So who is your pick for the Liberals?

geoffrey · December 2, 2006

Kennedy is not a national leader, not now. He may become one although his French is non-existent and that's not going to change. It should be lost on no one that the three remaining candidates all functional well in both languages. Although his French is lousy, Harper would not be PM if he was unable to do an interview in French. (It's not merely the language; it's also the ability to understand Quebec.)

The rest of the candidates are not national leaders either. None have appeal in Alberta. The Liberals aren't a national party until they elect an Alberta MP.

Why frustrate ourselves over Quebec so much? If the Liberals want to form a government, they need Western support too, Kennedy was that ticket.

Dion is unpopular in Quebec anyways.

None of the people I saw at the convention inspired the kind of charismatic enthusiasm of Trudeau. When Trudeau was in a room, there was a sense of his presence. Ignatieff doesn't have that nor does Rae. Dion least of all. (I think it's a question of ego since I have found that stage actors have this more than most.)

Iggy's got quite an ego... but you say he has no presence? Interesting.

It was also interesting to see a meeting of Liberals when they were out of power. It's like seeing a squirrel on a sidewalk. Not a natural position and the squirrel wants to go back to where it should be. This is the closest you'll ever see Liberals to self-doubt.

Very true. Iggy's speech and Dion's speech both seemingly claimed to deserve power... that Canadians are Liberals and we need to take our country back from the Conservatives? Ugh. The Liberals aren't winning majorities with that. Rae and Kennedy had refreshing speeches with some vision, and no sense of entitlement.

I still see Dion winning. He'll certainly be on the last ballot. It'll be Dion vs. either Rae or Ignatieff. (I think Ignatieff will be third on the third ballot and get dropped off but who knows.) (Incidentally, it's not because I want Dion to win but because I figure he'll win by default. As BD would say, I don't have a dog in this fight.)
Stephen Harper is winning this convention because whether he faces Dion or Rae, he'll still win. Hence, that may explain the sense of self-doubt I saw on the Liberal faces.

I see Dion winning as well. This third ballot will be interesting though...

Harper will win against anyone but Kennedy, and since Kennedy is out, Harper has won.

mcqueen625 · December 2, 2006

I'm going with Mr. Ignatieff because I'm onside with everything he is accused of doing wrong by the treasonous "Anybody But Ignatieff" crowd. So is yesterday's Liberal convention keynote speaker, Howard Dean, I'm sure.
I believe that Michael Ignatieff would make a great opposition to another brilliant man, Stephen Harper. And I also believe that these two true geniuses, respecting each other's superior intelligence, would bury the hatchets, and the usual axing of any ideas that come from the other camp would stop. They'd just bounce the ideas off of each other, and believing that two superior brains are better than one, they'd be extra confident in implementing them. Which camp is presently in charge would be the last thing on their minds ... because all they would worry about is what is good for Canada.

In other words, I have a vision that with these two in charge, Canada could become a political Shangri-la for others to strive towards ... in the not so distant future.

We can only hope.

How about, "None of the above."

Wilber · December 2, 2006

The rest of the candidates are not national leaders either. None have appeal in Alberta. The Liberals aren't a national party until they elect an Alberta MP.
Why frustrate ourselves over Quebec so much? If the Liberals want to form a government, they need Western support too, Kennedy was that ticket.

I've been watching this on the tube for the last couple of hours and haven't heard the west mentioned once. It is all about Quebec and Ontario. You'd think this bunch doesn't know a third of the country exists. And they wonder why they have trouble electing people here.

Biblio Bibuli · December 2, 2006

If Dion is in the final ballot,Rae delegates will go with Ignatieff, or Ignatieff delegates will go with Rae.
So I don't think that Dion will win in the end.

BINGO!!!

Iggy's got it in the bag, there are no ifs ands or buts about that.

Do any of you think congratulations are in order?

I do.

gc1765 · December 2, 2006

The latest news, 3rd ballot:

Dion: 37%

Iggy: 34.5%

Rae: 28.5%

ClearWest · December 2, 2006

It was just announced - Rae is out!

geoffrey · December 2, 2006

The rest of the candidates are not national leaders either. None have appeal in Alberta. The Liberals aren't a national party until they elect an Alberta MP.
Why frustrate ourselves over Quebec so much? If the Liberals want to form a government, they need Western support too, Kennedy was that ticket.

I've been watching this on the tube for the last couple of hours and haven't heard the west mentioned once. It is all about Quebec and Ontario. You'd think this bunch doesn't know a third of the country exists. And they wonder why they have trouble electing people here.

It was shown quite clearly that more people favoured Dion to appease 7 million Quebecois over Kennedy to help the Liberals regain national party status with the 9 million in the West and 10 million in Ontario.

The Liberal party has returned to it's roots in typical getting in bed with the French just out of tradition. Mr. Dion will not earn my vote unfortunately, nor will Ignatieff with his misconception of Western values.

