The U.S. has a checkered history of racism and still struggles with it.

[blackbird]

The history of racism in the U.S. is not limited to the blacks that descended from the earlier history of slavery in the south, but it extended well into the 20th century affecting every other race and country.  This information from Wikipedia gives an idea of the problem.  It is true there are millions of evangelical Christian in America but that fact doesn't seem to do much to counter all the racism that exists.

"

Legislation

The Naturalization Act of 1906, required immigrants to learn English in order to become citizens. The Immigration Act of 1917 defined aliens with a long list of undesirables, including most Asians.^[36] The US had otherwise nearly open borders until the early 20th century,^[37][38][39] with only 1% rejected from 1890 to 1924, usually because they failed the mental or health exam.^[40][41] While immigration laws during those years were loose, laws limiting naturalization to those of "white" and "African" descent meant many other immigrants had difficulty acquiring citizenship. These regulations immediately created problems of interpretation – the contentious question of who was and was not "white" vexed even the officials charged with enforcing the law and led to significant criticism. The Union of American Hebrew Congregations noted that under the standing interpretation that Turks, Syrians, Palestinians and Jews were not white, "even Jesus of Nazareth himself" would be excluded from citizenship. As a result, judges and immigration officials often admitted and naturalized technically ineligible people as a form of protest against the laws.^[42][43]

The Immigration Act of 1924 established visa requirements and enacted quotas for immigrants from specific countries, especially with low quotas for Southern and Eastern Europeans.^[40] Especially it affected Italians and Jews.^[44] It also prohibited all Asians from immigrating.^[45] By 1940, administrative and legislative action had loosened racial restrictions on naturalization of immigrants, including a ruling that Mexicans were considered white for immigration and naturalization purposes, and a law permitting the naturalization of "descendants of races indigenous to the Western Hemisphere."^[43] The quotas were eased in the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952.

The decisive opening came in 1965, a year after the Civil Rights Act of 1964 outlawed discrimination based on race or national origin.^[46] The Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 abolished the quota system. The 1965 Act also established several new limits to which immigrants would be admissible for permanent residence in the United States.^[47] A 1990 act increased the annual immigrant limit to 675,000 per year.   unquote

Illegal immigration to the United States - Wikipedia

Racism could be a part of all the present attempts to arrest and deport millions of undocumented immigrants.  It is a fact that the system to become an American citizen is extremely difficult and there are huge hurdles that the average person would never have a chance of overcoming.  Only a select few from outside the country could ever become a U.S. citizen.

[User]

17 minutes ago, blackbird said:

It is true there are millions of evangelical Christian in America but that fact doesn't seem to do much to counter all the racism that exists.

What is all this racism that exists that you are talking about?

 

[Michael Hardner]

16 minutes ago, User said:

What is all this racism that exists that you are talking about?

 

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2025/05/20/how-much-discrimination-do-americans-say-groups-face-in-the-u-s/

Strong majorities of Americans say that these groups face discrimination:

Illegal immigrants, trans people, blacks, Muslims, Hispanics, Jews, LGBTQ.... in that order.

So it's not in question at all whether people thing this phenomenon exists.

[User]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2025/05/20/how-much-discrimination-do-americans-say-groups-face-in-the-u-s/

Strong majorities of Americans say that these groups face discrimination:

Illegal immigrants, trans people, blacks, Muslims, Hispanics, Jews, LGBTQ.... in that order.

So it's not in question at all whether people thing this phenomenon exists.

This is a perception about discrimination, not an example of actual racism. 

The question was never about if people think it exists. When the media is running this narrative non-stop and pushing white cop kills unarmed black man stories from the racial angle even when race was not a factor, driving many large scale racial unrest riots and violence going back to Ferguson, perception can be swayed. 

So... again, my question stands. What racism?

[Michael Hardner]

12 minutes ago, User said:

This is a perception about discrimination, not an example of actual racism. 

The question was never about if people think it exists. When the media is running this narrative non-stop and pushing white cop kills unarmed black man stories from the racial angle even when race was not a factor, driving many large scale racial unrest riots and violence going back to Ferguson, perception can be swayed. 

So... again, my question stands. What racism?

