Harper won't siften marijuana possession laws

[normanchateau]

Stephen Harper announced today that his party will not re-introduce the Liberal bill to decriminalize the possession of small amounts of marijuana. He made this statement in BC, the province with the largest percentage of marijuana users where Harper is well behind in the polls. More British Columbians support outright legalization than people in any other province. Harper seems to be his own worst enemy at election time. Here's the link:

http://www.cbc.ca/canadavotes/

This latest Harper pronouncement is bizarre given that 69% of Canadians favour decriminalization and 47% actually favour legalization. But Harper wants to treat marijuana the same way that prohibitionists wanted to treat alcohol in the 1920's and 30's.

Even the conservative Fraser Institute has called for the legalization of marijuana so that profits would flow to Ottawa rather than to the Hell's Angels and similar gangs. Here's the link:

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2004/06/09/canada/pot_fraser040609

One good thing coming from this announcement is that it might make the 8% of British Columbians who plan to vote Green reconsider and vote NDP or Liberal.

Is it just a coincidence or does Harper seem to get some of his campaign platform from the US Republicans?

[Virgil]

A comment less involving the economy but involving marijuana legalization. Were it that people bought marijuana from goverment or legally run businesses, there would be no lacings. It could however, lessen the price of more addictive underworld drugs such as crystal meth, for small time drug dealers could develop an income dependece on them (the more addictive drugs).

[normanchateau]

A comment less involving the economy but involving marijuana legalization. Were it that people bought marijuana from goverment or legally run businesses, there would be no lacings. It could however, lessen the price of more addictive underworld drugs such as crystal meth, for small time drug dealers could develop an income dependece on them (the more addictive drugs).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good point virgil. When the Netherlands stopped enforcing marijuana laws they found use of hard drugs went down. This is because many marijuana dealers make more money selling hard drugs than they do selling marijuana. So when they sell marijuana to their young customers, they often provide a "sample" of a hard drug. This problem disappeared in the Netherlands because the marijuana buyer can get marijuana from a cafe that does not sell hard drugs.

The Fraser Institute, by the way, did an economic cost/benefit analysis and found that on virtually every economic measure, including law enforcement costs, marijuana legalization made sense.

I do agree with Harper in his opposition to the Liberal decriminalization bill but that's only because decriminalization wouldn't provide the same economic benefits as legalization would. If Harper were to promote legalization, he'd inherit a huge number of NDP votes, especially in BC.

[Leafless]

normanchateau

You wrote- " Is it just a coincedence or does Harper seem to get some of his campaign platform from the U.S. Republicans."

It seem the only reason Canada is being dragged down morally concerning SSM, marijuana, attack on Christian beliefs and other liberal amenities is because of Liberal immature policies.

Thank goodness there is one political party in Canada that dictates sane politcal ideologies concerning the preservation of Canadian values.

I would rather see an attachment to republican views than ideologies of a distant inconsequential liberal Netherlands.

[normanchateau]

It seem the only reason Canada is being dragged down morally concerning SSM, marijuana, attack on Christian beliefs and other liberal amenities is because of Liberal immature policies.

What makes a policy immature? You not agreeing with it or is there some objective standard you're employing? Is alcohol and cigarette legalization "mature" and marijuana legalization "immature"? If so, why?

[southerncomfort]

normanchateau

You wrote- " Is it just a coincedence or does Harper seem to get some of his campaign platform from the U.S. Republicans."

It seem the only reason Canada is being dragged down morally concerning SSM, marijuana, attack on Christian beliefs and other liberal amenities is because of Liberal immature policies.

Thank goodness there is one political party in Canada that dictates sane politcal ideologies concerning the preservation of Canadian values.

I would rather see an attachment to republican views than ideologies of a distant inconsequential liberal Netherlands.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, I have Normie on my ignore list but it doesn't help LOL

I don't see any platform from tbe U,.S. thats a silly thing to say isn't it. I'm in full agreement with this one, I saw what it did (pot) to one of my kids. The liberals want to legalize prostitution too, Ahem....wake up Canada, time to get rid of this slime.

[justcrowing]

normanchateau

You wrote- " Is it just a coincedence or does Harper seem to get some of his campaign platform from the U.S. Republicans."

It seem the only reason Canada is being dragged down morally concerning SSM, marijuana, attack on Christian beliefs and other liberal amenities is because of Liberal immature policies.

