Official: NDP will not be granted official party status. Smart Move or Huge Mistake?

[CdnFox]

NDP will not be granted official party status: government House leader

So the NDP won't be getting official party status, and that decision is not terribly hard to defend. There is a minimum number of seats for a reason, they're not even close.

But was it the smart decision? The liberals COULD have given it to them if they'd wanted. 

The argument for not doing so is that the liberals only won because they stole the NDP vote. Without that it would have been a cpc majority. Giving the NDP official status means they get MORE time in question period, more committees more money and they'll have an easier time to rebuild and get their name out there to the public. And that might not go well for the libs who are going to need those votes next election. The CPC base is now about 40 percent...  the libs are no where near that.

BUT.....  and here's the onion....   NOW the ndp will be MUCH MORE MOTIVATED to call an election!

If they'd had party status and gotten their money back and had the perks, they might have been happy with taking the next 3 or 4 years  to rebuild and get their act together in a more meaningful fashion. 

But now... whomever becomes leader will be aching to have that party status back.  Even if they have to foucs all their powers on just 20 ridings that will flip their way, and win maybe 15 of them, that would see them back in the game with a base they could build on.  The moment they think they can pull that off they're likely to consider an election. It would be huge to get party status back. 

The liberals may have bought themselves an earlier election by denying them status, but MAYBE they'll keep some of that ndp vote?

Good move? Bad move? Thoughts?

 

[Legato]

Bad move and rather petty.

Jaggers caused the NDP's plating to get badly worn. Now they'll come back galvanised with a shiny new coat.

[CdnFox]

10 minutes ago, Legato said:

Bad move and rather petty.

Jaggers caused the NDP's plating to get badly worn. Now they'll come back galvanised with a shiny new coat.

And I suspect they'll be itching for a fight sooner rather than later once they're confident they're going to be over 12 seats. It's going to be a lot harder to do a deal with them as soon as they have their act together

[Politics1990]

didnt hit 12 seats so not surprised but would of been nice to see liberals give it to them since the ndp did keep them in power lol

[Legato]

12 minutes ago, Politics1990 said:

didnt hit 12 seats so not surprised but would of been nice to see liberals give it to them since the ndp did keep them in power lol

True.

The Liberal motto "what's yours is mine but what's mine's my own".

[Nefarious Banana]

The voters have spoken . . . 

[CdnFox]

43 minutes ago, Politics1990 said:

didnt hit 12 seats so not surprised but would of been nice to see liberals give it to them since the ndp did keep them in power lol

LOL   well obviously the decision was political -  do we give them a bigger stage and hope that makes them too comfortable to call an election soon, or do we shut them up and hope to keep their voters for next time. 

in some ways to me it is an indication that carney may intend to call an election sooner rather than later if possible.

[Moonlight Graham]

The NDP, Bloc, and Greens all lost seats.  Minorities typically last less than 2 years, so this probably won't be like 2021-2025 for the Liberals.

However, the NDP do still hold the balance of power in Parliament.  The Liberals need the NDP or Bloc to pass anything.  If a CPC win looks likely the NDP may not bring down the government.

[CdnFox]

3 minutes ago, Moonlight Graham said:

The NDP, Bloc, and Greens all lost seats.  Minorities typically last less than 2 years, so this probably won't be like 2021-2025 for the Liberals.

However, the NDP do still hold the balance of power in Parliament.  The Liberals need the NDP or Bloc to pass anything.  If a CPC win looks likely the NDP may not bring down the government.

The ndp doesn't really hold the balance of power at all. 

You hold the balance of power when you're necessary to get things done. ANY other party can agree with the libs to pass legislation.  the libs could put bill after bill forward and as long as it's got something for the bloc or the cpc the ndp can't do a thing to stop it. 

About the only 'power' they hold is that it will require ALL parties currently to bring  the gov't down (other than the libs who can do it without help if they think it's time to go to an election). That's not nothing, but it's not the balance of power. Every party has that

And I think that the NDP are going to be very aware that what happened to them was a result of them constantly propping up the liberals. If they want to get anywhere they have to be willing to stand up to the liberals as much as the conservatives. If they hold off because they don't want to give the conservatives a win they'll be lucky to get two seats next election and I think they figured that out.

For the NDP to survive they have to get back to official party status as soon as possible. They're not going to do that by hiding behind the liberals skirts

[Benz]

It is the Karma.

What did NDP for the Liberals?

In exchange for just one program, NDP supported the Liberals like if they were a majority. This is a huge gift.

How do the people appreciate it? They voted Liberals since NDP became so irrelevant. That is lesson number one.

Now that the Liberals get more powerful and NDP miserable, how do the Liberals thank NDP for such loyalty? By spitting on them and refuse them the official party status. That is lesson number two.

 

Do the NDP learn the lesson this time? We'll see. As soon as the NDP will get its new leader, it should refuse to support ALL motions of confidence toward to Liberals. They have nothing to lose anyway at this point. But if they keep supporting the Liberals, then it means they learn nothing.

They get what they deserve.

[WestCanMan]

23 hours ago, CdnFox said:

NDP will not be granted official party status: government House leader

So the NDP won't be getting official party status, and that decision is not terribly hard to defend. There is a minimum number of seats for a reason, they're not even close.

But was it the smart decision? The liberals COULD have given it to them if they'd wanted. 

The argument for not doing so is that the liberals only won because they stole the NDP vote. Without that it would have been a cpc majority. Giving the NDP official status means they get MORE time in question period, more committees more money and they'll have an easier time to rebuild and get their name out there to the public. And that might not go well for the libs who are going to need those votes next election. The CPC base is now about 40 percent...  the libs are no where near that.

