New poll shows majority of Canadians want NO new immigration.

[John Stone]

19 hours ago, CdnFox said:

We are so far away from that I don't even see a path back. Our fertility rate is something like 1.2 children right now for every woman. To be sustainable we need 2.2. That's just to maintain our population. So we would literally have to pretty close to double our current birth rate.

I just don't see how incentives are going to get us there. If anything is falling, we would probably still have to do a bunch of incentives just to make it not get worse

Were you thinking of anything in particular that might reverse that trend? You'd have to do some fast talking to get that many women having that many more children I think

Indeed - in a free, western and capitalist society families make decisions based on personal ambition,  economics  and  desire -   

Democracies  (political hacks) espouse strategies constantly to solve domestic problems - not out of any belief in a cure but to gain exposure and by extension remain incumbent or become incumbent.  

Ideas - let us dream in technicolor - ha! 

Childcare provisions,  financial assistance,  quality childcare services which enables parent to work. 

Other ideas might include, paid maternity leave, flex work hours, financial incentives to families, cultural campaign promoting families ........... and arguably the most important - accessible health care for the family. 

The rhetoric is easy - implementing any strategy takes time, $$, bipartisan political support and ................ time!  

Put all that aside for a moment - likely dreaming in technicolor anyway - all those suggestions take time to implement and immediate financing  

The short cure is immigration - but not just immigration - immigration that has a culture of having  large families. Trudeau strategy was to increase Kaneda's population to 100 million by 2040.  OMG, what a complete fool. 

When it comes to immigration the ideal in terms of numbers is a robust policy but an affordable policy. Ideal on steroids is robust vetting based on a point system - points awarded to the most ideal in terms of immigration -language, skills, political. 

Of course the ideal immigrant / refugee  are likely white European - imagine a political hack standing up and promoting that idea? 

Uncontrolled immigration (asylum???) crashing a border leads to distrust in immigration in general and cultural clash (ya think). 

This ain't Ellis Island, circa 1925 where huge numbers turned up, got off the boat and asked to cough, sht, jump up n down and ur good to go - without Gov. assistance. Today it takes $$$, acceptance and people that are willing to contribute immediately. 

Political hacks have fk'd it up (Biden / Trudeau) as they do, pursuing ideals that solve nothing and are terribly destructive. 

 

 

Edited February 7 by John Stone

[Barquentine]

19 hours ago, John Stone said:

Encourage families through various means to have more begets

That generally doesn't work in western countries because of the support systems required and push-back from business and fiscal hawks.

But it's worth a try.

"Not to try is to fail." Sackville High School

[John Stone]

............ arguably  Quebec has the best chance of retaining any degree of cultural identity and sustaining their numbers. 

Why  is that - because they draft fascist legislation. 

[John Stone]

1 minute ago, Barquentine said:

That generally doesn't work in western countries because of the support systems required and push-back from business and fiscal hawks.

But it's worth a try.

"Not to try is to fail." Sackville High School

...................... agreed, won't work in Western countries - just rhetoric! 

The average so-called Palestinian family has 9 children - 7 survive (IDF bombing notwithstanding). 

Kanada needs more so-called Palestinian immigrant families  - Inshallah! 

Problem solved - 'from the river to the sea'! 

 

 

[Barquentine]

1 minute ago, John Stone said:

The average so-called Palestinian family has 9 children - 7 survive (IDF bombing notwithstanding). 

Kanada needs more so-called Palestinian immigrant families  - Inshallah!

But once here, safer and and living in much better conditions, their birth rate would drop dramatically. That's the way of the world.

[John Stone]

2 minutes ago, Barquentine said:

But once here, safer and and living in much better conditions, their birth rate would drop dramatically. That's the way of the world.

Islam, akin to Catholicism,  promotes procreation - and the reason is the same for Islam as it is for the RC - it increases the ideology / faith.

Go forth and procreate. 

 

 

[I am Groot]

7 hours ago, CdnFox said:

We don't NEED immigration, but we DO need stability of population and given our current population compared to our landmass we really do need at least a small amount of growth. 

