August1991 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 .... but more important, I appreciate this American argument ==== Robert de Niro is ashamed of his country? WTF? America is the country of disagreement. De Niro, Hollywood, Leftists - Michelle Obama - should be proud of America. It is the country/society of dissension. China (5000 yrs), Russia (1000 yrs) claim to have survived because of dictator/authoritarian regimes. Americans (250 yrs) argue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 1 minute ago, August1991 said: WTF? America is the country of disagreement. De Niro, Hollywood, Leftists - Michelle Obama - should be proud of America. It is the country/society of dissension. They can never be proud of America, because to do so would undermine their entire base and platform of permanent victimhood. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 21 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: They can never be proud of America, because to do so would undermine their entire base and platform of permanent victimhood. b_c, you miss the point: America is the new kid on the block. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 26 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: They can never be proud of America, because to do so would undermine their entire base and platform of permanent victimhood. I haven't watched a Robert De Niro movie since 2016 when he said he didn't want folks like me watching them. Easy enough...Casino was good. But, you know...seen it. Edited October 18, 2020 by DogOnPorch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, August1991 said: b_c, you miss the point: America is the new kid on the block. Not any more....China wants to be the newest kid on the block...even after 5,000 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Not any more....China wants to be the newest kid on the block...even after 5,000 years. Sorry, you're wrong. 250 years American history. 6000 years Chinese history. If I were American, I'd say that the American wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, August1991 said: Sorry, you're wrong. Sorry...has nothing to do with being right or wrong. That's not how this game is played...and China plays for the long haul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: .... That's not how this game is played...and China plays for the long haul. And your Founders played for the long haul too. They wrote a document that has survived many State documents in Chinese or Russian, more typically in French, from the 18th century. What Russian or Chinese lawyer refers to a document from the 18th century? America is sustainable. ==== America and its Constitution is remarkable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, August1991 said: America and its Constitution is remarkable. China has been remarkable for far longer...for its own purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said: China has been remarkable for far longer...for its own purpose. B_C, let me make my point plain, to you, and foreigners. When you guys wrote your Constitution in the 18th century, no one knew what would work, what would be sustainable. At best, they could see that Switzerland had a confederation. The Netherlands had a republic. England had a Parliament. They looked at Rome, 2000 years before. Lincoln's words are true: your Constitution is a test of whether people can create such a society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, August1991 said: Lincoln's words are true: your Constitution is a test of whether people can create such a society. That's fine, but China has created another society. America plays Monopoly®....China plays Go. Edited October 18, 2020 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: That's fine, but China has created another society. America plays Monopoly®....China plays Go. A: Russia adopted Christianity then survived the Mongols. The French/Germans invaded, Russians are still Russian B: For 5000 years, people in China speak Chinese. ===== As I say, as a foreigner, you miss the point C. The guys who wrote your Constitution were thinking future, truly long haul. Edited October 18, 2020 by August1991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 1 minute ago, August1991 said: As I say, as a foreigner, you miss the point C. The guys who wrote your Constitution were thinking long haul. Quite to the contrary...they were thinking very short term survival against the power of Great Britian while keeping 13 colonies united. This meant slavery was part of the deal...short term. Religion in government too...short term. Romantically embracing the U.S. founders and their natural rights Constitution does not eclipse the reality of China today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 40 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Quite to the contrary...they were thinking very short term survival against the power of Great Britian while keeping 13 colonies united. This meant slavery was part of the deal...short term. Religion in government too...short term. Romantically embracing the U.S. founders and their natural rights Constitution does not eclipse the reality of China today. Language, religion, ethnicity define Russia and China. The individual defines America. ==== The people who wrote the US Constitution knew this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CampMassad Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 5 hours ago, August1991 said: .... but more important, I appreciate this American argument ==== Robert de Niro is ashamed of his country? WTF? America is the country of disagreement. De Niro, Hollywood, Leftists - Michelle Obama - should be proud of America. It is the country/society of dissension. China (5000 yrs), Russia (1000 yrs) claim to have survived because of dictator/authoritarian regimes. Americans (250 yrs) argue. You must be from a 3rd World country then. Nearly everyone in Canada, Europe, and other Democratic nations can see that Trump is nothing but a bully and liar. He is typical of a South American dictator, but the only problem is that he is now the leader of the most powerful nation on Earth. If Trump and the GOP win big on November 3, the USA is headed for total fascism. Canada will feel like Austria in 1938. