Sad When People Purposely Mislabel the NDP

[Rovik]

Ever notice that many Conservative supporters (and Liberal ones as well, though not as much) call the NDP such terms as Communists, Socialists, Marxists and goodness knows what else. In reality, the NDP are Social Democrats. Are these people that scared of the NDP, that they are trying to make them out to be the boogey man. It's really sad if you ask me.

Another scare tactic they use is bringing up the Rae govt from the early 90s. You would think this was the worst govt. ever in the history of the world. Yet they don't bring up other provinicial govts such as Grant Devine's last than stellar govt. in Sask. that ran deficits for multiple terms. They don't mention the Liberal and Conservative govts. in Newfoundland during the 70s, 80s and 90s, that put Newfoundland in a bad financial situation. They don't mention that the Trudeau's Liberal govt and then Mulrooney's Conservative govt. put Canada deep in debt. No, it's because they only want you to believe that only the NDP can have bad govts.

I think these people are either misguided or are scared of any inroads that the NDP may make Federally so they fabricate lies and half-truths to scare people from the NDP. These people should be ashamed of themselves.

[daniel]

Yes, I've discussed this several times in other threads. 1) it's the perception that the NDP is associated with the notorious side of socialism internationally. People connect the NDP with Communism, Marxism, & Pol Pot. 2) the myth that an NDP government automatically equates to bad government when, in fact, provincially, the NDP has the same track record as both the Liberals and PC governments, including fiscal management.

[shoop]

The unfairness flows both ways. Do you think the NDs are being unfairly singled out? Let`s test your level of fairness. How about we make these changes?

"Ever notice that many New Democrat supporters (and Liberal ones as well, though not as much) call the CPC such terms as Fascist, Neo-Cons,　Bigots and goodness knows what else.

Another scare tactic they use is bringing up the Harris govt from the late 90s. You would think this was the worst govt. ever in the history of the world.

I think these people are either misguided or are scared of any inroads that the CPC may make Federally so they fabricate lies and half-truths to scare people from the CPC. These people should be ashamed of themselves.

Ever notice that many Conservative supporters (and Liberal ones as well, though not as much) call the NDP such terms as Communists, Socialists, Marxists and goodness knows what else. 

Another scare tactic they use is bringing up the Rae govt from the early 90s.   You would think this was the worst govt. ever in the history of the world.  

I think these people are either misguided or are scared of any inroads that the NDP may make Federally so they fabricate lies and half-truths to scare people from the NDP.   These people should be ashamed of themselves.

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[Slim MacSquinty]

Spend some time on the Rabble site and you will see what scares us, dogmatic idealogues who hold very narrow views and are extremely intolerant of their percieved enemies.

Having said that, (as a small c conservative) the NDP are valuable for political discussion in our political system and have definately provided a good counter point over the years.

They absolutely have their roots in Socailism and at one point were required to take the utopian oath, pragmatism and history seems to have brought them back from the brink though. Bob Rae's time in power has rounded off his edges and in his latest book he tentatively embraces capitalism.

[Argus]

Yes, I've discussed this several times in other threads.  1) it's the perception that the NDP is associated with the notorious side of socialism internationally.  People connect the NDP with Communism, Marxism, & Pol Pot.  2) the myth that an NDP government automatically equates to bad government when, in fact, provincially, the NDP has the same track record as both the Liberals and PC governments, including fiscal management.

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Gee, that wouldn't have anything to do with the proud association the party has made with the likes of Fidel Castro, would it? There ARE Communists and Marxists in the NDP, and they're not shy about it. Leftists don't believe there's anything to be ashamed of in being a Marxist. The previous VP of my union was an admitted Marxist and made no bones about his support and membershp in the NDP.

People don't trust the NDP because people feel the NDP are a party of special interests, and see mainstream middle-class Canada as a bunch of fat white cows they can milk to benefit their special interests and pay for all their social engineering projects. In addition, most of us are highly suspicous about the commitment of the NDP to basic freedoms, esp freedom of speech. If you look to much of Europe, where socialist governments have long been in power, there are all sorts of subjects which are quite simply impossible to speak about lest you be imprisoned for offending someone.

Thus to us middle class, straight white folk, a vote for the NDP is seen as a vote for much higher taxes, restrictive laws, mandatory affirmative action programs, and orwellian social engineering programs meant to brainwash us into loving big brother and all his politically correct works.

Nor has Layton done anything to change our minds.

[cybercoma]

About the "socialist" title:

The NDP is a member of the Socialist International organization of Democratic socialist and Social democratic parties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Democratic_Party

[daniel]

I think these people are either misguided or are scared of any inroads that the NDP may make Federally so they fabricate lies and half-truths to scare people from the NDP.  These people should be ashamed of themselves.

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You can see the myths are continuing to be perpetuated right here in this thread. I've also noticed in the past several years of reading forums, the people most eager to accuse are usually the worst offenders themselves of exactly the same accusations.

[Shakeyhands]

Yeah its kind of like when the Reform/Alliance call themselves and masquerade as Conservatives...

[JOVIAC]

Daniel - remember saying this

a vote for the Conservatives = a vote for the power hungry

Me thinks you are a hypocrite

[Dan]

Daniel - remember saying this

a vote for the Conservatives = a vote for the power hungry

Me thinks you are a hypocrite

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OMG!!

The NDP are being taken over by extremists!!!!