So if that's not coming from immigration, then where?

In the past, after heavy population declines, birth rates shot up. A decline at this time would be fortuitous, given AI is said to be eliminating all kinds of jobs, especially entry-level jobs that the young do. It would result in declining housing costs, though, which seniors don't want. But as housing costs decline and wages rise due to the scarcity of employees, young people would likely be able to have more kids.

Have you seen those robots doing somersaults in mid-air? It's not going to be long before they're taking over every repetitive job, every job that requires a strong back and little else. 

1 hour ago, John Stone said:

...................... agreed, won't work in Western countries - just rhetoric! 

The average so-called Palestinian family has 9 children - 7 survive (IDF bombing notwithstanding). 

Kanada needs more so-called Palestinian immigrant families  - Inshallah! 

Problem solved - 'from the river to the sea'! 

So you want to see the rest of us pushed into the sea, do you?

[I am Groot]

1 hour ago, John Stone said:

Of course the ideal immigrant / refugee  are likely white European - imagine a political hack standing up and promoting that idea? 

Immigration Canada did a study of the economic outcomes of immigrants from various countries a decade ago. And yes, the ideal immigrant is a European, preferably from northern Europe. The least economically successful immigrants are from MENAPT (Middle-East, North Africa, Pakistan and Turkey). 

Or more plainly, people from Muslim countries. 

 

Edited February 7 by I am Groot

[John Stone]

34 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Immigration Canada did a study of the economic outcomes of immigrants from various countries a decade ago. And yes, the ideal immigrant is a European, preferably from northern Europe. The least economically successful immigrants are from MENAPT (Middle-East, North Africa, Pakistan and Turkey). 

Or more plainly, people from Muslim countries. 

 

Edited February 7 by John Stone

[John Stone]

43 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

In the past, after heavy population declines, birth rates shot up. A decline at this time would be fortuitous, given AI is said to be eliminating all kinds of jobs, especially entry-level jobs that the young do. It would result in declining housing costs, though, which seniors don't want. But as housing costs decline and wages rise due to the scarcity of employees, young people would likely be able to have more kids.

Have you seen those robots doing somersaults in mid-air? It's not going to be long before they're taking over every repetitive job, every job that requires a strong back and little else. 

So you want to see the rest of us pushed into the sea, do you?

................. u saying that Canada, 2nd largest country in the World in terms of geo-mass can modernize, stabilize it's population and maintain a growing GDP because of said stabilization? 

Good trick - likely require some draconian laws and a robust border defense. 

I agree that A.I. will have a dramatic effect on employment - truth is no one knows to just what degree - likely white collar will feel the brunt, at least at first  - some Chicken Littles  are speculating that the result of A.I. will be  massive unemployment. By extension that means a large portion of the population unable to buy stuff in quantity - we are a consumer economy after all - and most importantly p/o  the Global economy. Global economic rules apply. 

'From the river to the sea' is the chant you will hear more often as the Palestinian diaspora grows. They will grow and become domestically political and militant - culture clash! 

[I am Groot]

8 minutes ago, John Stone said:

................. u saying that Canada, 2nd largest country in the World in terms of geo-mass can modernize, stabilize it's population and maintain a growing GDP because of said stabilization? 

Yes

8 minutes ago, John Stone said:

Good trick - likely require some draconian laws and a robust border defense. 

Something wrong with that?

8 minutes ago, John Stone said:

I agree that A.I. will have a dramatic effect on employment - truth is no one knows to just what degree - likely white collar will feel the brunt, at least at first  - some Chicken Littles  are speculating that the result of A.I. will be  massive unemployment. By extension that means a large portion of the population unable to buy stuff in quantity - we are a consumer economy after all - and most importantly p/o  the Global economy. Global economic rules apply. 

The Bank of Canada governor said just yesterday that AI is reducing entry-level jobs. It will continue to do so as it expands and is combined with automation, like those robots. Especially as battery storage power continues to improve.

8 minutes ago, John Stone said:

'From the river to the sea' is the chant you will hear more often as the Palestinian diaspora grows. They will grow and become domestically political and militant - culture clash! 

