Rethink: What does Trump want?

CrakHoBarbie · April 4

14 hours ago, August1991 said:

Trump is not stupid. He wants a better world for Americans.

What's his game?

"It is in the interest of the tyrant to make his subjects poor. A people so occupied with their daily tasks have no time for plotting"

-Aristotle

CdnFox · April 4

1 hour ago, CrakHoBarbie said:

"It is in the interest of the tyrant to make his subjects poor. A people so occupied with their daily tasks have no time for plotting"

-Aristotle

Now now, there's no need to be comparing him to democrats.

I think it's pretty obvious that he actually does want America to succeed and be wealthy and more importantly for them to credit him with that result.

I think he is simply wrong. He thinks this is going to work and it won't. It's as simple as that. There's no need to credit him with any 4D chess moves. He wants America to be great again, he wants everyone to think he's responsible for making it great again, his plan will not make America great again. That's where we are

CrakHoBarbie · April 4

14 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

I think it's pretty obvious that he actually does want America to succeed and be wealthy and more importantly for them to credit him with that result.

I don't normally respond to your garbage posts.

But it's way past time for you to come to the realization that Donald is actively trying to harm the planet.

And he's doing it so that he, and his oligarch buddies profit.

You've been bending over forwards and backwards for this charlatan for long time.

He's not your friend.

He's not doing this for the good of the planet.

He's nothing more than another power mad piece of shite.

I implore you to wake the f___ up

Michael Hardner · April 4

15 hours ago, August1991 said:

Trump is not stupid.

I'm going to quietly wait for you to admit you were wrong on this statement.

CdnFox · April 4

2 hours ago, CrakHoBarbie said:

I don't normally respond to your garbage posts.

I know. I intimidate the hell out of you most lefties feel that way. Your fear is understandable. It's natural for your type to find intelligence threatening.

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But it's way past time for you to come to the realization that Donald is actively trying to harm the planet.

Because he's an evil supervillain or something? Give me a break. The evidence doesn't support that. And i'm a firm believer in the idea that you should not attribute to malice what can easily be explained by incomptenece.

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And he's doing it so that he, and his oligarch buddies profit.

Crashing the economy doesn't achieve that goal. So the final answer is the same either way, his plans won't do what he wants.

His buddies are already getting poorer. Musk has lost billions. Most of the others he deals with are likewise getting clobbered in the stock crash. A recession will hurt all of their businesses.

So there's no logic to your argument other than you just want to think the worst of him

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You've been bending over forwards and backwards for this charlatan for long time.

Name one example.

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He's not your friend.

I've never claimed he was.

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He's not doing this for the good of the planet.

He thinks he is, or the good of the US at least.

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He's nothing more than another power mad piece of shite.

IF only life were that simple.

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I implore you to wake the f___ up

Listen kid....

I get that you're driven primarily by hatred and bigotry. And that colours your thinking AND your listening. But pay attention.

I have frequently critisized trump both in the lead up to the election, during the election, and after the election. I have never pretended he is some great guy. And i also recognize the positive aspects of his time in office both first and current and i do believe some of his ideas have great merit, even if the execution does not.

I don't adore or worship the guy, and i don't hate or dispise the guy. I see him with eyes wide open for what he is and isn't.

In other words, i'm already quite awake, i'm just not woke.

Trump is a narcissistic person who genuinely wants everyone to think he's the very best. He wants america to be the best it can be and for everyone to believe the reason it got that way was because HE is so great and he did it

He very clearly thinks that tariffing the world will drive business back to the usa. He believes he will suffer a very short 'transition' and then suddenly there will be tonnes of the best jobs flooding into the country. He thinks in just 6 months or a year it will be obvious he's a genus and all will praise him.

He is wrong, unless he radically changes course within about a month or so the country and probably the world will be plunged into a recession and he will be the goat they blame. But that's not what he thinks,

Set your hatred aside. It doesn't do you any good.

August1991 · April 6

On 4/4/2025 at 5:07 PM, CdnFox said:

..

There's no need to credit him with any 4D chess moves. He wants America to be great again, he wants everyone to think he's responsible for making it great again, his plan will not make America great again. That's where we are

I tend to agree.

