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Honest Question for NDP Voters


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2 hours ago, Nexii said:

Yea I'd hoped the NDP would set their hopes higher than mid 20s seats after Layton, but I guess they're content with Jagmeet. Greens could have made real traction too. People care about the environment but they fell into the exact same trap.

It's disenheartening but that's democracy I guess. Sometimes a party needs to be wiped out in an election to get their act in order.

Sadly true - a fact you certainly don't have to remind Conservatives of :)   And the ndp has gone through that before on the provincial level. BC reduced them to like 2 seats only 20 years ago. Now they've been back in power for like 7 years (i'd have to look it up exactly).

The only party who's members don't put through that crucible is the liberals.

We'll see.  I suspect this is Jaggers last election unless it goes spectacularly better than i think it will. Traditionally the jr member in a coalition tends to do badly next election. We'll see where the party goes after that.  But honestly - i don't feel like there's any great options waiting in the wings to take over who could manhandle the party back on track.

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5 hours ago, Nefarious Banana said:

You're making stuff up again.  Please stop.

I'm not the only one referring to people much like many of you here in this forum as deplorables.  In any case I thought deplorables were proud to be called deplorable.

Like Trump, Poilievre is potentially leading us down the same dark and nasty road Trump has taken Americans — all in a sleazy bid to attain power.

https://www.niagarafallsreview.ca/opinion/star-columnists/pierre-poilievre-s-callous-courting-of-canada-s-deplorables/article_be9f1f38-c272-5b80-813d-64984939bb27.html

 

Andrew Coyne provides a good description of the Canadian deplorable here.

Canadian conservatives may not be as far gone as their counterparts in the United States – though distressing numbers of both think Donald Trump won the 2020 election – but it is a difference of degree, rather than kind.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/amp/opinion/article-the-conservative-weakness-for-contrarianism-has-driven-a-lot-of-them/

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58 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I'm not the only one referring to people much like many of you here in this forum as deplorables. 

Sure.  Hillary did and it was so well received that it helped her win the election.

Oh wait......   :)

Don't worry about it kiddo.  We're all used to the left being nothing but hate filled bigots these days.  It's been that way for years now, people are used to it.

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Yea I don't agree with Poilievre being quite like Trump. Trump is a true narcissist and above any other beliefs he just wants to be loved by all, a true populist. I could as easily see Trump being left-wing if say the Democratic party had been absent of strong leaders when he got into politics.

But on the topic of the NDP, yea it just feels like the NDP and Greens are content being loser parties (see what I did there, channeled my inner Trump). I think a party can be quite far left or right honestly and win if their ideas are well thought out. Layton almost did get there. Problem is, universal dental care isn't going to win you a majority or even a strong opposition if that's your #1 plank. Nor will environmentalism re: the Greens.

Right now people need better jobs and affordable housing

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10 hours ago, Nexii said:

Yea I don't agree with Poilievre being quite like Trump.

Yeah agreed,  he's nothing even remotely like trump.  Justin is more like trump than PP is.  I think there are some people who just claim that anyone they don't like as a politician is another Trump :) you don't have to like him but saying he's another Trump is just silly.

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But on the topic of the NDP, yea it just feels like the NDP and Greens are content being loser parties

Well I think for most of their history they have been. Actually put this question to ndp supporters in the past. They seemed to see themselves as a relevant but not super powerful fringe group whose purpose isn't to try and lead the country or provide leadership but rather to raise questions and advocate in a way that you can't if you are focused on winning the seat of power.

Seriously, you can say anything you want if you have no intention of being elected. That gives them a certain freedom to criticize on a more honest level and to raise issues and force the other parties to address them. They were almost more like a lobby group within the government than in a government themselves. And of course every now and then there is a minority government and then they can do real things theoretically.

 

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(see what I did there, channeled my inner Trump).

Go sit in your corner and think about what you've done young man!