A good reason not to let it grow. Not to let the Muslim population grow. 

[CITIZEN_2015]

On 2/6/2026 at 12:38 PM, John Stone said:

 

Solution?

 

Accept only those adopted to advanced culture. Mainly from Europe. Put adoptability as the major criteria. Immigration system is flawed as is.

Edited February 7 by CITIZEN_2015

[CdnFox]

5 hours ago, John Stone said:

Indeed - in a free, western and capitalist society families make decisions based on personal ambition,  economics  and  desire -   

Democracies  (political hacks) espouse strategies constantly to solve domestic problems - not out of any belief in a cure but to gain exposure and by extension remain incumbent or become incumbent.  

Ideas - let us dream in technicolor - ha! 

Childcare provisions,  financial assistance,  quality childcare services which enables parent to work. 

Other ideas might include, paid maternity leave, flex work hours, financial incentives to families, cultural campaign promoting families ........... and arguably the most important - accessible health care for the family. 

The rhetoric is easy - implementing any strategy takes time, $$, bipartisan political support and ................ time!  

Put all that aside for a moment - likely dreaming in technicolor anyway - all those suggestions take time to implement and immediate financing  

The short cure is immigration - but not just immigration - immigration that has a culture of having  large families. Trudeau strategy was to increase Kaneda's population to 100 million by 2040.  OMG, what a complete fool. 

When it comes to immigration the ideal in terms of numbers is a robust policy but an affordable policy. Ideal on steroids is robust vetting based on a point system - points awarded to the most ideal in terms of immigration -language, skills, political. 

Of course the ideal immigrant / refugee  are likely white European - imagine a political hack standing up and promoting that idea? 

Uncontrolled immigration (asylum???) crashing a border leads to distrust in immigration in general and cultural clash (ya think). 

This ain't Ellis Island, circa 1925 where huge numbers turned up, got off the boat and asked to cough, sht, jump up n down and ur good to go - without Gov. assistance. Today it takes $$$, acceptance and people that are willing to contribute immediately. 

Political hacks have fk'd it up (Biden / Trudeau) as they do, pursuing ideals that solve nothing and are terribly destructive. 

 

 

It's obviously an honest answer to the question and detailed, so thanks for that, it is appreciated. 

The challenge with your solutions is that they cost money, and that money has to be raised by the state, which means taxes, which means people can't afford to get by on 1 income and so both people have to work, and they don't have time for children.

You see the vicious circle there. You could maybe find a way to stabilize things at their current low birth rate but one of the main reasons people don't have kids right now is financial 

And as to cultures who have lots of kids.... that was US!! My grandfather was the 10th kid, most of mom's generation had had 3 or more kids, my mom was the 'underproducer' with "just" two so to speak. 

But... nobody can afford to have kids in this environment right now and every dollar you spend in gov't money to fix that makes the situation worse because you have to take it away from families. 

I mean we have MASSIVE paid maternity leave right now! It's HUGE! Applies to females AND males.  And our situation is getting worse. 

For a woman to have 3 kids it means she's out of the work force for at LESAST 4 -6 years these days and most people can't afford that and THEN we talk about daycare and so on and the costs of that. 

If you want a higher birth rate the very first thing you'd HAVE to do is make it possible for the single income family to exist again. WIthout that... no kids.  Nobody has the time. 

[Barquentine]

23 hours ago, John Stone said:

Catholicism,  promotes procreation

Not so much...

Italy’s birth rate crisis is ‘irreversible’, say experts https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2025/01/13/zero-babies-born-in-358-italian-towns-amid-birth-crisis/

I heard there's a few Catholics in Italy.

 

[John Stone]

13 minutes ago, Barquentine said:

Not so much...

Italy’s birth rate crisis is ‘irreversible’, say experts https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2025/01/13/zero-babies-born-in-358-italian-towns-amid-birth-crisis/

I heard there's a few Catholics in Italy.

 

 

There is no question that Catholicism is the largest Christian denomination globally, but as you implied it as well as other Christian faiths are in  decline. 