When the Liberals smarten up, and deal with Canada as a country beyond Quebec, then they'll have my vote, along with the votes of thousands of other Albertans and Westerners.

It's a sad day for the party, this was a big opportunity to turn things around.

Canadian Blue · December 2, 2006

Liberal's are out of touch with western Canada. Look at the gun registry, what did that accomplish other than pissing off farmers and duck hunters. I think if the Liberal's ever wanted to win the west a leader would have to come out in support of the Triple E senate, or democratic reforms so the region's are well represented in case the majority [Quebec, Ontario] decide to make unfair policies towards a certain region.

August1991 · December 2, 2006

I've been watching this on the tube for the last couple of hours and haven't heard the west mentioned once. It is all about Quebec and Ontario. You'd think this bunch doesn't know a third of the country exists. And they wonder why they have trouble electing people here.

I had a chat with Liberal delegate fromVancouver who was supporting Dion. Infact, the floor is a represenative geographic sample of people from all over Canada. It's rather remarkable. It's not representative of Canadian society however.

----

If people had wanted Ignatieff, they would have voted already voted for him. I think the typical Rae supporter is closer to Dion than Ignatieff.

The only thing that could happen is that in the next hour or so, it's going to dawn on some delegates that they are about to choose another French-speaking leader from Quebec who, this time, will probably be unelectable.

In a way, I admire Rae's panache and thought he'd make a good federal politician. If I had to choose, I'd probably choose Ignatieff based on policy. For me, Dion is another Chretien Liberal. (The CBC implies that Dion is the non-establishment candidate but that's nonsense.)

Harper's decsion to consult with Dion about the wording of the nation resolution seems prescient.

Anyway, it's not over yet. Ignatieff could still win.

geoffrey · December 2, 2006

Let's be reasonable August, Mr. Dion has won. The endorsements from big name people are piling up. He's got it in the bag.

The Liberals have elected another French leader that will not win a government for them. Kennedy is the reasonable next choice, hopefully it works that way.

It's not a coincidence that the two last standing Liberal candiates were the most anti-Alberta in their campaigns, despite Iggy's pledge to "win seats in Alberta!" with carbon taxes and his wanna-be Trudeauisms.

Biblio Bibuli · December 2, 2006

Mr. Dion will not earn my vote unfortunately, nor will Ignatieff with his misconception of Western values.

I'm sure that Messers Klein, Dinning and Morton are celebrating Iggy's win.

Aren't you happy for them? :lol: :lol:

gc1765 · December 2, 2006

The Liberals have elected another French leader that will not win a government for them. Kennedy is the reasonable next choice, hopefully it works that way.

Maybe not, but I still think he has a better chance of winning than either Rae or Ignatieff.

Wilber · December 2, 2006

I had a chat with Liberal delegate fromVancouver who was supporting Dion. Infact, the floor is a represenative geographic sample of people from all over Canada. It's rather remarkable. It's not representative of Canadian society however.

Ya got that right. It's not even representative of BC. Vancouver is the only place they can elect anyone out here.

ClearWest · December 2, 2006

Kennedy reportedly delivered 91% of his delegates to Dion. That is a devoted following--it's saying a lot for Kennedy. Even though he didn't hang in for this one, it looks like he may have a future in leadership in the Liberal party - Especially if Dion wins, (which I'm betting he will), because his support will likely be rewarded with high profile cabinet positions when/if the time comes for the Liberals to form government again.

geoffrey · December 2, 2006

I had a chat with Liberal delegate fromVancouver who was supporting Dion. Infact, the floor is a represenative geographic sample of people from all over Canada. It's rather remarkable. It's not representative of Canadian society however.

Ya got that right. It's not even representative of BC. Vancouver is the only place they can elect anyone out here.

And, just like Harper said, only in communities of recent immigrants that aren't integrated in the Western culture.

Oh, and Ralph Goodale in a government riding. And few Indian and French neighbourhoods in Manitoba.

The reasoning for this phenomenon is apparent in the speeches and platforms of the two leading candidates right now... both who think they can win seats in Alberta! HA!

gerryhatrick · December 2, 2006

The Liberals have elected another French leader that will not win a government for them.

You're entitled to your opinion, naturally, but what makes me laugh is your pretense that you would ever vote Liberal.

It's not a coincidence that the two last standing Liberal candiates were the most anti-Alberta in their campaigns

anti-Alberta, huh? :rolleyes:

geoffrey · December 2, 2006

anti-Alberta, huh?

Ignatieff strongly supports a carbon tax, Dion would likely follow suit. That's not in Alberta's interest. We will not accept another NEP.

gerryhatrick · December 2, 2006

anti-Alberta, huh?

Ignatieff strongly supports a carbon tax, Dion would likely follow suit. That's not in Alberta's interest.