Yes, I agree with your first sentence.  The poll is based on a sample of ALL Americans though, I believe.

So by asking 'what racism' are you suggesting that there isn't racism ?  Or asking to start a dialogue on how we would assess the question.

Because I would trust a supermajority of Americans in their assessment, but maybe you don't.  In which case, the question would be to you: who or what do you trust to assess the current status ?

 

[User]

2 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Yes, I agree with your first sentence.  The poll is based on a sample of ALL Americans though, I believe.

So by asking 'what racism' are you suggesting that there isn't racism ?  Or asking to start a dialogue on how we would assess the question.

There is *always going to be racism, in that some random person or group of people like the KKK are going to be hateful and ignorant. 

However, I think the point of racism we are usually talking about is any Racism that is illegal or protected, in that the government and business can't engage in it. 

So, to the point of this thread, my question is, what Racism is being talked about when it is asserted:

"...to counter all the racism that exists."

What is "all this racism?"

 

5 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Because I would trust a supermajority of Americans in their assessment, but maybe you don't.  In which case, the question would be to you: who or what do you trust to assess the current status ?

What "assessment" are you trusting here? It is a vague poll about discrimination. 

It is not that I don't trust Americans, its that I don't agree with your use of this poll in this context, as I already outlined my resons for. 

 

[blackbird]

"

In 2015, Julio, a Black Dominican immigrant living in New York City, was stopped by police for “walking suspiciously.” It was the tail end of the stop and frisk era, the notoriously racist policing strategy that subjected Black people to a vastly disproportionate percentage of police stops in the city.

Julio was 18 years old and sold water, candy, and T-shirts to earn extra money for his family. He was attending Bronx Community College in the hope of becoming a medical assistant. (Julio’s name has been changed in this story to protect his identity.) One day, he noticed a black car following him, and it turned out to be the police. “The officer said that I looked nervous, but why wouldn’t I?” he said. “Why wouldn’t I be nervous [when] there is a black vehicle following me slowly?” The police stopped and searched Julio and discovered an unregistered gun, which he had started carrying after being robbed at gunpoint near his Bronx home. He was sentenced to five years in prison.

Hoping to turn his life around upon release, Julio worked for Corcraft, New York State’s prison labor manufacturing division, and took all available education courses while incarcerated. “I did everything that was possible to make it home to my family,” he said. “I wasn’t making trouble; I learned my lesson.” That work paid off. After four-and-a-half years, he earned early release.

But instead of being released at the completion of his sentence, Julio was immediately swept up by U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) and placed in immigration detention. Even though he was a green card holder with permanent resident status, New York State officials contacted ICE, triggering deportation proceedings and his transfer to immigration detention.

“I said, ‘Oh my God, this can’t be true,’” said Julio, who left the Dominican Republic at age eight. “Imagine doing your whole time and they put you in another cell.”

Unable to afford an attorney who could argue for his release, Julio was held in a prison-like detention center. Human rights abuses abound in U.S. immigration detention, according to the federal government’s own reports. Justifications for the practice of detention fall flat, as it is not needed to ensure that people appear in immigration court, nor does it deter migration.

Julio described the detention facility as worse than prison. “You were in a cell with no fresh air most of your time; you only get an hour to go out,” he said. “The rec area was straight metal, like if you [were] in a cage like a dog.”

A broken system

Julio’s story shows the importance of transforming an immigration system that is rooted xenophobia and racism, and of breaking its ties to an equally racist and unjust criminal legal system. Reforms that could help fix this broken system include ending mandatory detention, and rolling back harmful laws that linked the criminal legal and immigration systems. The United States should also provide universal representation to all people facing deportation.

In the 1990s, laws like the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigration Responsibility Act (IIRIRA) made immigrants subject to detention and deportation if convicted of a wide range of infractions, including minor crimes. As a result, hundreds of thousands of long-time U.S. residents have been separated from their families and exiled from their homes for even minor transgressions, like drug possession and shoplifting.

IIRIRA and the changes it brought to an immigration system which criminalizes immigrants has particularly harmed Black immigrants, who are overpoliced. The same prejudices that pervade the criminal legal system extend to the immigration system. Just as Black people are more likely than white people to be targeted by police, research suggests that Black immigrants are also disproportionately vulnerable to immigration enforcement.

