Trump has Destroyed 80 Years of Stable Government Foreign Relations Because He Let Stephen Miller and Russel Vought Control Foreign Policy

[John Stone]

6 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

President Trump has done nothing to destroy American foreign policy...it is exactly the same as it was before:

 

USS Theodore Roosevelt (CVN-71)

The U.S. foreign policy before Donald Trump was characterized by focus on multilateralism, diplomacy and international cooperation. It prioritized economic strength, alliances and a rules based international order. The strategy was to integrate rising powers responsibly while addressing challenges like terrorism, climate change, nuke proliferation and most important to the U.S. – GLOBAL ECONOMIC INSTABILITY.

 

[Nationalist]

19 hours ago, John Stone said:

Irrelevant counselor .................. I'm not beating the drums of war ............. justifying war based on a clown car's rhetoric. 

Oh...am I justifying this war? Do tell...

Or admit you're full o' shit.

[John Stone]

16 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I think that a lot of players on both sides, who sat on the fence waiting to see which way the wind blows, are going to start to become more/less involved in this fight, now that it decisively going one way.

From the pro-IRGC side, if China and Russia could be seen to be helping Iran win, and defend their own country, it could be politically advantageous for them to do that. But all that they can do now is help the Iranian regime sink tankers, and that's 1) not a good look internationally, 2) not good for China's own economy.

From the anti-IRGC side, the perceived danger of going directly against Iran's militarily collapsed when Iran's forces folded like a cheap tent. And while there's a highly vocal and irrational pro-regime faction in every western country, the economic impact of the oil shortage is outweighing their fear of terror cells. 

An international coalition will gain momentum as pro-IRGC forces are squeezed like the zits they are.

The current regime will fall completely, because they can't rule from underground bunkers while a new gov't is in the seat of power, and I think that Trump's force of will is going to get his chosen replacement into that seat.

 

It sounds like a lot to ask for, but this one-sided ass-whooping was also unexpected. Everyone thought that Iran was going to be a tougher nut than this.  

The U.S. short term ops may well achieve tactical objectives, but long term stability requires skilled diplomacy, regional cooperation and domestic political legitimacy (so-called, ‘regime change)

This is a big bite ……….and my faith in the U.S. head shop to achieve any of it is pessimistic.

Without a balanced strategy, the risk is humanitarian crises (failed state – Israel’s desire) economic disruption (destroyed infrastructure), terrorism and a broader (regional) geopolitical escalation. 

Unless the nuke fuel is recovered and regular IAEA inspections (detailed in JCPOA)  are allowed, op ‘Epic Fury’ will be a failure …… a failure at what political cost and human life. 

Yemen.

As a vital sea route, the Red Sea is crucial to SA’s economy.  

Beginning in 2023, the Houthis in Yemen have launched attacks in the Red Sea against commercial and naval ships, resulting in vessels being diverted away (via Cape) from the region (Suez) hindering world trade and freedom of navigation.

Increasingly, Northwestern Yemen (Houthis) could become a threat to SA’s economy and National Security………… and by extension Global economic stability.

 

[John Stone]

25 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Oh...am I justifying this war? Do tell...

Or admit you're full o' shit.

............... my mistake in believing u were a hollow drum. 

[Nationalist]

7 minutes ago, John Stone said:

............... my mistake in believing u were a hollow drum. 

So...ur full o' shit.

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, John Stone said:

The U.S. short term ops may well achieve tactical objectives, but long term stability requires skilled diplomacy, regional cooperation and domestic political legitimacy (so-called, ‘regime change)

This is a big bite ……….and my faith in the U.S. head shop to achieve any of it is pessimistic.

I know that you don't want to hear this, but Trump has had a lot of success at bringing the Arab world to the table in peace talks with Israel, and if he can get the Iranian regime out of the way, that process could be greatly expedited.

And I know that their part in this could all be BS - they could all just be biding their time until the gigantic orange oaf with the nukes is gone so that they can resume their killing stance - or it could be legit and then all get sabotaged in the blink of an eye 5 years from now, but at least it's something. And by that I mean "something that we never saw even a glimpse of in the previous 80 years". 