[scribblet]

Here are some quotes , guess where they are from:

...That the production and distribution of goods and services shall be directed to meeting the social and individual needs of people within a sustainable environment and economy and not to the making of profit;

"We remain in the forefront of the people’s struggles : for labour rights, social justice and the environment; defending the rights of minorities, women, gays and lesbians; fighting for youth and students.”

To modify and control the operations of the monopolistic productive and distributive organizations through economic and social planning. Towards these ends and where necessary the extension of the principle of social ownership;

......is proud to be associated with the democratic socialist parties of the world and to share the struggle for peace, international co-operation and the abolition of poverty.

“The struggle of the Canadian people for democracy, sovereignty, peace and social advance is essentially a political struggle against big business and its control of the Canadian State. The interests of the vast majority of Canadians are in conflict with the anti-democratic, neoliberal policies of the transnationals and the banks.”

“...offering a clear and consistent vision of a socialist Canada, where the priority is people’s needs, not corporate greed”

[Slim MacSquinty]

Scrib:

guess you killed that thread eh.

[Black Dog]

The really hilarious thing about the NDP's rep as the party of special interests is that the same label applies to the Liberals and Conservatives. The differenc eis that the latter parties' "special interests" are corporations, banks, insurance companies and the rest of the "elite" who see mainstream middle-class Canada as a bunch of fat white cows they can milk to benefit their special interests and pay for all their tax cuts and shareholder bottom lines. The phenomenon of people voting against their economic interests is well documented down south: the virus seems to be spreading to Canada.

[cybercoma]

Now where do people get the socialist/communist idea regarding NDP?

From the NDP themselves.

thanks scrib.

[cybercoma]

The really hilarious thing about the NDP's rep as the party of special interests is that the same label applies to the Liberals and Conservatives. The differenc eis that the latter parties' "special interests" are corporations, banks, insurance companies and the rest of the "elite" who see mainstream middle-class Canada as a bunch of fat white cows they can milk to benefit their special interests and pay for all their tax cuts and shareholder bottom lines. The phenomenon of people voting against their economic interests is well documented down south: the virus seems to be spreading to Canada.

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A prosperous economy is beneficial to everyone. When big business suffers, so do the rest of us.

[pharmer]

The really hilarious thing about the NDP's rep as the party of special interests is that the same label applies to the Liberals and Conservatives. The differenc eis that the latter parties' "special interests" are corporations, banks, insurance companies and the rest of the "elite" who see mainstream middle-class Canada as a bunch of fat white cows they can milk to benefit their special interests and pay for all their tax cuts and shareholder bottom lines. The phenomenon of people voting against their economic interests is well documented down south: the virus seems to be spreading to Canada.

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A prosperous economy is beneficial to everyone. When big business suffers, so do the rest of us.

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When big business widens the gap between poverty and prosperity it is difficult to see the benefit a giving away coporate tax cuts. Perhaps a government that ensures big business becomes accountable for its practices and its exploitation of people and environment is what the NDP is all about.

[cybercoma]

When big business widens the gap between poverty and prosperity it is difficult to see the benefit a giving away coporate tax cuts. Perhaps a government that ensures big business becomes accountable for its practices and its exploitation of people and environment is what the NDP is all about.

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If big business makes everyone in the country they operate poor, they'll no longer be able to survive. The poor won't be able to afford the products or services and the companies will collapse. Furthermore, free-market allows the public to be the dictator of what corporations get their money, so poor business practices will interfere with prosperity in the sense that less people will want their shares or the products/services they offer. Socialism doesn't work because it destroys productivity and innovation among other things. If it was more effective than capitalism, socialist states in Europe would've overtaken the United States already, or at the very least been competitive.

[Slim MacSquinty]

Stop trying to confuse him with the facts, capitalism does not allow them adequate opportunities to lock arms and sing those great songs like "united we stand".

[shoop]

Shakey,

quit being a biotch.

Yeah its kind of like when the Reform/Alliance call themselves and masquerade as Conservatives...

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[newbie]

Shakey,

quit being a biotch.

Yeah its kind of like when the Reform/Alliance call themselves and masquerade as Conservatives...

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Sounds like he struck a nerve shoop.

[BubberMiley]

A stable society is beneficial to everyone (and necessary for a prosperous economy). When some people and communities suffer, so do the rest of us.

[scribblet]

Now where do people get the socialist/communist idea regarding NDP?

From the NDP themselves.

thanks scrib.

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Your welcome

Okay, some where, some where not, some from the NDP some from the Communist party, any ideas which ones are which - kinda hard to tell isn't it ?

[shoop]

Just kinda sad when a thread started to avoid mislabelling a party automatically degenerates into name calling and mislabelling a different party.

I took it as sarcasm, but your comment was bordering on ignant.

Sounds like he struck a nerve shoop.

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[BubberMiley]

It definitely shows they're ignorant. If you look at Manitoba or Saskatchewan, which have had NDP governments for years, they aren't exactly socialist states. There's Wal-marts like everywhere else. I think the CCF decided to work with the capitalist system, oh, somewhere around the 1950s. Parties evolve (you'd think CPCers would know this). there are socialists in the NDP, but there are also crazy fundamentalist nutjobs in the CPC. Neither necessarily represent the mainstream of the party.

[shoop]

Thanks for that ... admitting that the crazy fundamentalist nutjobs aren`t the mainstream of the CPC.

Parties evolve (you'd think CPCers would know this). there are socialists in the NDP, but there are also crazy fundamentalist nutjobs in the CPC. Neither necessarily represent the mainstream of the party.

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