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5 minutes ago, blackbird said:

 ‘Evolution is not proven fact, so it should not be promoted dogmatically.’   Yet it is taught in schools as if it is a fact.  

Evolution IS a fact.  We can see it and replicate it. Cross species evolution is not as solid but it still is pretty well supported by the evidence and is our best hypothisis at this point.  And as near as i remember it was taught that way when i was in school. If they're teaching kids that we have filled in all the gaps there and know it as absolute fact then yes, they shouldn't be teaching that.

But you are even worse.  You have less evidence of god yet demand he be accepted as fact as well. Soooo - maybe take the log from your eye before worrying about the spliter in anyone elses.

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On 3/20/2023 at 9:44 AM, blackbird said:

Now you are lying.  I state something I believe is from the Bible and now you are calling me arrogant.  You have gone beyond the pale and falsely accusing me of arrogance now.   I might have had some arrogant tones in past comments, but you calling everything I say from the Bible is arrogant is something else.

No that was the truth Sorry kiddo.  You were being surpemely arrogant.  And you were not presenting it as something you just believe you were stating it as fact :)

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4 minutes ago, blackbird said:

"

1  In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2  And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. 

3  And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4  And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.  5  And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day. "

I just accept it as stated.  No need to try to dissect every word or reinterpret it.  

Nothing wrong with accepting it, if such is your wont, but it cannot be that the first day was a literal Earth day, as there was no such thing as a literal Earth day at that time.  There was no such thing as the Earth.

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4 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

No that was the truth Sorry kiddo.  You were being surpemely arrogant.  And you were not presenting it as something you just believe you were stating it as fact :)

No.  Just because I state something from the Bible, you call it arrogant.  It would make more sense to just discuss something with reasons rather than calling people names such as arrogant.

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6 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Nothing wrong with accepting it, if such is your wont, but it cannot be that the first day was a literal Earth day, as there was no such thing as a literal Earth day at that time.  There was no such thing as the Earth.

I think the word day is used to mean 24 hours.  The whole creation was done in six literal days.  I don't see a problem with that understanding.

Edited by blackbird
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1 minute ago, blackbird said:

I think the word day is used to to mean 24 hours.  The whole creation was done in six literal days.  I don't see a problem with that understanding.

I told you what the problem was.  The literal day didn't exist for at least half of your God's version of creation.  Given that, neither would the hour.

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11 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Evolution IS a fact.  We can see it and replicate it.

NO, it is not a fact.  Far from it.  It is a dogma often called Darwinism.  It is in a way a religion to many people.  It is unproven.   It is purely conjecture and has been debunked by some scientists.  

" It would be better to say that particles-to-people Evolution is an unsubstantiated hypothesis or conjecture."  - creation.com

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Just now, blackbird said:

I'm afraid you lost me there.  I don't follow what you are saying.  What is your point?

42 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

But there would not have been any literal days for about half the time it took.  A day is the amount of time it takes the Earth to rotate on its axis, and the Earth wasn't created until day 3.  It would have been day 4 before a day could even exist.

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20 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Evolution IS a fact. 

You need to read some books like Refuting Evolution written by a PhD.  I think you can read much of this one online at;

Appendix 1: Common arguments for evolution that have been rejected (creation.com)

"

Rejected argument 1: Similarities between embryos1

Most people have heard that the human embryo goes through various evolutionary stages, such as having gill slits like a fish, a tail like a monkey, etc. This concept, pretentiously called the ‘biogenetic law,’ was popularized by the German evolutionist Ernst Haeckel in the late 1860s. It is also known as ‘embryonic recapitulation’ or ‘ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny,’ meaning that during an organism’s early development it supposedly re-traces its evolutionary history.

Although this idea was based on a fraud and has been debunked by many high-profile scientists, the idea persists. Even textbooks in the 1990s were still using Haeckel’s fraudulent drawings.2"

 

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7 minutes ago, blackbird said:

No.  Just because I state something from the Bible, you call it arrogant.

As i've said that's not true - your statement of it as fact and demand that i accept it as such is arrogant. Especially in light of the fact you've already noted you can't offer any proof the bible is accurate or god exists.

Let me try to show the difference in a way you might understand better.

