Topaz Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 After listening to the US politicans about what they should do about Iraq, someone said that there is a possibility of the US pulling troops out of Afghanistan and sending them to Iraq. This would put Canadians fighting the hotspot of Afghanistan alone. How should Canada react if this should come about? Would this force Harper to bring in our own draft for more troops? Should we look at this again and ask if we should even be there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Perhaps if the United States is not fulfilling its end of the bargain on Afghanistan, we should no longer be obligated to fulfill ours. I feel bad for the Afghanis because they're the ones that lose in all of this. The extremists would take over the country again and they'll be living in the oppressive dark ages again (still?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
margrace Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Get out of there fast, this has been Bush's strategy all along and Harper is his dud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepitsimple Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 After listening to the US politicans about what they should do about Iraq, someone said that there is a possibility of the US pulling troops out of Afghanistan and sending them to Iraq. This would put Canadians fighting the hotspot of Afghanistan alone. How should Canada react if this should come about? Would this force Harper to bring in our own draft for more troops? Should we look at this again and ask if we should even be there? "someone said there is a possibility". My first suggestion would be to shoot "someone". The US would never arbitrarily and unilaterally pull out so there's no sense in speculating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackascoal Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 There is a very good possibility that the US will withdraw from Afghanistan. Why are we there? Bin Laden is nowhere to be found and quite possibily has been dead for a long time. We can't find a 6'7" guy in a stone age land of 5'6" people. The Taliban is stronger than ever and Pakistan is and has been used as a safe haven for them. Are we going to attack Pakistan next? The American people are weary of unnecessary war and politicians are scrambling for cover. The so-called "surge" in Iraq is getting little to no support, even from many republicans, and Bush is more isolated than ever. It's too bad that Canada got drawn into this disaster but maybe Harper should meet the same fate as Tony Blair and be shown the door by the populace. The same fate that happened to the leaders of Italy and Spain once their citizens recognized that they had been had. The US will soon be left all alone in Iraq and we hve run out of troops. We don't even know where the proposed additional 20,000 troops will come from. Our men and women in uniform are strecthed to the limit and the military has already extended their combat time from 12 to 24 months with little time between when they can be deployed again. Time to get real .. this entire "war on terror" was a fraud from the beginning used to secure oil contracts for US and British corporations who have made more profit since the beginning of this fraud than any corporations in history. Our troops are dying, but the plutocrats are having a party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 A US withdrawal from Afganistan would make the NATO mission untennable. They represent the lion share of the forces and their leaving would require 40,000 new troops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fortunata Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 I can't see the USA pulling out of Afghanistan. Iraq was a wanna-do but Afghanistan was a must-do and the people can see the difference, if they even remember Afghanistan since most of the media focus has been on Iraq. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drea Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Why doesn't Bush just be honest and say something like: "We need to stay in Iraq to secure the oil because our country and many other western countries depend on it. And if we pull out now there is a large chance that extremists will take over and there goes our oil!" Honesty goes a long way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkman Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 But being that this thread is about Afghanistan, what Bush says about iraq is off topic. If you are going to start a thread whose topic is sourced by 'someone said' it looks like you are talking out your ass. Hillary Clinton is going there in the near future and is arguing the US should put MORE troops there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Blue Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 If the US pull's out of Afghanistan, then the Canadian's, Dutch, and Brits, will have to pullout. The reason why is simple, how are we going to be able to replace the the 12,000 American troops. Plus for the Harper haters out there, I doubt we'll have a draft here. Time to get real .. this entire "war on terror" was a fraud from the beginning used to secure oil contracts for US and British corporations who have made more profit since the beginning of this fraud than any corporations in history. Our troops are dying, but the plutocrats are having a party. Apparently were all living in the Matrix as well. Get out of there fast, this has been Bush's strategy all along and Harper is his dud. Strangely enough the great defenders of Canada the Liberal's