BUT.....  and here's the onion....   NOW the ndp will be MUCH MORE MOTIVATED to call an election!

If they'd had party status and gotten their money back and had the perks, they might have been happy with taking the next 3 or 4 years  to rebuild and get their act together in a more meaningful fashion. 

But now... whomever becomes leader will be aching to have that party status back.  Even if they have to foucs all their powers on just 20 ridings that will flip their way, and win maybe 15 of them, that would see them back in the game with a base they could build on.  The moment they think they can pull that off they're likely to consider an election. It would be huge to get party status back. 

The liberals may have bought themselves an earlier election by denying them status, but MAYBE they'll keep some of that ndp vote?

Good move? Bad move? Thoughts?

 

That's a very good post imo. The Libs made a tough call there, and took a big chance.

Whether this results in the Libs finally locking down the sub-70-IQ voters that the NDP poach from them in every election, on a permanent basis, or it completely backfires, resulting in a quick election while the Libs are failing miserably in the public eye, depends on the success of the Carney gov't.  

And the Carney gov't would have a tough time "winning" for Canadians right now even if they were trying their hardest, because Trump is on a mission and he's winning trade deals all over the planet right now, but winning for Canadians isn't on the Lib agenda anyways. It wasn't for the last ten years and that isn't gonna suddenly change in 2025, with all the same bad actors in place.

 So the Carney gov't will fail Canadians desperately, it's just a matter of whether or not the NDP has the ba11s to call him out on it all.

This is a rare opportunity for the NDP to put the truth in Canadians' faces whether the CBC wants to allow them to do it or not, because whatever the NDP say is big news right now. 

If Carney is smart, he will try to find a way to serve Quebec without alienating the Ontario voters, so that he doesn't rely 100% on the NDP... Can you imagine if the Libs managed to kneecap the Bloc in this election cycle, the same way they did the NDP in the last one? 

At this moment, there are so many wild changes possible right now that it is unlike any other time in Canadian election history.

Maybe Carney will fail and the NDP will make huge noise about it, and spring back to life...

Maybe the NDP will make themselves even more irrelevant, to the point where they don't even exist anymore.

Maybe Carney will kowtow to Quebec without alienating Ontarians, and the NDP and Bloc will both be gone, leaving the CPC to battle the Libs while they fully own the east... 

Will another Quebec-slave gov't finally push western separation over the top at that point? 

 

I honestly think Carney's only chance is more "divine intervention" from Trump (I'm hearing left4rd heads explode right now and I LOVE it). He installed this LPOC gov't, and he can give them a massive win in Ontario by easing back on his auto industry demands, or he can grind Ontarians into the dust, leaving the LPOC gov't in a hopeless position where our country doesn't stand a chance no matter what our gov't does. 

I know for a fact that Canada would have been better off facing trump with Poilievre at the helm, because he never would have looked like a whipped dog in the oval office, with nothing intelligent to say in our defence, but at the same time he woulda been fighting a losing battle against Trump, because the power imbalance vs the US is so massive. There's a good chance that the CPC would fail right now too, and again, it's all up to Trump. 

Is all this uncertainty going to be good for our economy? 😂 No one invests in trying times like this. Just like the energy sector took a gigantic hit when Trudeau was elected, the auto industry is now being squashed under Carney. It looks like Honda and Toyota are caving to Trump, and ramping down auto production in Canada and Mexico, and putting those jobs in the US. 

If NA was a casino right now, Carney's nickname would be Snakeyes and Trump would be piling up a mound of chips like no one has ever seen before. 

Edited Tuesday at 04:24 PM by WestCanMan

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, Benz said:

It is the Karma.

What did NDP for the Liberals?

In exchange for just one program, NDP supported the Liberals like if they were a majority. This is a huge gift.

How do the people appreciate it? They voted Liberals since NDP became so irrelevant. That is lesson number one.

Now that the Liberals get more powerful and NDP miserable, how do the Liberals thank NDP for such loyalty? By spitting on them and refuse them the official party status. That is lesson number two.

 

Do the NDP learn the lesson this time? We'll see. As soon as the NDP will get its new leader, it should refuse to support ALL motions of confidence toward to Liberals. They have nothing to lose anyway at this point. But if they keep supporting the Liberals, then it means they learn nothing.

They get what they deserve.

I agree with the vast majority of that but they don't want to just automatically say 'no' when the libs say 'yes'.   They need to be more relevant than that.  They have to show they matter and that their existence isn't' just "pro" or "anti" liberal. 

ANd there's the practical.  The way elections work is that political parties get back 3/4 or what they spend or there abouts in refunds from the gov't.  SO they go into debt to finance campaigns.  But the ndp didn't make 'official party' so they're not getting their money back. They are so broke it's ridiculous. And they have only 8 percent support in the latest polls, donations are going to be hard to come by. 

SO the next leader is going to have to focus at least in part on raising money or they won't be able to fight ANY election campaign. They can't afford to go to an election too soon.  So they'll have to be a LITTLE careful about how they vote. 

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

I agree with the vast majority of that but they don't want to just automatically say 'no' when the libs say 'yes'.   They need to be more relevant than that.  They have to show they matter and that their existence isn't' just "pro" or "anti" liberal. 

ANd there's the practical.  The way elections work is that political parties get back 3/4 or what they spend or there abouts in refunds from the gov't.  SO they go into debt to finance campaigns.  But the ndp didn't make 'official party' so they're not getting their money back. They are so broke it's ridiculous. And they have only 8 percent support in the latest polls, donations are going to be hard to come by. 

SO the next leader is going to have to focus at least in part on raising money or they won't be able to fight ANY election campaign. They can't afford to go to an election too soon.  So they'll have to be a LITTLE careful about how they vote. 

LOL. If only that was the Libs too.