely, after the example of Iraq, they know Israel might try to bomb them at any time, so if they've got any wits at all, they have bunkered everything very heavily, and dispersed it to numerous sites.

Granted. They built them deeper underground and installed air defense systems around these sites.

BUT: That's the conundrum in military capabilities. The offense develops in sync with the defense. Israels air capabilities are much more advanced than they were 26 years ago, and the "laser guided bunker busters" are relatively new.

In fact, seeing as Israel has the support of western nations, it can be argued that their capacities have evolved at a slightly quicker pace, rather than Iran who relies on Russian defensive equipment.

[myata]

Iran also has conventional weapons including medium range missiles. Bombing it in this highly charged climate could trigger an all-out war. And I thought we were talking about solutions?

Iran has strong reasons to want the nukes. Isreal, supported by the worlds greatest military power has them, and Iraq next door clearly shows what happens to those who can't adequately defend themselves. It is also capable (technically and economically) to achieve them. The only question is, what our relations with them will be like when they get there.

[Leafless]

I find it incredible that posters on this site can deliver their anti-Western pro-Iranian propaganda in the same sense Canadian politics is discussed.

Do these posters have an inkling that Iran is anti-Western and anti-American and supports terrorism and is a country led by fundamentalist, harbours weapons of mass destruction and harbours missile technology from Russia and third world countries including China, North Korea and Pakistan.

These posters should be banned.

http://www.cfr.org/publication/9362/

[scribblet]

I find it incredible that posters on this site can deliver their anti-Western pro-Iranian propaganda in the same sense Canadian politics is discussed.

Do these posters have an inkling that Iran is anti-Western and anti-American and supports terrorism and is a country led by fundamentalist, harbours weapons of mass destruction and harbours missile technology from Russia and third world countries including China, North Korea and Pakistan.

These posters should be banned.

http://www.cfr.org/publication/9362/

Speaking for myself, I think its a way to get at the U.S. and anyone who might support them, same way they seem to tacitly support terrorism. Anything that might defeat the U.S. and see its downfall. I don't understand why anyone would want to see Iran become a nuclear super power.

[Figleaf]

I find it incredible that posters on this site can deliver their anti-Western pro-Iranian propaganda in the same sense Canadian politics is discussed.

Do these posters have an inkling that Iran is anti-Western and anti-American and supports terrorism and is a country led by fundamentalist, harbours weapons of mass destruction and harbours missile technology from Russia and third world countries including China, North Korea and Pakistan.

These posters should be banned.

http://www.cfr.org/publication/9362/

Who the f... are you blithering about?

[myata]

My, what a tour de force of intellect! Can any logic and/or reasoning match with that?

[newbie]

I find it incredible that posters on this site can deliver their anti-Western pro-Iranian propaganda in the same sense Canadian politics is discussed.

Do these posters have an inkling that Iran is anti-Western and anti-American and supports terrorism and is a country led by fundamentalist, harbours weapons of mass destruction and harbours missile technology from Russia and third world countries including China, North Korea and Pakistan.

These posters should be banned.

http://www.cfr.org/publication/9362/

Get over yourself! Iran has every right to go nuclear. And as far as morality is concerned one need only to look at Hiroshima and Nagasaki. And, of course, the totally immoral Bush/Cheney/Rumsfelt Iraq war.

[marcinmoka]

Get over yourself! Iran has every right to go nuclear

Yes, despite the fact that they are vocal in initiating threats to destroy a nation which has never struck them.

Love your logic. Maybe Chavez should get a few as well. Heck, Nukes for all!

While I disagree with the banning of anyone (unless they are carrying out personal attacks) on my FIRM belief in the freedom of expression, I do find it hard to believe that someone who is living in a free country such as ours, knocks the very same system and allies which have granted us this freedom.

Maybe it because I'm an immigrant that I respect that which has been afforded to me by our nation and our allies.

[newbie]

Why not. If the U.S. can use them, what the hell.