The two biggest factors at play there right now, imo, are:

1. islamic bigotry, which is hard-wired into their history and hadiths, with even mohammed using genocide as a tool for spreading the religion and throttling non-islamic societies
2. Iranian propaganda, which has incited cancerous hatred for several generations now

It will be interesting to see what the world would look like without the Iranian hate factory funding things like Oct 7th, in order to create wars with dead children that they can use as props to incite new generations of hatred.

Honest to God, when the Iranians plan these wars, a short-term win is not the primary goal, because they know that they can't win right now. The primary goal is get Israel to retaliate - so that they can generate some dead-child photo ops - and then they will use those dead-child photo ops to create future generations of hateful killers, in the hopes the eventually one of those generations can unleash a glorious genocide against the Israelis.

Iran's side only has to win once, and then there will never be another war with the Israelis, because there will be no survivors. The Jews have to win every time or they will all die. If you doubt what I said in this paragraph, then I would love for you to express that in no uncertain terms, because it is something that needs to be well and truly understood for you to have a full grasp of what's at stake every single day for the Israelis. 

[robosmith]

12 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

President Trump has done nothing to destroy American foreign policy...it is exactly the same as it was before:

 

USS Theodore Roosevelt (CVN-71)

NATO used to cooperate with US but NO MORE and the is DIFFERENT because of Trump.

5 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Oh...am I justifying this war? Do tell...

Or admit you're full o' shit.

You defend Trump every time, even after he launches a war you OPPOSE.

Quote where you said OTHERWISE.

[robosmith]

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I know that you don't want to hear this, but Trump has had a lot of success at bringing the Arab world to the table in peace talks with Israel, and if he can get the Iranian regime out of the way, that process could be greatly expedited.

And I know that their part in this could all be BS - they could all just be biding their time until the gigantic orange oaf with the nukes is gone so that they can resume their killing stance - or it could be legit and then all get sabotaged in the blink of an eye 5 years from now, but at least it's something. And by that I mean "something that we never saw even a glimpse of in the previous 80 years". 

The two biggest factors at play there right now, imo, are:

1. islamic bigotry, which is hard-wired into their history and hadiths, with even mohammed using genocide as a tool for spreading the religion and throttling non-islamic societies
2. Iranian propaganda, which has incited cancerous hatred for several generations now

It will be interesting to see what the world would look like without the Iranian hate factory funding things like Oct 7th, in order to create wars with dead children that they can use as props to incite new generations of hatred.

Honest to God, when the Iranians plan these wars, a short-term win is not the primary goal, because they know that they can't win right now. The primary goal is get Israel to retaliate - so that they can generate some dead-child photo ops - and then they will use those dead-child photo ops to create future generations of hateful killers, in the hopes the eventually one of those generations can unleash a glorious genocide against the Israelis.

Iran's side only has to win once, and then there will never be another war with the Israelis, because there will be no survivors. The Jews have to win every time or they will all die. If you doubt what I said in this paragraph, then I would love for you to express that in no uncertain terms, because it is something that needs to be well and truly understood for you to have a full grasp of what's at stake every single day for the Israelis. 

It would be more interesting to see what the ME would be like without the US hate factory.

There are MANY REASONS why Iran hates America, chief among them multiple regime changes and land thefts to benefit Israel.

Not sure why ANYONE believes attacking American interests in foreign lands is not justified by our foreign interference.

We would certainly believe attacking foreigners for interfering in our domestic affairs like deposing our elected leader would be justified.

[bush_cheney2004]

9 hours ago, John Stone said:

The U.S. foreign policy before Donald Trump was characterized by focus on multilateralism, diplomacy and international cooperation. It prioritized economic strength, alliances and a rules based international order. The strategy was to integrate rising powers responsibly while addressing challenges like terrorism, climate change, nuke proliferation and most important to the U.S. – GLOBAL ECONOMIC INSTABILITY.

 

 

Oh really ?   So none of these unilateral military actions happened before Donald Trump became president ?    

Quote

Key Interventions & Foreign Policy Actions

• Banana Wars (1900–1934): Frequent interventions in Latin America and the Caribbean (Cuba, Panama, Nicaragua, Haiti) to secure economic and political stability, per Wikipedia.
• Cold War CIA Operations: Covert actions, including the 1953 Iranian coup (Operation Ajax), 1954 Guatemalan coup, and the failed 1961 Bay of Pigs invasion in Cuba.
• Lebanon/Grenada/Panama (1980s): Troops sent to Lebanon (1982), invasion of Grenada (1983), and Panama (1989) to secure US interests and depose dictators, according to Congress.gov.