Attorneys can help people who are facing deportation, but immigrants face unique obstacles to retaining counsel. Unlike in criminal court, where the Sixth Amendment guarantees anyone convicted of a crime the right to legal representation, people facing deportation in immigration court are only guaranteed representation if they can afford a lawyer themselves. Most cannot. There are nearly 2.4 million cases pending in immigration court, in which more than 1.4 million people lack legal representation. Adults, families, and, sometimes, even children are forced to appear alone in court, defending themselves against trained government attorneys. The daunting complexity of immigration law stacks the odds against them, particularly for immigrants who are unfamiliar with speaking English."

The Immigration System is Racist; Solutions Exist | Vera Institute

 

[User]

No answers... no comments... more spam. 

[Michael Hardner]

23 minutes ago, User said:

There is *always going to be racism, in that some random person or group of people like the KKK are going to be hateful and ignorant. 

However, I think the point of racism we are usually talking about is any Racism that is illegal or protected, in that the government and business can't engage in it. 

So, to the point of this thread, my question is, what Racism is being talked about when it is asserted:

"...to counter all the racism that exists."

What is "all this racism?"

 

What "assessment" are you trusting here? It is a vague poll about discrimination. 

It is not that I don't trust Americans, its that I don't agree with your use of this poll in this context, as I already outlined my resons for. 

 

The assessment is implied by your response: you say that the OP is correct, so I get that, and then ask about institutional racism such as illegal/protected.  

You are asking that question but not denying it.  I used the poll in case you were denying the obvious.

I am informed and have nothing to add to your query. 

[User]

3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

The assessment is implied by your response:

You were the one who used assessment... you have yet to explain what you mean as this was not an "assessment" in any real sense of the word, it is a poll. 

Show me the "assessments" used by every member of that poll to get to their answer. That is my point. You can't. So, it has nothing to do with my trusting Americans assessment or not as you brought up. 

 

 

 

 

[Michael Hardner]

Just now, User said:

You were the one who used assessment... you have yet to explain what you mean as this was not an "assessment" in any real sense of the word, it is a poll. 

Show me the "assessments" used by every member of that poll to get to their answer. That is my point. You can't. So, it has nothing to do with my trusting Americans assessment or not as you brought up. 

I don't need to explain what a word means.  Furthermore, now that I understand better what you are saying we can move on.

Discussions can end.

I know you want it to continue, but there's nowhere for it to go.  Sorry.

[Deluge]

1 hour ago, blackbird said:

The history of racism in the U.S. is not limited to the blacks that descended from the earlier history of slavery in the south, but it extended well into the 20th century affecting every other race and country.  This information from Wikipedia gives an idea of the problem.  It is true there are millions of evangelical Christian in America but that fact doesn't seem to do much to counter all the racism that exists.

"

Legislation

The Naturalization Act of 1906, required immigrants to learn English in order to become citizens. The Immigration Act of 1917 defined aliens with a long list of undesirables, including most Asians.^[36] The US had otherwise nearly open borders until the early 20th century,^[37][38][39] with only 1% rejected from 1890 to 1924, usually because they failed the mental or health exam.^[40][41] While immigration laws during those years were loose, laws limiting naturalization to those of "white" and "African" descent meant many other immigrants had difficulty acquiring citizenship. These regulations immediately created problems of interpretation – the contentious question of who was and was not "white" vexed even the officials charged with enforcing the law and led to significant criticism. The Union of American Hebrew Congregations noted that under the standing interpretation that Turks, Syrians, Palestinians and Jews were not white, "even Jesus of Nazareth himself" would be excluded from citizenship. As a result, judges and immigration officials often admitted and naturalized technically ineligible people as a form of protest against the laws.^[42][43]

The Immigration Act of 1924 established visa requirements and enacted quotas for immigrants from specific countries, especially with low quotas for Southern and Eastern Europeans.^[40] Especially it affected Italians and Jews.^[44] It also prohibited all Asians from immigrating.^[45] By 1940, administrative and legislative action had loosened racial restrictions on naturalization of immigrants, including a ruling that Mexicans were considered white for immigration and naturalization purposes, and a law permitting the naturalization of "descendants of races indigenous to the Western Hemisphere."^[43] The quotas were eased in the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952.