were the one's who moved us down to the south, and were the original ones who committed us to Afghanistan. I guess they were Bush's dud as well. Perhaps if the United States is not fulfilling its end of the bargain on Afghanistan, we should no longer be obligated to fulfill ours. The US isn't, and won't pull out. The reason why is simple once again, how are we going to replace 12,000 American troop's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackascoal Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Why doesn't Bush just be honest and say something like:"We need to stay in Iraq to secure the oil because our country and many other western countries depend on it. And if we pull out now there is a large chance that extremists will take over and there goes our oil!" Honesty goes a long way. Bush??? .. honesty??? C'mon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watching&waiting Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 People must be hunting for things to discuss, as there is not even a hint that the US will pull out of Afghanistan, and it is only in the eyes of those who whould have us cut and run away anyhow that this is even posted as a topic. I personally believe that the USA would pull troops from Iraq to Afghanistan then the other way around. It will be akin to a small defeat to gain a fair victory. The Iraq situation can be left for some time as a fight among the people as in their civil war, and the troops from Iraq could be sent to Afghanistn for a proper routing of the Taliban and even into Pakistan, and in short order be back to mop things up in Iraq after they are through fighting among themselves and then a ready to talk as a single nation or evn divided into two nations. I think it is more then workable. Those who think that the troops now in Afghanistan wouldmake a difference in Iraq are kidding themselves and the extra troops Bush is sending is more of the kind that will just contain the civil war and ensure no outside interference will happen. I actually believe that the USA would welcome the Iraqi people if they split into two seperate nations and the divided countries would or could work things out between them. It is not as it the middle east has not seen the break up of countries before. This may even be the best way to find peace in that area of the world. The Nato lead mission in Afghanistan is doing a good job of rebuilding but yes they need more help to clear and secure the southern areas from Taliban insurgents. Canada has taken a large role in this and while we have had casualties, when you look at the number and consider we are in an active war zone, for the last year or so, we really do not have to be ashamed and should be proud that we have done a job in such a good manner. Yes there will be those who say any casualties are just too much, but then again these are the people that think they can talk and reason with the Taliban insurgents. Hell I am all for sending Laytone and all his NDP friends to Afghanistan and put them on the front where the insurgentents are, and let them talk these guys into giving in to our views. But they say we have to protect the weak minded even from themselves. I preferr to wait and let the news come to me, instead of like this thread, try to make news by the "What if" happens type story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikedavid00 Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 What should we do if US withdrawals from Afghanistan We should pull out, and then close our borders from the following countries: Afghanistan Albania Algeria Azerbaijan Bahrain Bangladesh Burkina Faso Brunei Chad Comoros Côte d'Ivoire Djibouti Eritrea Ethiopia Egypt Gambia Guinea Haiti Indonesia Iran Iraq Jordan Jamaica Kuwait Kazakhstan Kyrgyzstan Lebanon Libya Maldives Malaysia Mali Mauritania Morocco Niger Nigeria Oman Pakistan Palestine Qatar Saudi Arabia Senegal Sierra Leone Somalia Sri Lanka Sudan Syria Tajikistan Turkey Tunisia Turkmenistan Uzbekistan United Arab Emirates Yemen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remiel Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Isn't that basically cross-posting? Isn't cross-posting frowned upon? Anyway... If we really thought being in Afghanistan was the thing to do, and in the hypothetical situation that the U.S. were to pull out of Afghanistan, worst case scenario we could always try to pump up the anti-U.S. rhetoric with other allied countries, to try and provoke them into wanting to prove they can do the job better *without* the Americans. Would probably be a long shot... Of course, the U.S. pulling out would have to have severe consequences, for them, the U.S. Maybe in such a scenario, we could convince the Brits and Aussies to redeploy their Iraq forces to Afghanistan. One good political betrayal deserves another... Anyway, were that to happen, the most likely scenario is everyone pulling out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 The US isn't, and won't pull out. The reason why is simple once again, how are we going to replace 12,000 American troop's. If that is true, why did O'Connor make this speech this afternoon? http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/cda_afghan_o_connor Gordon O'Connor says he doesn't object to U.S. President George W. Bush's plan to send 21,500 more troops to Iraq, provided it doesn't mean the Americans "draw any troops from Afghanistan to reinforce Iraq." He says that's the only aspect of the U.S. decision he's thought about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Blue Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 However