Other Actions

• Boxer Rebellion (1900): U.S. troops joined international forces to crush the Boxer uprising in China.
• Mexican Border War (1910–1919): Troops protected border interests, including the 1916–1917 expedition against Pancho Villa.

 

[bush_cheney2004]

3 hours ago, robosmith said:

NATO used to cooperate with US but NO MORE and the is DIFFERENT because of Trump.

You defend Trump every time, even after he launches a war you OPPOSE.

Quote where you said OTHERWISE.

 

Nonsense....NATO is still very dependent on the U.S. for military capabilities unmet by other member states, including tactical / strategic nuclear weapons in quantity delivery platforms.

Trump is the elected president, and he gets to do what many other presidents have done before him, whether I like it or not.   That is the reality regardless of your opposition.

"Elections have consequences" - President Barack Obama (2008)   

[robosmith]

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Nonsense....NATO is still very dependent on the U.S. for military capabilities unmet by other member states, including tactical / strategic nuclear weapons in quantity delivery platforms.

Both UK and France have nukes and can make more if needed.

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Trump is the elected president, and he gets to do what many other presidents have done before him, whether I like it or not.   That is the reality regardless of your opposition.

Trump is doing a LOT MORE ILLEGAL shit than any other POTUS before him. You should pay more attention.

Killing sailors (including fishermen) on the high seas (incl double tap war crimes).

Stealing oil from other nations by military attack.

Killing heads of state of major nations.

And soon to be invading without permission of Congress

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

"Elections have consequences" - President Barack Obama (2008)   

And with Trump, the consequences are unconstitutional. AKA not what Obama meant.

[bush_cheney2004]

11 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Both UK and France have nukes and can make more if needed.

 

UK rents Trident 2 missiles (not warheads) from the USA.   France only keeps one boomer on patrol at any given time.    The U.S. can make lots more too....so what ?

 

Quote

Trump is doing a LOT MORE ILLEGAL shit than any other POTUS before him. You should pay more attention.

Killing sailors (including fishermen) on the high seas (incl double tap war crimes).

Stealing oil from other nations by military attack.

Killing heads of state of major nations.

And soon to be invading without permission of Congress

And with Trump, the consequences are unconstitutional. AKA not what Obama meant.

 

Wrong...many presidents have done so, including Obama (Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria).   The Trump haters have forgotten or never knew American history.

Edited March 30 by bush_cheney2004

[WestCanMan]

4 hours ago, robosmith said:

NATO used to cooperate with US but NO MORE and the is DIFFERENT because of Trump.

Starmie the Pooh and Emanuel Micronuts are losers, robo. They were too afraid to deal with Iran so they stayed in Northern Europe, scissoring with each other. 

Don't pretend that you never noticed they were gutless losers back when Biden was POTUS.

[WestCanMan]

4 hours ago, robosmith said:

It would be more interesting to see what the ME would be like without the US hate factory.

There are MANY REASONS why Iran hates America, chief among them multiple regime changes and land thefts to benefit Israel.

Not sure why ANYONE believes attacking American interests in foreign lands is not justified by our foreign interference.

We would certainly believe attacking foreigners for interfering in our domestic affairs like deposing our elected leader would be justified.

LMAO. When you said "The story about trees and rocks helping the muslims to kill all the Jews that were trying to hide from them was just a harmless parable", that was almost brilliant compared to this latest pile of steaming stupidity...

FYI Iran doesn't hate the US for their political interference in the ME because America put those ayatollahs in power.

Iran hates the US because the US protects Israel from Iran's planned genocide, plain and simple. That is the ONLY reason. 

When the muslims attack Israel, usually 5-7 of them at a time, the Palestinians tend to lose some land. So uhhhh, I dunno, maybe don't attack them and then you won't end up whining after you lose... .

So STFU robo, you whiny little Karen. 

[WestCanMan]

32 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Trump is doing a LOT MORE ILLEGAL shit than any other POTUS before him. You should pay more attention.

You need to learn the difference between "facts", and "shit that some congenital liars said on CNN". 