Thank goodness there is one political party in Canada that dictates sane politcal ideologies concerning the preservation of Canadian values.

I would rather see an attachment to republican views than ideologies of a distant inconsequential liberal Netherlands.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, I have Normie on my ignore list but it doesn't help LOL

I don't see any platform from tbe U,.S. thats a silly thing to say isn't it. I'm in full agreement with this one, I saw what it did (pot) to one of my kids. The liberals want to legalize prostitution too, Ahem....wake up Canada, time to get rid of this slime.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Did you not know that Normies neck of the woods, B.C. grows the finest and most potent marijuana in the world - grow-ops in half million dollar homes - cops can't keep up with the abundance of grow-ops; tunnels dug into the U.S. for illegal export; drug wars; increased useage in schools - if you get satellite TV you can pick up B.C. news - it's all there. No wonder BCers want it legalized. Well if it must be legalized then it should be done so like alcohol but then how does one deal with a car driver who is high - how does one test his/her pot level of intoxication? Never smoked the darn stuff and never will but like alcohol, it will create a new problem for law enforcement be it legalized or not.

Former Vancouver Mayor Campbell, tried a free needle exchange and providing free drugs to addicts to prevent overdose deaths, etc. Was it successful? Have not seen much about it on the news except that there were very few takers of the program. That being the case, legalizing pot will encourage its production and a lovely export market into the U.S. via smuggling. Now we will have another problem when the U.S. shuts the border or puts guards all along it or whatever they do. I think right now they have a group called "Minute Men" or something like that patrolling the border and people in B.C. are already upset. Nothing like creating more problems with our neighbors.

All this sounds like the free condoms handed out in schools and on the street and to sexually active people who could not afford them - did it prevent teen pregnancy or aids? Nope - nothing changed, teens get pregnant and aids victims have not decreased.

[southerncomfort]

Did you not know that Normies neck of the woods, B.C. grows the finest and most potent marijuana in the world - grow-ops in half million dollar homes - cops can't keep up with the abundance of grow-ops; tunnels dug into the U.S. for illegal export; drug wars; increased useage in schools - if you get satellite TV you can pick up B.C. news - it's all there. No wonder BCers want it legalized. Well if it must be legalized then it should be done so like alcohol but then how does one deal with a car driver who is high - how does one test his/her pot level of intoxication? Never smoked the darn stuff and never will but like alcohol, it will create a new problem for law enforcement be it legalized or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nope, but maybe that the problem - smokin up too much ooooh pass the pipe normie. Oops sorry, don't want to break any rules.

Harper just came out with a good law and order minimun sentencing platform, can't argue with it. Throw the slime in jail, and throw away the key. (drug pushers not Normie - )

[normanchateau]

Well if it must be legalized then it should be done so like alcohol but then how does one deal with a car driver who is high - how does one test his/her pot level of intoxication?  Never smoked the darn stuff and never will but like alcohol, it will create a new problem for law enforcement be it legalized or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good point justcrowing. Australia now has a simple and effective saliva test technique that detects small quantities of marijuana in the body. Australian police use it regularly. Personally I think Canada should have such a system in place even if we don't legalize it so we can catch marijuana-impaired drivers. Whether it's alcohol or marijuana, no one should be allowed to drive impaired.

[justcrowing]

Well if it must be legalized then it should be done so like alcohol but then how does one deal with a car driver who is high - how does one test his/her pot level of intoxication?  Never smoked the darn stuff and never will but like alcohol, it will create a new problem for law enforcement be it legalized or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good point justcrowing. Australia now has a simple and effective saliva test technique that detects small quantities of marijuana in the body. Australian police use it regularly. Personally I think Canada should have such a system in place even if we don't legalize it so we can catch marijuana-impaired drivers. Whether it's alcohol or marijuana, no one should be allowed to drive impaired.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can't believe I am going to write this but for a change I agree with your last sentence - oh well even the post. Sheesh, and I haven't even had a glass of wine so must celebrate but am not driving.

[normanchateau]

I can't believe I am going to write this but for a change I agree with your last sentence - oh well even the post.    Sheesh, and I haven't even had a glass of wine so must celebrate but am not driving. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thank you jc. I have a feeling quite a few people agree with me on the marijuana issue

but they're reluctant to say so because they'd be forced to agree with me on something. See, it didn't hurt.

Not only Joe Clark but even Stockwell Day, when he was leader of the Alliance Party, supported decriminalization of small amounts of marijuana. Here's the link:

http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/1722.html

[shoop]

OMG, Am I actually agreeing with Norman on something?