August1991 · April 6

On 4/4/2025 at 5:36 PM, Michael Hardner said:

I'm going to quietly wait for you to admit you were wrong on this statement.

Many years ago, I had a friend who worked in a restaurant in Toronto parking cars. Valet service.

He once parked Mel Lastman's car. So, I asked? Answer: "It was a Rolls."

====

I have struggled to understand Donald Trump. Mel Lastman is my best answer.

CdnFox · April 6

34 minutes ago, August1991 said:

He once parked Mel Lastman's car. So, I asked? Answer: "It was a Rolls."

Of COURSE it rolls!! Wouldn't be much of a car if it couldn't roll, would it?!?!

Oh wait, i see what you mean now.....

August1991 · April 6

10 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Of COURSE it rolls!! Wouldn't be much of a car if it couldn't roll, would it?!?!

Oh wait, i see what you mean now.....

For Anglos in Ontario, to understand Trump, he is Mel Lastman.

For Nflanders, he is Joey Smallwood.

For Albertans, Trump is a Manning.

====

He's no Duplessis. And certainly no Hitler, Mussolini.

Michael Hardner · April 6

13 hours ago, August1991 said:

Many years ago, I had a friend who worked in a restaurant in Toronto parking cars. Valet service.

He once parked Mel Lastman's car. So, I asked? Answer: "It was a Rolls."

====

I have struggled to understand Donald Trump. Mel Lastman is my best answer.

Please do update me on your thinking, I appreciate that.

SpankyMcFarland · April 6

The way this policy was implemented couldn’t have been more primitive. Even the basic PR was disastrous. The countries tariffed weren’t listed in any easy order but were hurriedly lumped together. There was no need to tariff every state in the world they could find on Wikipedia and omitting Russia etc. instead of including them with existing tariffs was a political gaffe which was clearly going to attract attention. There was no serious consideration of the tariff barriers faced by the US abroad or its ability to produce the products tariffed in the US. Is America going to become a behemoth in the vanilla industry now that it has hit Madagascar with crippling tariffs? The sight of massively tariffing some of the poorest countries in the world robbed the US of what little prestige it has left. What a gift for China.

Edited April 6 by SpankyMcFarland

SpankyMcFarland · April 6

The cult members who think this is just a negotiating tactic and part of some ingenious 4D Trump plan miss the point. Even if this ill-considered nonsense was removed tomorrow, America’s image as a serious country, the home of the world’s reserve currency, has been seriously compromised. Investors won’t think of it quite the same again.

Again, on basic messaging, these clowns can’t come up with the same story because even Trump doesn't know what he’s going to do next:

https://thehill.com/homenews/5234671-brooke-rollins-dodges-questions-trump-tariffs/

Edited April 6 by SpankyMcFarland

CdnFox · April 6

3 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Again, on basic messaging, these clowns can’t come up with the same story because even Trump doesn't know what he’s going to do next:

Setting your 'orange rage' aside for the moment, this is one of the biggest problems with his current tactics regardless of their intent. He has created the firm and unshakeable impression that there is no stability.

If he had just come out earlier and said "we will be imposing the following tariffs, this is our intent and goal, we will be adjusting our policy over time to meet that goal as necessary but this is what's happening" and then STUCK with it, then at least businesses would say "we know what we're dealing with, lets plan".

But intead it's "we're taxing canada and mexico feb 1. No, it's march 1. And its 25 percent on everything. Maybe. Including all cars made in Canada. Well.... only those parts made in canada. Maybe. No actually it's the whole world AND their damn penguins.. Except russia. Maybe. And england gets ... (rolls 2d10) 40 percent tariffs!! That wasn't your worst roll england, well done.

Now no matter what his goal is, all business and investors will think about is "pull back, we have no idea what's going to happen. " THeir money will come out of the market and go somewhere safe for now and that is an instant recipe for a recession. And no Manufacturing jobs will be moving ANYWHERE while that's happening.