in the same article O'Connor said this: O'Connor also says he's not aware of any U.S. resources leaving Afghanistan to participate in Iraq. I believe they will be getting troop's from the US, and not shifting troop's from Afghanistan to Iraq. If the US pull's out, everyone will be pulling out. However saying that, I think if we were to see countries start to pullout, it would be another Rwanda. Especially if the Afghan Police and National Army are not trained to the point were we believe they can do the job themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 However in the same article O'Connor said this:I believe they will be getting troop's from the US, and not shifting troop's from Afghanistan to Iraq. If the US pull's out, everyone will be pulling out. However saying that, I think if we were to see countries start to pullout, it would be another Rwanda. Especially if the Afghan Police and National Army are not trained to the point were we believe they can do the job themselves. They are just talking about it on CBC Radio now. The reason O'Connor felt compelled to ask is because his own brass has seen this happen before where U.S. troops are being transferred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Blue Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 If they transfer American troops out of the country, then count on the rest of NATO leaving as nobody would be able to make up the amount of troops which would be leaving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean_Poutine Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 The American people are weary of unnecessary war and politicians are scrambling for cover. The so-called "surge" in Iraq is getting little to no support, even from many republicans, and Bush is more isolated than ever.A lot of Americans, including politicians, believe that they should have stayed in Afghanistan instead of going to Iraq. Here is a map from CNN that shows where American troops are deployed around the world, and how many: http://edition.cnn.com/interactive/maps/wo...orld.index.html That's dated January 9, 2007. According to CNN, there are 22,000 US troops in Afghanistan. Last figure I heard for US troops in Afghanistan, which was from C-SPAN, was 18,000. So, either there is an error somewhere, and CNN's source is DOD so it's not likely that 22,000 is a mistake, or the number of US troops in Afghanistan has actually gone up. The US has nearly ten times as many troops in Afghanistan as Canada and provides air, logistical and medical support. So let's not act like they're abandoning it yet. I ask you, when you have 22,000 troops that are needed in Afghanistan and 100,000 that aren't needed in Europe, where would you get the troops from? Don't get mentally constipated over that now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 If they transfer American troops out of the country, then count on the rest of NATO leaving as nobody would be able to make up the amount of troops which would be leaving. We'll have to see what happens in the next weeks. I think the U.S. is more focussed on Iraq than Afghanistan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffrey Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 If they transfer American troops out of the country, then count on the rest of NATO leaving as nobody would be able to make up the amount of troops which would be leaving. We'll have to see what happens in the next weeks. I think the U.S. is more focussed on Iraq than Afghanistan. There is no chance the US will leave Afghanistan. There is even lesser of a chance the Euro's will live up to to their treaty agreements. It's time NATO is formed without most of Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 There is no chance the US will leave Afghanistan. There is even lesser of a chance the Euro's will live up to to their treaty agreements. It's time NATO is formed without most of Europe. They don't have to leave. They just have to keep it underfunded and undermanned just as they have from the start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean_Poutine Posted January 14, 2007 Report Share Posted January 14, 2007 There is no chance the US will leave Afghanistan. There is even lesser of a chance the Euro's will live up to to their treaty agreements. It's time NATO is formed without most of Europe. They don't have to leave. They just have to keep it underfunded and undermanned just as they have from the start. The US has far more troops than any other country has in Afghanistan -- 22,000 -- and provides most of the air, logistical and medical support. When other NATO countries were bickering over who would come up with the additional 2500 troops needed, the US sent an additional 5000 troops, yet you center them out for your criticism? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmax Posted January 14, 2007 Report Share Posted January 14, 2007 The US isn't going anywhere. Particularly with the small footprint that they do have, there isn't much of what is left in Afghanistan to aid in the"surge" in Iraq. But they could reduce the US footprint a little more, and expect NATO to pick up the difference. I think this is unlikely to occur. But you never know how the Iraq surge will play out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmax Posted January 14, 2007 Report Share Posted January 14, 2007 There is even lesser of a chance the Euro's will live up to to their treaty agreements. It's time NATO is formed without most of Europe. So who would be left? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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