FYI there are no pertinent 'facts' in the news programs that you watch, just false narratives and some cherry-picked tidbits that tickle your confirmation bias. 

Don't come here regurgitating CNN talking points and we won't prove how stupid you are. 

[robosmith]

28 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

UK rents Trident 2 missiles (not warheads) from the USA.   France only keeps one boomer on patrol at any given time.    The U.S. can make lots more too....so what ?

 

 

Wrong...many presidents have done so, including Obama (Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria).   The Trump haters have forgotten or never knew American history.

No invasions. That's why Bush got the AUMF before invading Iraq and Afghanistan.

Obama never invaded Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria. US forces were already there.

6 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

LMAO. When you said "The story about trees and rocks helping the muslims to kill all the Jews that were trying to hide from them was just a harmless parable", that was almost brilliant compared to this latest pile of steaming stupidity...

FYI Iran doesn't hate the US for their political interference in the ME because America put those ayatollahs in power.

Iran hates the US because the US protects Israel from Iran's planned genocide, plain and simple. That is the ONLY reason. 

When the muslims attack Israel, usually 5-7 of them at a time, the Palestinians tend to lose some land. So uhhhh, I dunno, maybe don't attack them and then you won't end up whining after you lose... .

So STFU robo, you whiny little Karen. 

You first, a-hole.

2 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

You need to learn the difference between "facts", and "shit that some congenital liars said on CNN". 

FYI there are no pertinent 'facts' in the news programs that you watch, just false narratives and some cherry-picked tidbits that tickle your confirmation bias. 

Don't come here regurgitating CNN talking points and we won't prove how stupid you are. 

No, you'll prove how stupid YOU ARE with YOUR OBSESSION with CNN. LMAO

[WestCanMan]

30 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Wrong...many presidents have done so, including Obama (Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria).   The Trump haters have forgotten or never knew American history.

I'd love to see what their idea of a "legal war" is lol

Was Biden's plan to send a formal letter to the UN, requesting permission to meet Iranian troops behind the school, after the bell?

• "Ok, Khomenei-Pop, you listen here... I plainly whispered "don't", THREE TIMES, with my eyes mostly closed, and you clearly DID! Now I've had it with your malarkey! I am formally offering you the opportunity to come out behind the woodshed with me, where I was gonna take Trump! You can take the first shot, you dog-faced pony jihadi, an' them I'm gonna rattle you upside the head with muh chain!"

And why don't I hear robobigot bemoaning the undisclosed intentions of Hamas on Oct 6th... 

"You don't need to get permission from the UN just to sneak across the border and burn some babies to death, and r4pe-murder some b1tches, you just need permission to hit radar installations and other military targets, and also to kill beloved father-figures who are just having some harmless little genocide-planning sessions." - robobigot. 

[bush_cheney2004]

22 minutes ago, robosmith said:

No invasions. That's why Bush got the AUMF before invading Iraq and Afghanistan.

Obama never invaded Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria. US forces were already there.

 

Obama increased U.S. special forces and regulars on the ground without Congressional approval for Libya and Syria.   Trump hasn't even done that in Iran...yet.

The Trump haters refuse to admit or understand American interventionist history going back over 100 years...because hating Trump is all that matters.

Even President Carter invaded Iran with a failed rescue attempt (Operation Eagle Claw).

This is what U.S. president do...it is in the job description.

[John Stone]

18 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Oh really ?   So none of these unilateral military actions happened before Donald Trump became president ?    

 

Indeed - history is so interesting.

Walk softly but carry a big stick.

The phrase emphasizes a balanced approach of subtlety and strength.  It suggest that one should engage peacefully and respectfully in negotiations or interactions but also be prepared to assert power decisively

The phrase can be attributed to the former US president, Theodore Roosevelt who coined the term in the late 19^th century.

The U.S. foreign policy before Donald Trump was characterized by focus on multilateralism, diplomacy and international cooperation.

A list of the conflicts fought by the US since 1945 would include Korea, Vietnam, Grenada, Panama, Gulf War, Somalia, Kosovo, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, ISIS.

Gulf War (1990), Afghanistan and Iraq were the major conflicts where a US. President sought Congressional approval……. and for good reason, ‘it takes money to kill bad guys”

Suppose it could be debated why the majority of conflicts since 1945 didn’t seek Congressional approval – the reason is that there were legalities to these struggles that enabled the President to do an end-run around Congress. ……………. Legitimately.