I'm afraid that while it's possible he had some good intentions and perhaps even some good ideas about moving jobs back to the usa (although it's not like unemployment was high), any chance of a positive outcome went out the window based on how he implemented it. He's not incentivizing business, he's scaring the bejiggers out of business and they are going to run and hide till he's gone or proves he can be stable. And by then it's almost guaranteed within a month or so that it'll be a recession either way.

Legato · April 6

On 4/4/2025 at 3:53 PM, CrakHoBarbie said:

"It is in the interest of the tyrant to make his subjects poor. A people so occupied with their daily tasks have no time for plotting"

-Aristotle

Welcome to Canada

CrakHoBarbie · April 6

4 minutes ago, Legato said:

Welcome to Canada

I'm not in Canada

CdnFox · April 6

Just now, CrakHoBarbie said:

I'm not in Canada

Gee i've always pictured you as fairly tall, yet that went right over your head.

Legato · April 6

Just now, CrakHoBarbie said:

I'm not in Canada

In the immortal words of robo...Duh.

SpankyMcFarland · April 6

9 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Setting your 'orange rage' aside for the moment, this is one of the biggest problems with his current tactics regardless of their intent. He has created the firm and unshakeable impression that there is no stability.

I’m angry because he’s an unstable sociopath of limited talent completely unfit for the job he has. And his ideas are terrible. The fact that his minions are quoting opinions from the 19’th and 18’th century to justify his policies says it all. Do we look to Alexander Hamilton for advice on AI or antibiotics?

Tariffs are war by other means. They are costly and should be applied sparingly with a specific, strategic goal in mind. In a globalized economy they are very dangerous. I believe the market will recover eventually, which is why I still have money there, but America’s credibility has taken a serious hit. I fear most investors will pay a price for this in reduced growth over the longer term.

CrakHoBarbie · April 6

5 minutes ago, Legato said:

In the immortal words of robo...Duh.

Oh,

My apologies.

Did you have a point to make?

I think it was lost in your vagueness.

Why don't you go find it, then come back.

That's a good boy.

CdnFox · April 6

1 minute ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

I’m angry because he’s an unstable sociopath of limited talent completely unfit for the job he has.

Sorry bud, but you supported the liberals. You don't get to make that claim

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And his ideas are terrible. The fact that his minions are quoting opinions from the 19’th and 18’th century to justify his policies says it all. Do we look to Alexander Hamilton for advice on AI or antibiotics?

Well no, his ideas are actually relatively reasonable. Cut unnecessary government spending. How is that unreasonable? Put into place tariff packages and trade it policies that Inspire business to locate or relocate to America. Why is that dumb? Most countries have their own tariffs for that very reason, Canada certainly does. We put a 100% tariff on Chinese cars.

The problem is his implementation. But no, his ideas aren't crazy they are run-of-the-mill everyday average ideas that most people would agree with

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Tariffs are war by other means.

So we declared war on china when we put the tariff on their cars?

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They are costly and should be applied sparingly with a specific, strategic goal in mind. In a globalized economy they are very dangerous.

Sure. And that comes back to implementation

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I believe the market will recover eventually, which is why I still have money there, but America’s credibility has taken a serious hit. I fear most investors will pay a price for this in reduced growth over the longer term.

Possibly. Depends on how long it goes on for. But realistically covid did exactly the same thing and 4 years later it was completely in the rearview mirror.

Everything affects everything moving forward, this will change things there's no doubt. But there will be adoptions and adjustments and he's doing less harm to them in the long term right at the moment then Trudeau did to us in the long term and again, you still support the liberals. So it's kind of hard to take you seriously

2 minutes ago, CrakHoBarbie said:

Oh,

My apologies.

Did you have a point to make?

I think it was lost in your vagueness.

Why don't you go find it, then come back.

That's a good boy.

LOL I think you broke her brain Legato She seems to be mumbling to herself again

Legato · April 6

1 minute ago, CrakHoBarbie said:

Oh,

My apologies.

Did you have a point to make?

I think it was lost in your vagueness.

Why don't you go find it, then come back.

That's a good boy.

Your lack of comprehension has achieved Olympic standard. Keep up the good work.