 

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I think a party can be quite far left or right honestly and win if their ideas are well thought out. Layton almost did get there. Problem is, universal dental care isn't going to win you a majority or even a strong opposition if that's your #1 plank. Nor will environmentalism re: the Greens.

Right now people need better jobs and affordable housing

 

Well, and it's not even real universal dental care. It affects only a small portion of the public and frankly most provinces already had coverage internally for most of the“new” services. As people look around they wont think anything has changed. I still have health care and dental through work and that's what's paying. And my employer and I have to pay for that.

Half assed measures like that aren't going to impress very many people at all. And all jag meat ever talks about his fighting. I'll fight for this! I'll fight for that! You wanna fight? You right now I swear to God!!

Jack Layton was all about building. Fighting. He talked about how he would fight for people's rights but what he really talked about was building a better future for people. Today's ndp doesn't want to build anything. Just want to fight

The pendulum always seems to swing. Sure someday in the future the NDP will go back to being a party that is focused on addressing genuine quality of life workers rights, and social issues in a more helpful fashion. But that day is not today

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10 hours ago, Nexii said:

Yea I don't agree with Poilievre being quite like Trump.

The comparison that's being made is between Trump and Poilievre supporters.  What Poilievre does to cater to his chuds will be the question.  Bits of red meat to keep them happy might be enough with a majority but that'll likely be harder with a minority.

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1 minute ago, eyeball said:

The comparison that's being made is between Trump and Poilievre supporters.  What Poilievre does to cater to his chuds will be the question.  Bits of red meat to keep them happy might be enough with a majority but that'll likely be harder with a minority.

Yea for sure. The weird thing is the chuds or whatever you call them are the minority even within the CPC. Why is it that they get an outsized representation? Harper was the last that understood he didn't need to cater to them

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29 minutes ago, eyeball said:

The comparison that's being made is between Trump and Poilievre supporters.

LOL - the only people makeing that comparison are hate filled dishonest leftists who still support their beloved little potato leader and are bitter that most canadians prefer someone else.

Lets look at what those radical trump-like supporters want:  " i want to have somewhere to live."  "i'd like to be able to afford food".  "i'd like my income to keep pace with infaltion somehow".  "I'd like it if there were more high paying jobs".

Wow. I mean... it's like capitalists and nazis had a love child and it's trying to take over our gov't. What a bunch of radicals.

 Yeash.

The left - including the ndp - is where the CPC support is coming from these days. Not the base.

Sorry sparky - you can't lie your way into another gov't like that.

 

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1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

LOL - the only people makeing that comparison are hate filled dishonest leftists who still support their beloved little potato leader and are bitter that most canadians prefer someone else.

You're not proud to be a deplorable? Why not, the rest of you seem quite comfortable with it.

 

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

The left - including the ndp - is where the CPC support is coming from these days.

Yes, you did see where I mentioned I was hoping for a Conservative minority government right?

In any case if we can't beat you we'll have to invade you and change the party from within.

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2 hours ago, Nexii said:

Yea for sure. The weird thing is the chuds or whatever you call them are the minority even within the CPC. Why is it that they get an outsized representation?

I think it's mostly due to climate change denial. They're the last really hard-boiled resistance to climate action mostly because they're such a great distraction.

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1 hour ago, eyeball said:

You're not proud to be a deplorable? Why not, the rest of you seem quite comfortable with it.

Sorry kiddo - i'm not the deplorable one here.   That honour would belong to the prime minister and his hate-based supporters like yourself who attack other canadians without cause because they think differently.  That would be 'deplorable'.  I'm just an Honest Canadian. 

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Yes, you did see where I mentioned I was hoping for a Conservative minority government right?