Likely not an understatement to say Operation Epic Fury took the Nation / allies by surprise? Ya think??

No Address to the Nation

No Address to Congress (no Congressional approval – potential constitutional crisis)

No collaboration with allies (Israel notwithstanding)

The Iran-US conflict is a major international conflict.

Additional funding thru Congress is questionable.

 

Compare Operation Epic Fury with the invasion of Afghanistan.

There was massive domestic and international support

Bush sought and received UN approval

US and NATO forces together invaded and quickly overcame their objectives.

I think we can agree that with  Donald Trump's administration there is a dearth of  multilateralism, diplomacy and  international cooperation. 

to paraphrase, 'we don't need international support' / Trump

May those words not come  back to haunt

[Deluge]

On 3/28/2026 at 11:40 PM, robosmith said:

Trump has Destroyed 80 Years of Stable Government Foreign Relations Because He Let Stephen Miller and Russel Vought Control Foreign Policy In the NSS 12/25 VIDEO

 

Unleashing the whirlwind of National Destruction because he doesn't know what they're doing.

Trump's been renegotiating. 

It's America first, comrade, so gtfo.  

[John Stone]

4 minutes ago, Deluge said:

Trump's been renegotiating. 

It's America first, comrade, so gtfo.  

Proverbs 16:18

 

[Deluge]

26 minutes ago, John Stone said:

Proverbs 16:18

James 4:7

[bush_cheney2004]

4 hours ago, John Stone said:

Suppose it could be debated why the majority of conflicts since 1945 didn’t seek Congressional approval – the reason is that there were legalities to these struggles that enabled the President to do an end-run around Congress. ……………. Legitimately.

Likely not an understatement to say Operation Epic Fury took the Nation / allies by surprise? Ya think??

No Address to the Nation

No Address to Congress (no Congressional approval – potential constitutional crisis)

No collaboration with allies (Israel notwithstanding)

The Iran-US conflict is a major international conflict.

Additional funding thru Congress is questionable.

 

No...it may appear that way to the general public, but it was obvious that Israel and the U.S. were threatening (even more) military force if negotiations were not successful.   Iran was already attacked in 2025 (Operation Midnight Hammer).   Subsequently, three carrier battle groups and forward tanker and fighter aircraft were positioned for Iran to see.   Allies were informed for overflight rights in case of conflict, just as before.

Again, many U.S. presidents have taken military actions without Congressional approval, if only to demonstrate Executive Branch prerogative to effect foreign policy with force as back up to failed diplomacy.

Quote

I think we can agree that with  Donald Trump's administration there is a dearth of  multilateralism, diplomacy and  international cooperation. 

to paraphrase, 'we don't need international support' / Trump

May those words not come  back to haunt

 

Sure, there has been less multilateralism, but it has not been totally absent.   State Dept wonks were still trying to get a deal.   Not many pitched a fit when Iranian weapons sites were bombed in 2025.    Plus Israel has its own agency as well...and is a close U.S. ally.

Obviously there are operational security reasons for not dragging out the decisions and planning in detail for "allies" to debate ad nauseam, delay, mitigate, etc.   The U.S. and Israel have developed targeting and strike packages for Iran going back many, many years...long before Trump.

[WestCanMan]

51 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Sure, there has been less multilateralism, but it has not been totally absent.   

Leftist politicians and their MSM lackeys and their cultist followers are belching IRGC propaganda and lies at full blast.

How can Starmie and Micronuts realistically help the US against Iran when they're busy shouting "RELIGION OF PEACE" 24/7? 

NATO is compromised. The US should get out. 

[bush_cheney2004]

9 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

How can Starmie and Micronuts realistically help the US against Iran when they're busy shouting "RELIGION OF PEACE" 24/7? 

NATO is compromised. The US should get out. 

 

I think you are right about NATO as it is presently constituted in a post Soviet Union world.  NATO expansion has directly led to recent Russian invasions and counter actions (Georgia, Crimea, Ukraine), exposing a severely underfunded and trained EU military.

This Iran War further reveals the limitations of NATO decision making and power projection even when faced with the obvious.   NATO is a victim of "peace dividend" success and growing complacency.    Bush, Obama, and Trump warned NATO years ago.