The decisive opening came in 1965, a year after the Civil Rights Act of 1964 outlawed discrimination based on race or national origin.^[46] The Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 abolished the quota system. The 1965 Act also established several new limits to which immigrants would be admissible for permanent residence in the United States.^[47] A 1990 act increased the annual immigrant limit to 675,000 per year.   unquote

Illegal immigration to the United States - Wikipedia

Racism could be a part of all the present attempts to arrest and deport millions of undocumented immigrants.  It is a fact that the system to become an American citizen is extremely difficult and there are huge hurdles that the average person would never have a chance of overcoming.  Only a select few from outside the country could ever become a U.S. citizen.

blackbird wants white genocide. It's the only way he can be sure that racism doesn't exist in America. 

[Deluge]

1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said:

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2025/05/20/how-much-discrimination-do-americans-say-groups-face-in-the-u-s/

Strong majorities of Americans say that these groups face discrimination:

Illegal immigrants, trans people, blacks, Muslims, Hispanics, Jews, LGBTQ.... in that order.

So it's not in question at all whether people thing this phenomenon exists.

So what's your point, Mike? Do you agree with that? 

[blackbird]

"Trump’s executive orders are pulling U.S. immigration control back to its roots, absolute and racial. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit pushed back against this interpretation, affirming the reviewability of the seven-country ban. But the decisions made during the Chinese exclusion era are likely to protect many of the president’s other orders from judicial review. That is, unless we overturn the settler mentality of U.S. immigration control."

America’s mass deportation system is rooted in racism

[Michael Hardner]

25 minutes ago, Deluge said:

So what's your point, Mike? Do you agree with that? 

I covered my point in my exchange with user.

Do I agree with this ?  Of course.  It's pretty non-controversial as it is, which User pointed out.  The question they asked is 'what racism' ?

Here's the point, from the thread title: The U.S. has a checkered history of racism and still struggles with it.

[Deluge]

2 minutes ago, blackbird said:

"Trump’s executive orders are pulling U.S. immigration control back to its roots, absolute and racial. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit pushed back against this interpretation, affirming the reviewability of the seven-country ban. But the decisions made during the Chinese exclusion era are likely to protect many of the president’s other orders from judicial review. That is, unless we overturn the settler mentality of U.S. immigration control."

America’s mass deportation system is rooted in racism

Wrong. 

America's mass deportation system is rooted in erasing Biden's open borders policies. 

We can't have a system based on Rule of Law, when democrats are constantly fighting against it.  

[Nationalist]

3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

I covered my point in my exchange with user.

Do I agree with this ?  Of course.  It's pretty non-controversial as it is, which User pointed out.  The question they asked is 'what racism' ?

Here's the point, from the thread title: The U.S. has a checkered history of racism and still struggles with it.

And?

Do you think you can do something about it?

Meanwhile...IT jobs are still being offshored to India.

Yet that doesn't seem to bother you in the slightest.

Edited yesterday at 04:25 PM by Nationalist

[blackbird]

34 minutes ago, Deluge said:

blackbird wants white genocide.

So you're afraid the legal and the undocumented migrants from south and central America are going to wipe out the white people?  

Edited yesterday at 04:26 PM by blackbird

[Deluge]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

I covered my point in my exchange with user.

Do I agree with this ?  Of course.  It's pretty non-controversial as it is, which User pointed out.  The question they asked is 'what racism' ?

Here's the point, from the thread title: The U.S. has a checkered history of racism and still struggles with it.

Are you trying to say that since the US was settled by whites and is still predominantly white that we can't maintain our racial heritage? Should we hold other nations to the same standard? Using your thinking, Africa is way too black and it needs a lot more white people in it. Same for India and China. 

Do you see how stupid your thinking is? 

[Deluge]

5 minutes ago, blackbird said:

So you're afraid the legal and the undocumented migrants from south and central America are going to wipe out the white people?  

No, I'm afraid of our borders being overrun. Any sane person would say the same thing. 