Really, Catholicism is far beyond any single country........... it crossed borders, language, social class

Over 30 percent of the global population identifies as Muslim - and it is increasing -  larger families, immigration. 

The decline began  when people questioned the confessional .......and a nod to the Church'  male chauvinism. lol

 

[I am Groot]

1 hour ago, Barquentine said:

Not so much...

Italy’s birth rate crisis is ‘irreversible’, say experts https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2025/01/13/zero-babies-born-in-358-italian-towns-amid-birth-crisis/

I heard there's a few Catholics in Italy.

 

Oh bullshit. Customs and cultures change over time. Look how much ours has changed in the last 25-50 years.

[ExFlyer]

22 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Oh bullshit. Customs and cultures change over time. Look how much ours has changed in the last 25-50 years.

Are you saying the Pope says it's OK to use birth control??

[John Stone]

.............. arguably Catholicism and Democracy are on the same path...

Self inflicted destruction. 

[CITIZEN_2015]

7 hours ago, John Stone said:

 

Over 30 percent of the global population identifies as Muslim - and it is increasing -  larger families, immigration. 

 

Yikes. Soon I have to find myself another planet to live on. 

[John Stone]

15 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Yikes. Soon I have to find myself another planet to live on. 

Press 1 for Islam

[Barquentine]

21 hours ago, John Stone said:

Self inflicted destruction.

No idea how you come to that conclusion. The point is: birth-rate is inversely proportional to prosperity. The richer the country, the lower the birthrate. Very little to do with religion.

[Barquentine]

On 2/8/2026 at 9:18 AM, John Stone said:

Over 30 percent of the global population identifies as Muslim - and it is increasing -  larger families, immigration. 

AI:

"Muslim-majority countries are experiencing a significant, widespread decline in fertility rates, dropping from an average of 4.3 children per woman in 1990-1995 to roughly 2.9 by 2010-2015, with projections suggesting a further drop to 2.3 by 2030-2035. While still often above the global average, many nations—particularly in the Middle East—have seen dramatic decreases due to increased education and economic shifts." 

[Barquentine]

On 2/8/2026 at 10:11 AM, I am Groot said:

Oh bullshit. Customs and cultures change over time. Look how much ours has changed in the last 25-50 years.

Whoa - you're sending mixed messages here. You say Bullshit but then you agree with me. Birth rates are dropping in most countries over the last 25-40 years as more countries become more prosperous.

[I am Groot]

2 hours ago, Barquentine said:

Whoa - you're sending mixed messages here. You say Bullshit but then you agree with me. Birth rates are dropping in most countries over the last 25-40 years as more countries become more prosperous.

Canada is not more prosperous than it was. It is less prosperous than it was thanks to the Left.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, I am Groot said:

Canada is not more prosperous than it was. It is less prosperous than it was thanks to the Left.

The problem is that thanks to the left it now requires two incomes to get by

This started at the end of the '60s beginning of the '70s when liberal women demanded that their incomes be included in their husband's calculations for how much of a mortgage you could get. At the time all banks assumed that a woman who was married would become pregnant shortly and leave the workforce so her income was not calculated in the couples mortgage eligibility calculations

No fair enough, I can understand women saying that they should have their income included and they shouldn't be considered to just be baby factories. Quite understandable

. But the upside was that suddenly people could afford much larger mortgages. And guess what happened to housing price is throughout the seventies. That trend continued and pretty soon it wasn't just that you could get a bigger house with two incomes, in order to get any decent house you need it to incomes and nowadays to get literally anything bigger than an outhouse you need to incomes.

Add to that massive taxation, massive increases in the cost of compliance with local building codes, massive reduction in investment in business which has seriously repressed the job market and the value of the job market and insane taxes like the carbon tax and pretty soon you need to people earning as much as they can just to get by. No time for children

 

And here's the latest example, you know what would really help women get back into the workplace but still have children? Being able to work flexible hours from home. No need for daycare, they can take care of the kids and get them to school and be there afterwards if they can work from home and have some flexibility in their hours

Covid prove this. But what's the federal government doing? Doing everything it can to force people back to the workplace where women with children cannot afford to go.