If you say:

I believe a fetus is a human on the day of conception because my interpretation of my bible and my religious beliefs have convinced me that's the way it is. I have no other evidence but that's how i feel.

Then that's not invalid. You're not claiming it as fact, you're not suggesting there aren't other interpretations - that's just how you 'feel'.  That's fine. It acknowledges that others may feel differently but you feel this way.   But what YOU do is this:

Babies are humans from the moment of conception. The bible says so. End of story.

That is rude, wrong thinking, arrogant, and foolish. That is NOT a fact, nor should anyone else take it as being a valid statement.

In other words if you use your bible to justify anything OTHER than how YOU PERSONALLY feel towards something you're stepping over a line.

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5 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

 

I think the statement in Genesis ch1 about the creation was a general statement with literal days.  I don't really think it can be dissected to try to find discrepancies.  That's not the intent of the account given.  It is just a simple statement explaining God created the universe in six days.

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3 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

your statement of it as fact and demand that i accept it as such is arrogant

Not really.  Nothing I said is demanding you to accept it.  That is just your interpretation.

When people make comments on a forum, it is simply one's point of view.  It might be stated in a way you don't like, but it is still just someone's belief and there is no big gun beside you forcing you to accept it.  

But you persist in your claim that it is forcing you to accept something and it is arrogant.  No, it's not.

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3 minutes ago, blackbird said:

I think the statement in Genesis ch1 about the creation was a general statement with literal days.  I don't really think it can be dissected to try to find discrepancies.  That's not the intent of the account given.  It is just a simple statement explaining God created the universe in six days.

Sure it can.  Genesis was written by a man, right?  He probably thought the Sun went around the Earth, and never gave a thought to what an actual, literal day was.  So he said it took seven days.  Good number, makes sense from where he's sitting.

But as we now know what an actual, literal day is, we can see that whoever that worthy was, he was talking out of his nether regions.

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7 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

That is rude, wrong thinking, arrogant, and foolish. That is NOT a fact, nor should anyone else take it as being a valid statement.

False again.  It's not rude or anything else.  It is just a statement of belief from someone, in this case myself and how I understand the Bible.

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Just now, blackbird said:

Not really.  Nothing I said is demanding you to accept it. 

It absoutely is. Which is why you come across as unbelievably arrogant.

I can choose whether or not i accept your demand of course.  I do not.

Just now, blackbird said:

 

When people make comments on a forum, it is simply one's point of view.  It might be stated in a way you don't like, but it is still just someone's belief and there is no big gun beside you forcing you to accept it.  

Sure - but that doesn't change the fact you demand it. Which makes you look like an ass. Then you get treated like an ass. Now you're complaining to me that you're getting treated like an ass.

Kid - stop being an ass.

Just now, blackbird said:

But you persist in your claim that it is forcing you to accept something and it is arrogant.  No, it's not.

I never claimed that. And here we get to the part where you've got to lie to try to make your point, If you have to lie to make a point then you don't have a very good point.

And i'm told they make baby jesus cry. So there's that.  :)

What i said is you demand it be accepted. I never said i'm forced to.

You're still being an ass.

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1 minute ago, blackbird said:

False again.  It's not rude or anything else.  It is just a statement of belief from someone, in this case myself and how I understand the Bible.

No, it is a statement of fact that has no basis in fact and it's rude and arrogant and insulting.

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1 minute ago, bcsapper said:

Sure it can.  Genesis was written by a man, right?  He probably thought the Sun went around the Earth, and never gave a thought to what an actual, literal day was.  So he said it took seven days.  Good number, makes sense from where he's sitting.

But as we now know what an actual, literal day is, we can see that whoever that worthy was, he was talking out of his nether regions.

No, I don't think so.   I believe Moses wrote Genesis by inspiration from the Holy Spirit of God.  What he wrote was a basic explanation of how God created the universe.  Nothing complex about it.  It is written so the average person could understand it.

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1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

It absoutely is. Which is why you come across as unbelievably arrogant.

I can choose whether or not i accept your demand of course.  I do not.

Sure - but that doesn't change the fact you demand it. Which makes you look like an ass. Then you get treated like an ass. Now you're complaining to me that you're getting treated like an ass.

