marcus Posted July 25, 2019 Report Share Posted July 25, 2019 Have a look at the fear in their eyes, when they answer questions. This video poetically ends off with Richard Perle answering the question: "Should a politician stop supporting Israel, what would be the effect?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 On 7/25/2019 at 2:48 AM, marcus said: Have a look at the fear in their eyes, when they answer questions. This video poetically ends off with Richard Perle answering the question: "Should a politician stop supporting Israel, what would be the effect?" That video is a piece of hateful, incendiary garbage because of how completely devoid it is of context. There's no mention of the massive scale of the problems that Israel faces, as well as the massive human tragedy that would take place if Israel's enemies from within and outside of their borders ever got the upper hand. You could just as easily describe America's army in WWII as a huge killing machine if you made no mention of the fact that Hitler started the war and murdered millions of people and forced them into slavery, don't mention Pearl Harbour, and then just talk about how the American military machine just went after Germany and Japan. Can we talk about how many people they killed? Seems pretty un-democratic all of a sudden, doesn't it? I'll engage you in a debate about the 'non-democratic tendencies' of Israel if you do a realistic comparison of Israel and Pakistan; a country that was formed almost exactly in the same way at almost the exact same time. You tell me all about the formation of Pakistan, the religious history and the history of genocides in that area, the number of people killed at Pakistan's formation, their use of mass systemic rape as a tool of ethic cleansing/forced conversion, the current penalty there for preaching non-islamic faiths, etc. Let's compare your notes on Pakistan, a country which I've never seen you complain about, and Israel, a country which you constantly vilify. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 The USA would save billions by not giving aid to Israel. Maybe the USA can throw that money back into healthcare. I find it really odd that many US politicians makes Israel a priority over their own citizens. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 1 minute ago, GostHacked said: The USA would save billions by not giving aid to Israel. Maybe the USA can throw that money back into healthcare. I find it really odd that many US politicians makes Israel a priority over their own citizens. Why does Israel get billions from the USA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 41 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Why does Israel get billions from the USA? If they didn't then they would be massacred. It would be an all-out slaughter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, WestCanMan said: That video is a piece of hateful, incendiary garbage because of how completely devoid it is of context. There's no mention of the massive scale of the problems that Israel faces, as well as the massive human tragedy that would take place if Israel's enemies from within and outside of their borders ever got the upper hand. You could just as easily describe America's army in WWII as a huge killing machine if you made no mention of the fact that Hitler started the war and murdered millions of people and forced them into slavery, don't mention Pearl Harbour, and then just talk about how the American military machine just went after Germany and Japan. Can we talk about how many people they killed? Seems pretty un-democratic all of a sudden, doesn't it? I'll engage you in a debate about the 'non-democratic tendencies' of Israel if you do a realistic comparison of Israel and Pakistan; a country that was formed almost exactly in the same way at almost the exact same time. You tell me all about the formation of Pakistan, the religious history and the history of genocides in that area, the number of people killed at Pakistan's formation, their use of mass systemic rape as a tool of ethic cleansing/forced conversion, the current penalty there for preaching non-islamic faiths, etc. Let's compare your notes on Pakistan, a country which I've never seen you complain about, and Israel, a country which you constantly vilify. Actually try Iran. He is a not so subtle Iranian devotee. As for looking in peoples' eyes, that about sums up how absurd this thread is. Edited August 13, 2019 by Rue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, GostHacked said: The USA would save billions by not giving aid to Israel. Maybe the USA can throw that money back into healthcare. I find it really odd that many US politicians makes Israel a priority over their own citizens. If you are going to repeat that bullshit canard back it up. What billions of dollars of aid. Provide your sources. In fact your canard has been proven again and again to be misleading. Israel receives military aid not foreign aid: https://theconversation.com/us-foreign-aid-explained-74810 Your comment does not reflect the difference.Military aid to Israel allows the US to co- develop military weapons or other technology it then can sell to other nations and your blanket statement does not explain then how that military aid actually helps generate new income for the US as a benefit of that alliance. You of course would like to promote this canard that Israel simply sucks the US tit and thr US is an idiot controlled by Israel. Here is an apolitical explanation of how the US benefits from foreign aid. American businesses unlike you are not blinded by any Jewish brainwashing but by economic investment principles: https://www.gatesnotes.com/Development/Foreign-Aid-Helps-Americas-Economy Here is a US State department site explaining what aid goes where and it would be nicei if you had the intellectual honesty to differentiate military aid from foreign aid assistance. https://www.foreignassistance.gov/explore By the way every one of our damn consumer products come out of spin off from the US military industrial complex so if you want let's shut it down. You might want to then look at the no. of patents that come out of Israel because of the US Israel economic alliance and the direct benefits to your lifestyle when you paste up the usual Israel crap on this or any thread. This thread is just a pretense for another Marcus anti Israel diatribe with no balanced discussion