I want immigration to be just that: immigration. I don't want ILLEGAL immigration, because it's ILLEGAL. 

Get it? 

[Deluge]

There is no systemic racism in this country. At least not the systemic racism the leftoids squawk about it. 

There has been, however, systemic racism against whites. It has and still may be happening in certain organizations and groups like Disney, but thanks to a true American president, that shit is dissipating. 

[User]

56 minutes ago, blackbird said:

America’s mass deportation system is rooted in racism

Spamming the forum with other peoples crap opinions... just more spam. 

[blackbird]

"

16 minutes ago, Deluge said:

There is no systemic racism in this country.

Facts speak for themselves.

"In 1954, the U.S. government removed hundreds of thousands of persons of Mexican ancestry from the country in an initiative officially known as “Operation Wetback.”  

That racism, unfortunately, is not simply just a part of history. Donald Trump kicked off his successful 2016 presidential campaign by referring to Mexican immigrants as “criminals” and “rapists.” As president, he crudely said the United States should not allow noncitizens from “shithole” countries such as Haiti and El Salvador to remain in the United States, issued three versions of the Muslim ban, put in place a policy of separating Central American parents and children and much more.    

Although President Trump’s racial vitriol was unlike that of any other modern president, others pursued policies similar to his. More than 90 percent of the record 400,000-plus noncitizens removed from the country during the Obama years were from Latin America. It was under President Biden’s watch that Haitian migrants on the U.S./Mexico border were chased on horseback by Border Patrol officers and immediately returned to Haiti. And Biden has continued Title 42 mass expulsions of migrants from the Trump era, a decision that led former Yale Law Dean Harold Koh to resign from a post in the State Department. 

Moreover, the ordinary operation of the U.S. immigration removal system reflects no less than systemic racism. The Supreme Court has held that “Mexican appearance” may be considered by Border Patrol officers in making immigration stops, a move that has contributed to racial profiling in ordinary immigration enforcement. Moreover, police reliance on racial profiling of Blacks and Latinos in routine criminal law enforcement leads to disparate arrests of Black and Latino immigrants. Racial profiling in turn feeds noncitizens of color directly into the immigration removal system. It, therefore, should be no surprise that year in and year out Latinos and Blacks are severely overrepresented in the noncitizens removed from the United States.  

Resolution 610 was one of several ABA resolutions approved relating to immigration. Resolution 609 urged that the U.S. asylum system be reformed to afford persons seeking protection from persecution or torture more transparency, due process of law, access to counsel and full and fair adjudication of any claims to relief. It also calls for the end of the use of Title 42 to block and expel asylum-seekers at the U.S. border. Resolution 608 advocates for steps to facilitate the provision of speedy relief to Afghan refugees.    

The three resolutions aim to bring a semblance of racial justice to U.S. immigration law and its enforcement. Recognition of systemic racism in the immigration system by lawyers as a group — not just immigration lawyers — is a tremendous step forward.  

As part of the overall agenda to eliminate systemic racism from U.S. social life, we as a nation must strive to do the same in immigration enforcement.  

Kevin R. Johnson is dean and Mabie/Apallas professor of Public Interest Law and Chicanx Studies at UC Davis School of Law. He is the author of Systemic Racism in the U.S. Immigration Laws 97 Indiana Law Journal (forthcoming 2022). Karla McKanders is a Clinical professor of Law at Vanderbilt Law School. "

Systemic racism is rooted in immigration laws — it can no longer be ignored

 

 

Just now, User said:

Spamming the forum with other peoples crap opinions... just more spam. 

I post well documented articles.  You prefer lies and no backing up any claims.  Nothing you say is backed up with supporting material.

[User]

1 minute ago, blackbird said:

Facts speak for themselves.

OK, what facts do you have for today?

Stop with the spam. 

2 minutes ago, blackbird said:

I post well documented articles.  You prefer lies and no backing up any claims.  Nothing you say is backed up with supporting material.

Speaking of lies... you ran away from yours in the other thread again. 

No, you linked to some crappy website. It is just spam. 

[blackbird]

Just now, User said:

OK, what facts do you have for today?

Stop with the spam. 

The facts are in the articles which you refuse to read.  So why do you bother participating in the forum?