Kid - stop being an ass.

I never claimed that. And here we get to the part where you've got to lie to try to make your point, If you have to lie to make a point then you don't have a very good point.

And i'm told they make baby jesus cry. So there's that.  :)

What i said is you demand it be accepted. I never said i'm forced to.

You're still being an ass.

Your problem is you don't know how to discuss something with other people.  For you it always has to descend into a mud-slinging contest.   Forget it.  If you don't want to discuss things rationally, just drop it.

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Just now, blackbird said:

No, I don't think so.   I believe Moses wrote Genesis by inspiration from the Holy Spirit of God.  What he wrote was a basic explanation of how God created the universe.  Nothing complex about it.  It is written so the average person could understand it.

Well, far be it from me to disparage Moses and his nether regions, but I think the Holy Spirit and he might have got some wires crossed.  The Holy Spirit probably meant God days.  Moses is not to be blamed.  He was probably knackered from carrying those tablets down the mountain.

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2 minutes ago, bcsapper said:

Well, far be it from me to disparage Moses and his nether regions, but I think the Holy Spirit and he might have got some wires crossed.  The Holy Spirit probably meant God days.  Moses is not to be blamed.  He was probably knackered from carrying those tablets down the mountain.

LOL

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38 minutes ago, blackbird said:

Your problem is you don't know how to discuss something with other people.  For you it always has to descend into a mud-slinging contest.   Forget it.  If you don't want to discuss things rationally, just drop it.

I know how to discuss just fine. The problem is you're not discussing, you're just repeating dumb things without actually address it.

I gave you clear examples. Your best response is something along the lines of 'nuh uhhhh'.  I point out you demand your bible is an actual factual document we should all follow and you reply with "no i dont, and it totally is". 

And you never actually address the issues.  I point out why it costs more to have capital punishment, i produce documentation explianing it in detail and examples where it happens, and your best reply is to say  "well i believe otherwise" and when you're asked WHY you believe that in the face of the evidence our answer is "well anyway god says we should".

That's not much of a discussion. So when people are that thick i tend to just amuse myself by making fun of them.

Try not being an ass - that might get you farther.

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A rational person would look into the revelation given to man by God and try to determine whether it is valid or not.  Particularly the New Testament.  According to the Bible, one has to make the choice of believing and going to heaven or not believing and going to hell.  I am not a gifted speaker or trained evangelist and don't know how to put things diplomatically.  I assume that's why I get accused of being arrogant.  I suppose that is why many early Christians were thrown into the lion's den.  Authorities didn't like the message.   But the way I see it is if the King James Bible is true and I believe it is, then it means the wisest thing is to learn what the message is and believe it.  That way one is insured of going to heaven.   If one just assumes it is not true or refuses to read it, he is taking an awful big chance on being wrong.  The consequences of that choice are hell for eternity according to what it teaches.  Seems like a no-brainer.  But nobody is forced to pay attention or believe it.  God has given man a brain and the ability to read and understand it.  So the ball is in man's court.  What he does with the information is up to him.  It seems clear to me that the universe didn't just come about by chance.  I believe there is a reason for everything and a cause of the universe and mankind being here.  

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22 minutes ago, blackbird said:

A rational person would look into the revelation given to man by God

No, that is not rational.  It is rational for a RELIGIOUS person who believes in THAT god to consider doing that. But it would be nuts for anyone else to consider it.

this is what i mean by the arrogance and insisting your god is 100 percent confirmed real and everyone must believe in him.

Nope.  Which means that any opinion you have is useless, it's not based on reason or logic but on your erroneous belief that your imaginary friend and the voices in your head are automatically right and that nobody should dispute it.

Whatever.

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1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

Nope.  Which means that any opinion you have is useless, it's not based on reason or logic but on your erroneous belief that your imaginary friend and the voices in your head are automatically right and that nobody should dispute it.

No.  It is not an imaginary friend or voices in my head.  It is the Holy Scriptures that makes it clear if one reads it with an open mind.  I don't try and can't stop anyone from disputing it.  You proved that.  Millions of people would disagree with you.  Why fight against something like this?  

This is one of the preachers who God used to change my life and probably many others.  I thank God for him.

The Divine Appointment | SermonAudio

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