Yeah - you say a lot of shit.  Most of what you say is in defense of trudeau, so it's pretty hard to believe you.  If 99 comments support Trudeau and defend his positions,  and 1 comment says you don't like him - it's pretty obvious what the truth is

In any case you won't be getting a minority.  People have realized you and your kind are responsible for the harm that's been done to the country and that an entire generation is going to have a lower standard of living directly because of people like you and your leader justin.  If they play their cards right - the cpc will likely be in for the next 15 years.   And they'll still be suffering for the liberals bad governance at the end of that time.

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36 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Most of what you say is in defense of trudeau,

Not at all really, you simply like characterizing any contempt of the quality of criticisms conservatives have for the Liberals as support for the Liberals. The only thing I've said in support of Trudeau is that he isn't/wasn't Trump during COVID. Otherwise it's patently clear he's nothing but a silly dilletant.

The intended effect is to differentiate between normal conservatives and you deplorables. The lack of courage in your convictions is apparent in your denial of the deplorable label and a clear indication that even you realize PP will need to govern more from the center the more his support he gets from ordinary Canadians.

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1 hour ago, eyeball said:

Not at all really,

Entirely. It's what you do. 

Defend trudeau at all costs, attack the right whenever opportunity presents.

That's why nobody buys your claims that you're not a trudeau supporter. You support him over the other parties clearly and have often defened why that would be.

And  i love that somehow the fact you defend trudeau at every turn is somehow my fault :)

 

It's a common enough tactic - we see it all the time.  Liberal lefties preneding that they really would be conservative if ONLY conservatives would learn to be better people.

"Honest guys, I REALLY WANT to vote conservative, i do!!! It's juat that you guys make it so impossible! Now - all you need to do to win my vote is just be liberals!! And elect mike cheung as leader !!! Then i'm going to vote for you honest! "

It's a load of bullshit  from a guy that everyone here knows is a pathetic liar.  You're the kind  of piece of crap that would change their post after someone called htem on it and pretend they never did.  That is the kind of person you are

You're a liberal. You lie - you prefer corruption as long is it's on your side, you vote for trudeau and you will do so for whoever is in charge of the party because you're a mindless drone, not a thinking individual.

So there you go.

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20 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Entirely. It's what you do. 

Defend trudeau at all costs, attack the right whenever opportunity presents.

That's why nobody buys your claims that you're not a trudeau supporter. You support him over the other parties clearly and have often defened why that would be.

You're the only poster here who maintains I support Trudeau, and of course you're a recent poster who's made it clear you're really most interested in making a big to do about yourself. People who've known me a lot longer are well aware that I've consistently advocated for a sort of penetrating transparency that should make it very difficult for any political party including Liberals, to commit corruption.

Edited by eyeball
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59 minutes ago, eyeball said:

You're the only poster here who maintains I support Trudeau,

True, the rest just call you a liar. Which you are.  Perhaps they think that also calling you a liberal would simply be repeating themselves :) 

Fact is not many even give you the time of day.  You should try honesty.

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3 hours ago, CdnFox said:

True, the rest just call you a liar.

No, you're pretty much the only one who does that too. That said you can't seem to help but accuse just about everyone else around here of being a liar too so... I'm obviously still in very good company.

Lots more lefties around here now as well thanks to you.

Good job.

Edited by eyeball
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2 hours ago, eyeball said:

No, you're pretty much the only one who does that too.

Nope. Many do.  I've seen it more than once and so have you.

I mean - nobody else is reading this - it's just you and me.  And we both know the truth.  You lie. Pretty frequent. Sometimes you're just wrong but lots of times  you lie.  And others do call you on it. So there you go,

And actually the number of leftie nutbars seems to be going down a bit. Which is actually a concern - half the reason i come here is to watch you and your ilk squirm and make !diots of yourselves - you, robo, rebound, some of the others... it's like having my own private sitcom :)  

I miss antifa - she was particularly hilarious ;)  

But you guys are great too.  I mean - posting a 5 year old news story and claiming it's the 'latest on the conservatives'...  haha - you just can't buy that anywhere else  :) 

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