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CampMassad Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) For nearly destroying the American Empire, Trump and his cohorts should pay the ultimate price: their lives. This is no joke. It's time the GOP does what is best for America, and puts partisan politics aside. Once Trump is defeated, and unceremoniously booted from office, America should invoke Article III, Section 3 of the United States Constitution. Donald Trump and other should face the ultimate punishment for their acts of treason: Death. Off the top of my head, I think there is enough evidence to indict: Donald Trump Rudy Giuliani Steve Bannon Donald Trump Jr Eric Trump Mitch McConnell America can even have a Nuremberg style trail, broadcast live on TV. The Trump crime syndicate has collaborated with foreign Governments, and compromised United States intelligence, in order to discredit political opponents. Edited October 18, 2020 by CampMassad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 6 hours ago, CampMassad said: For nearly destroying the American Empire, Trump and his cohorts should pay the ultimate price: their lives. This is no joke. It's time the GOP does what is best for America, and puts partisan politics aside. Once Trump is defeated, and unceremoniously booted from office, America should invoke Article III, Section 3 of the United States Constitution. Donald Trump and other should face the ultimate punishment for their acts of treason: Death. Off the top of my head, I think there is enough evidence to indict: There is no American Empire so your violent plan is a non-starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CampMassad Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 Just now, bush_cheney2004 said: There is no American Empire so your violent plan is a non-starter. I assume you are joking. America is the World's superpower, and unofficially have always been an empire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 1 minute ago, CampMassad said: I assume you are joking. America is the World's superpower, and unofficially have always been an empire. Nonsense...the American "empire" is economic and rose after the fall of Canada's previous favourite empire, Great Britain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CampMassad Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Nonsense...the American "empire" is economic and rose after the fall of Canada's previous favourite empire, Great Britain. The American empire is similar to many empires before it. With the exception of Cuba, any country in their sphere of influence, that tried to install a socialist Government quickly found itself at odds with the United States. The US has invaded many countries in the fight against Communism, and terror. They have also propped up many totalitarian dictatorships in South and Central America. Edited October 18, 2020 by CampMassad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, CampMassad said: The American empire is similar to many empires before it. With the exception of Cuba, any country in their sphere of influence, that tried to install a socialist Government quickly found itself at odds with the United States. The US has invaded many countries in the fight against Communism, and terror. They have also propped up many totalitarian dictatorships in South and Central America. Canada has done the same in the name of British imperialism, NATO, R2P, and "peacekeeping", but that doesn't mean it has an "empire". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CampMassad Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said: Canada has done the same in the name of British imperialism, NATO, R2P, and "peacekeeping", but that doesn't mean it has an "empire". Incorrect. Canada has never gone in alone, or conducted military intervention in order to prop up a dictatorship in the Americas. In fact, after WW2, the conflicts Canada became involved in, only Operation Stands out as a mistake. We refused to get involved in Vietnam thankfully, and also Iraq in 2003, as the United States failed to convince the UN the country had weapons of mass destruction. Afghanistan was a just war, as America was attacked, and the Taliban were allowing Al Qaeda to take refuge in the country. We also have been peacekeepers in numerous conflicts around the World. We are highly respected Worldwide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, CampMassad said: Incorrect. Canada has never gone in alone, or conducted military intervention in order to prop up a dictatorship in the Americas. Canada sponsored and solicited French and American support to overthrow the democratically elected president of Haiti (Aristide) in 2004. https://www.policyalternatives.ca/publications/monitor/very-canadian-coup Canada was also a tool for British imperialism, and provided the reserve model for apartheid in South Africa. Edited October 18, 2020 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted November 2, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2020 On 10/18/2020 at 4:11 AM, CampMassad said: You must be from a 3rd World country then. Nearly everyone in Canada, Europe, and other Democratic nations can see that Trump is nothing but a bully and liar.... All politicians are bullies, liars. psychopaths.... more or less... The guys who wrote the US Constitution more or less knew this. Trump, LBJ, FDR, Nixon, Clinton. Same diff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted November 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2020 Compare China or Russia today with America: China? Xi has no claim to legitimacy except Mao and Deng. Maybe he can claim the Mandarin language. Putin? The Soviet Union, the Russian language. Yeltsin could say honestly that he was the first President of Russia. What is Putin? "The second Russian president? Gimme a break." ===== The claim of Xi and Putin to power is based on free market capitalism. Xi and Putin are rich because their countries rejected socialism and adopted free market principles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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