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

Sorry bud, but you supported the liberals. You don't get to make that claim

Well no, his ideas are actually relatively reasonable. Cut unnecessary government spending. How is that unreasonable? Put into place tariff packages and trade it policies that Inspire business to locate or relocate to America. Why is that dumb? Most countries have their own tariffs for that very reason, Canada certainly does. We put a 100% tariff on Chinese cars.

The problem is his implementation. But no, his ideas aren't crazy they are run-of-the-mill everyday average ideas that most people would agree with

So we declared war on china when we put the tariff on their cars?

Sure. And that comes back to implementation

Possibly. Depends on how long it goes on for. But realistically covid did exactly the same thing and 4 years later it was completely in the rearview mirror.

Everything affects everything moving forward, this will change things there's no doubt. But there will be adoptions and adjustments and he's doing less harm to them in the long term right at the moment then Trudeau did to us in the long term and again, you still support the liberals. So it's kind of hard to take you seriously

LOL I think you broke her brain Legato She seems to be mumbling to herself again

Her?

CrakHoBarbie · April 6

2 minutes ago, Legato said:

Your lack of comprehension has achieved Olympic standard. Keep up the good work.

Please, educate me.

SpankyMcFarland · April 6

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

Sorry bud, but you supported the liberals. You don't get to make that claimk

I have just made and I will continue to make it. This is a disastrously bad businessman who ran an empire riddled with fraud and incompetence on an extraordinary scale which should have disqualified him from any political office. Way back when, he half-digested some primitive ideas about tariffs and he’s run with them ever since. Incredibly, he’s now in a position to implement this destructive, childish nonsense.

The only reasonable position for any Canadian is to condemn him without reservation.

Legato · April 6

Just now, CrakHoBarbie said:

Please, educate me.

Not on your life. It's best to avoid large sucking sounds.

CdnFox · April 6

2 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

I have just made and I will continue to make it.

And people will point and laugh at your hypocrisy. I'm not sure how that moves you forward in life but you do you

I guess I should have said you don't get to make that claim and not look like a complete hypocritical putz .

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This is a disastrously bad businessman who ran an empire riddled with fraud and incompetence on an extraordinary scale which should have disqualified him from any political office.

Oh yes, I forgot about the left wings hatred of democracy. It doesn't matter what the people voted for, they should never have been given choices in the first place!

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Way back when, he half-digested some primitive ideas about tariffs and he’s run with them ever since. Incredibly, he’s now in a position to implement this destructive, childish nonsense.

Yep. I actually read one of the reports I think he based his current thinking on, which noted that during the steel tariffs of his last term the economy was not significantly negatively impacted and it might be possible to do more tariffs without negatively impacting the American economy under certain circumstances. I think the writer was incorrect personally, but even if he was he obviously wasn't talking about the kind of scale trump is going on now but trump is known to have reference to the report

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The only reasonable position for any Canadian is to condemn him without reservation.

No that's stupid.

Basing your politics on hatred and bigotry and anger is never the action of a reasonable person.

What a reasonable person would do is say that trump is very clearly on the wrong page when it comes to tariffs and this is going to do a lot of harm. We should prepare for it and take the actions necessary to mitigate it while also remembering that this is probably not the last time an American president decides to go this route because it certainly not the first time an American president has decided to go this route, and get off our lazy asses and make Canada vastly more self-efficient and self prosperous as well as self-protected.

That's the reasonable approach. Get rid of intercanadian trade barriers, get rid of red tape and things that prevent our economy from booming, get rid of unnecessary or unproductive environmental policies that are designed to virtue signal, get rid of unnecessary taxes, trim the government to provide core services and provide them well, rework our tax and incentives systems to attract business instead of repelling it as it currently does.

The liberals won't do any of that. Four more years of carney will be four more years of liberals doing the same thing the liberals have done for the last four years.

But it's what needs to happen in order to address things like trump. As far as trump goes on his current trajectory there is a modest chance he will be thrown out at the midterms if the democrats managed to flip even 15 senate seats. I suspect that the democrats who have always been anti free trade with Canada are suddenly about to fall in love with it