Then again, fighting to reduce impaired driving - regardless of the drug involved - is a good thing.

Good point justcrowing.  Australia now has a simple and effective saliva test technique that detects small quantities of marijuana in the body.  Australian police use it regularly.  Personally I think Canada should have such a system in place even if we don't legalize it so we can catch marijuana-impaired drivers. Whether it's alcohol or marijuana, no one should be allowed to drive impaired.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[normanchateau]

OMG, Am I actually agreeing with Norman on something?

Shoop and I actually agreeing? Now this IS scary.

[Virgil]

Well, I can't say I agree with the Liberal's decriminalization, wherest marijuana may be carried legally in small amounts, this to me allows drug dealers to profit and people to smoke pot.

I think were it possible it would be better if the stuff never existed, but whether it's legal or not, it still does exist. I just think that there are less negative consequences to legal marijuana than illegal. Both of wich would be equally available.

I concur with what has been stated on impaired driving. Not a good thing.

I don't remember who said it, but it's not marijuana's fault whatever happened to your kid. Your child makes his own decisions, marijuana does not controle him. If he is obsessed with it, and uses it extensively and always get's into trouble because of it, it is the result of his choice to use it excessively.

[justcrowing]

OMG, Am I actually agreeing with Norman on something?

Then again, fighting to reduce impaired driving - regardless of the drug involved - is a good thing.

Good point justcrowing.  Australia now has a simple and effective saliva test technique that detects small quantities of marijuana in the body.  Australian police use it regularly.  Personally I think Canada should have such a system in place even if we don't legalize it so we can catch marijuana-impaired drivers. Whether it's alcohol or marijuana, no one should be allowed to drive impaired.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey shoop - think there is a full moon out tonight? Like you I agree whether alcohol or marijuna, no one should be allowed to drive impaired - legal or not.

[normanchateau]

Well, I can't say I agree with the Liberal's decriminalization, wherest marijuana may be carried legally in small amounts, this to me allows drug dealers to profit and people to smoke pot.

I don't agree with decriminalization either but I think it's a necessary transition stage before legalization. Most Canadian support decriminalization so it'll likely happen first

even though Canada's Senate has already recommended legalization.

[scribblet]

OMG, Am I actually agreeing with Norman on something?

Then again, fighting to reduce impaired driving - regardless of the drug involved - is a good thing.

Good point justcrowing.  Australia now has a simple and effective saliva test technique that detects small quantities of marijuana in the body.  Australian police use it regularly.  Personally I think Canada should have such a system in place even if we don't legalize it so we can catch marijuana-impaired drivers. Whether it's alcohol or marijuana, no one should be allowed to drive impaired.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey shoop - think there is a full moon out tonight? Like you I agree whether alcohol or marijuna, no one should be allowed to drive impaired - legal or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I totally agree with the impaired driving issue. No one should be driving while drugged.

'm guessing there are quite a few people on the road who are, and until this test if widely in use here, I can't agree with decriminalizing pot. Not that I agree with that anyway, (other than for medecinal purposes) but I don't think a young person, should have a criminal record for possessing a very small amount. Anyone selling a drug of any kind should be thrown in jail for a long time.

[normanchateau]

but I don't think a young person, should have a criminal record for possessing a very small amount.  Anyone selling a drug of any kind should be thrown in jail for a long time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I wonder how many people on this board have actually read the legislation which the federal government introduced to the House of Commons in November, 2004. That legislation, had it passed, severely toughened the laws on growing and selling but decriminalized possession of small amounts of marijuana. As the law stands now, a young person, if convicted of possesssion, obtains a criminal record which permanently prevents entry even as a tourist into the US and other countries, creates problems in obtaining certain jobs, etc.

Other than growers and sellers, why would anyone be against this? Stephen Harper and Paul Martin both agree on stiffening the laws against growing but Harper, for reasons which I have yet to hear, opposes decriminalization. If there's a Harper supporter out there who can explain Harper's reasons for opposing decriminalization, please post that explanation. If even his supporters can't explain it, that's cause for concern.