Supporting a carbon tax does not make someone "anti-Alberta".

If you want to argue how it would hurt Alberta go right ahead, but calling it "anti-Alberta" is absolute nonsense.

Charles Anthony · December 2, 2006

Even though he didn't hang in for this one, it looks like he may have a future in leadership in the Liberal party - Especially if Dion wins,

What an interesting game. The candidate assesses the following choices:

1) winning leadership

2) winning a ministerial post

and determines that he has much greater chances of winning a ministerial post by dropping out and making a leadership-winning friend. Makes perfect sense. We poor-folk do that all of the time -- but usually with our own resources at stake.

Maybe that could be the intention of some of these "leadership" candidates all along?? In this game, there is only one gold medal but more than one silver medal available. The silver can pay well too.

Regardless of the political party involved, I wonder if most of the delegates are just being duped and used.

Canadian Blue · December 2, 2006

The best comment I heard so far was Karen Redman talking about how the Liberals are talking about the issues which matter to Canadian's.

John Baird responded: "Liberals talk, they talk, and talk, and talk, and do absolutely nothing in terms of actions. :lol:

I think the Conservatives should actually work more with the NDP, they both have shown more maturity it seems with regards to working together in order to bring about actual results.

geoffrey · December 2, 2006

anti-Alberta, huh?

Ignatieff strongly supports a carbon tax, Dion would likely follow suit. That's not in Alberta's interest.

Supporting a carbon tax does not make someone "anti-Alberta".

If you want to argue how it would hurt Alberta go right ahead, but calling it "anti-Alberta" is absolute nonsense.

If it hurts Alberta, it's against our interests.... most people would say something against Alberta's interests is anti-Alberta.

If a politican was in favour of a smelting emissions tax he'd be considered anti-Quebec... or in favour of a auto manufacturing emissions tax would be anti-Ontario.

The fact is that Alberta does produce CO2 emissions and CO2 is a cause, among many, of global warming to whatever extent it's happening. The real solution isn't to tax Alberta though, it's to spread the cost over everyone. If no one in Canada was consuming oil, and Alberta was just exporting like mad, I could see some merit. But that's not the case. Alberta supplies the oil, producing CO2 in the process, to the rest of the country. It just happens that the oil is here, but the demand and need for it comes from everywhere in Canada.

Creating an environmental tax that unfairly targets Alberta for what is really a Western societial issue is anti-Albertan and unacceptable to every reasonable person that lives here.

ClearWest · December 2, 2006

Maybe that could be the intention of some of these "leadership" candidates all along?? In this game, there is only one gold medal but more than one silver medal available. The silver can pay well too.

That's gotta be the case. A lot of these candidates knew that they wouldn't be able to win by the time this weekend came around, based on polls and such. The only reason they'd stay on, I expect, is to be among the influential. Everyone who has a following has power to offer. These conventions end up becoming a game of consolidating power. Whoever can consolidate the most power wins.

But... is it really honest? Is it really fair and free of corruption? Cronyism is a word that pops into mind, it's not an accusation, just a suspicion.

It's a funny thing. It's awfully entertaining, and I'll admit that I'm really enjoying following the politcal sports. It's a very funny thing...

Hydraboss · December 2, 2006

Is anyone else watching CTV? The way they're conducting interviews from the convention floor, you would think the federal Liberals didn't have a single member that speaks English!

God, I hope they keep showing this to Western Canada. It should be effective in scaring English-speaking, western Canadians away from the Liberals more effectively than the CPC ever could.

If they get in power, here comes the Alberta carbon taxes.

gerryhatrick · December 2, 2006

anti-Alberta, huh?

Ignatieff strongly supports a carbon tax, Dion would likely follow suit. That's not in Alberta's interest.

Supporting a carbon tax does not make someone "anti-Alberta".

If you want to argue how it would hurt Alberta go right ahead, but calling it "anti-Alberta" is absolute nonsense.

If it hurts Alberta, it's against our interests.... most people would say something against Alberta's interests is anti-Alberta.

Does noone in Alberta care about Global Warming?

You have a very low opinion of Albertans if all you think they care about is how a carbon tax would affect their wallets.

And although your circular rationalizing may look nice, the fact remains that calling someone "anti-Alberta" carries a slanderous connotation that is not justified by claiming they're against the interests of Albertans on a single issue.

geoffrey · December 2, 2006

Does noone in Alberta care about Global Warming?
You have a very low opinion of Albertans if all you think they care about is how a carbon tax would affect their wallets.

And although your circular rationalizing may look nice, the fact remains that calling someone "anti-Alberta" carries a slanderous connotation that is not justified by claiming they're against the interests of Albertans on a single issue.

There are ways of dealing with global warming without creating a complex punitive wealth transfer system.

What do Iggy and Dion offer to Albertans that is in our interest then? Nothing.