[tml12]

Stephen Harper announced today that his party will not re-introduce the Liberal bill to decriminalize the possession of small amounts of marijuana.  He made this statement in BC, the province with the largest percentage of marijuana users where Harper is well behind in the polls.  More British Columbians support outright legalization than people in any other province.  Harper seems to be his own worst enemy at election time.  Here's the link:

http://www.cbc.ca/canadavotes/

This latest Harper pronouncement is bizarre given that 69% of Canadians favour decriminalization and 47% actually favour legalization.  But Harper wants to treat marijuana the same way that prohibitionists wanted to treat alcohol in the 1920's and 30's.

Even the conservative Fraser Institute has called for the legalization of marijuana so that profits would flow to Ottawa rather than to the Hell's Angels and similar gangs.  Here's the link:

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2004/06/09/canada/pot_fraser040609

One good thing coming from this announcement is that it might make the 8% of British Columbians who plan to vote Green reconsider and vote NDP or Liberal.

Is it just a coincidence or does Harper seem to get some of his campaign platform from the US Republicans?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nothing would change under a Harper government in terms of marijuana possession I don't think. I don't know about the other provinces but I don't see people going crazy around here about small possession...

[Black Dog]

I've a question for anyone who argues against legalizing/decriminalizing pot due to concerns with impaired driving: are you also demanding booze be made illegal?

It seem the only reason Canada is being dragged down morally concerning SSM, marijuana, attack on Christian beliefs and other liberal amenities is because of Liberal immature policies.

How is marijuana a moral issue?

[normanchateau]

Stephen Harper announced today that his party will not re-introduce the Liberal bill to decriminalize the possession of small amounts of marijuana.  He made this statement in BC, the province with the largest percentage of marijuana users where Harper is well behind in the polls.  More British Columbians support outright legalization than people in any other province.  Harper seems to be his own worst enemy at election time.  Here's the link:

http://www.cbc.ca/canadavotes/

This latest Harper pronouncement is bizarre given that 69% of Canadians favour decriminalization and 47% actually favour legalization.  But Harper wants to treat marijuana the same way that prohibitionists wanted to treat alcohol in the 1920's and 30's.

Even the conservative Fraser Institute has called for the legalization of marijuana so that profits would flow to Ottawa rather than to the Hell's Angels and similar gangs.  Here's the link:

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2004/06/09/canada/pot_fraser040609

One good thing coming from this announcement is that it might make the 8% of British Columbians who plan to vote Green reconsider and vote NDP or Liberal.

Is it just a coincidence or does Harper seem to get some of his campaign platform from the US Republicans?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nothing would change under a Harper government in terms of marijuana possession I don't think. I don't know about the other provinces but I don't see people going crazy around here about small possession...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Read the first sentence of the quote again. Stephen Harper has said he will NOT reintroduce the decriminalization legislation that the Liberals introduced in November, 2004. I'ver heard nothing to suggest that the Liberals won't proceed with that legislation if they're re-elected.

[tweedledee]

I've a question for anyone who argues against legalizing/decriminalizing pot due to concerns with impaired driving: are you also demanding booze be made illegal?

It seem the only reason Canada is being dragged down morally concerning SSM, marijuana, attack on Christian beliefs and other liberal amenities is because of Liberal immature policies.

How is marijuana a moral issue?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It isn't, but I'm with Harper on this one, I've seen first hand what pot can lead to.

[GreenWhiteandPink]

It isn't, but I'm with Harper on this one, I've seen first hand what pot can lead to

What have you seen? It's the old gateway drug myth.

I believe that weed is the least harmfull of any recreational drug, alcohol included.

[Black Dog]

It isn't, but I'm with Harper on this one, I've seen first hand what pot can lead to.

What? Intemperate snacking? Bad TV viewing choices? "Harold and Kumar Go To White Castle"?

Here's the thing about Harper's proposal: it won't do a goddamn thing to harm the drug trade. Look at the United States' drug policy: highest incrcaration rate in the world, with more than half of all prisoners incarcerated for drug offenses. A big part of that is due to the adoption of mandatory minimum sentences. Yet has that made drugs any harder to get or resulted in a significant decrease in drug use? No.

So why is Harper willing to make a bad drug strategy even worse?

[Slavik44]

I've a question for anyone who argues against legalizing/decriminalizing pot due to concerns with impaired driving: are you also demanding booze be made illegal?

It seem the only reason Canada is being dragged down morally concerning SSM, marijuana, attack on Christian beliefs and other liberal amenities is because of Liberal immature policies.

How is marijuana a moral issue?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It isn't, but I'm with Harper on this one, I've seen first hand what pot can lead to.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Have you seen what a needless criminal record WILL do to a person?