on global economics and relationships. Ask Marcus why instead of funding terrorism around the world and particularly in the Middle East, Iran does not take its money and build an infrastructure for all Muslim nations in the Middle East. It has zero excuses other than its theocracy hates Sunnis, Shiites, Bahaiis, Zoroastreans, Kurds, Yazidi, Jews, Christians and prefers instead to fight a Muslim on Muslim war with Saudi Arabia equally to blame. Using Israel as an excuse to detract from the bigoted hatreful ideologies of Shiite and Sunni governments fighting each other and their lack of economic planning and rampant corruption is a spent script. Just look in the eyes of the Ayatollah or yourself. Your pro Iranian bias is what fuels your response. Get back to me when you want to attempt a balanced discussion. https://theconversation.com/us-foreign-aid-explained-74810 Edited August 13, 2019 by Rue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 1 hour ago, WestCanMan said: If they didn't then they would be massacred. It would be an all-out slaughter. There's a specific event that is tied to Israel receiving US funding (as well as the Arabs which GH conveniently omits). I'm asking what event this was...and I suppose why GH wants to cut-off Israel but not the Arabs involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 2 hours ago, Rue said: Actually try Iran. He is a not so subtle Iranian devotee. As for looking in peoples' eyes, that about sums up how absurd this thread is. I always bring up Pakistan because the main claim against Israel is that 'the Israelis are just evil oppressors who are squatting on land that should belong to the Palestinians who have been sitting in refugee camps for 70 years'. Muslims hate the comparison because it's the exact same thing, just with muslims as the beneficiaries of a new sovereign state and Hindus and Sikhs as the victims. The only difference is the mass killings, millions of them, and the systemic rape inflicted by the Pakistanis on anyone who wasn't muslim. The people who would have been sitting in refugee camps are all dead or they fled the area decades ago. The Israelis have been extremely kind to the Palestinians compared to the way that the Pakistanis dealt with the Hindus and Sikhs there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 5 hours ago, Rue said: If you are going to repeat that bullshit canard back it up. What billions of dollars of aid. Provide your sources. https://fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL33222.pdf Quote This report provides an overview of U.S. foreign assistance to Israel. It includes a review of past aid programs, data on annual assistance, and analysis of current issues. For general information on Israel, see Israel: Background and U.S. Relations in Brief, by Jim Zanotti. Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of U.S. foreign assistance since World War II. To date, the United States has provided Israel $142.3 billion (current, or noninflation-adjusted, dollars) in bilateral assistance and missile defense funding.Almost all U.S. bilateral aid to Israel is in the form of military assistance, although from 1971 to 2007Israel also received significant economic assistance. In 2016, the U.S. and Israeli governments signed a new 10-year Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) on military aid, covering FY2019 to FY2028. Under the terms of the MOU, the United States pledges to provide $38 billion in military aid ($33 billion in Foreign Military Financing grants plus $5billion in missile defense appropriations) to Israel. This MOU replaced a previous $30 billion 10-year agreement, which ran through FY2018 .Israel is the first international operator of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, the Department of Defense’s fifth-generation stealth aircraft,considered to be the most technologically advanced fighter jet ever made. To date, Israel has purchased 50 F-35s in three separate contracts. But tell me why the USA needs to support their military? Israel cannot stand on their own? No they cannot. 5 hours ago, Rue said: In fact your canard has been proven again and again to be misleading. Israel receives military aid not foreign aid: What is the difference to the USA? Aid to a foreign nation, no matter the form of aid .. is still aid. Also the thing above I posted says you are incorrect. 5 hours ago, Rue said: Just look in the eyes of the Ayatollah or yourself. Your pro Iranian bias is what fuels your response. Get back to me when you want to attempt a balanced discussion I am pro Iranian? First time I hear of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 https://www.wrmea.org/congress-u.s.-aid-to-israel/u.s.-financial-aid-to-israel-figures-facts-and-impact.html Quote In addition, there is the more than $1.5 billion in private U.S. funds that go to Israel annually in the form of $1 billion in private tax-deductible donations and $500 million in Israeli bonds. The ability of Americans to make what amounts to tax-deductible contributions to a foreign government, made possible through a number of Jewish charities, does not exist with any other country. Nor do these figures include short- and long-term commercial loans from U.S. banks, which have been as high as $1 billion annually in recent years. Total U.S. aid to Israel is approximately one-third of the American foreign-aid budget, even though Israel comprises just .001 percent of the world's population and already has one of the world's higher per capita incomes. Indeed, Israel's GNP is higher than the combined GNP of Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, the West Bank and Gaza. With a per capita income of about $14,000, Israel ranks as the sixteenth wealthiest country in the world; Israelis enjoy a higher per capita income than oil-rich Saudi Arabia and are only slightly less well-off than most Western European countries. The numbers don't lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 14 minutes ago, GostHacked said: https://www.wrmea.org/congress-u.s.-aid-to-israel/u.s.-financial-aid-to-israel-figures-facts-and-impact.html The numbers don't lie. LOL...the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs, eh? About as biased as they get re: anti-Israel. Anyways, your Arab chums got the same deal as Israel at Camp David under Jimmy Carter...or did you think the Egyptian/Jordanians/Saudis/etc found their US military equipment in a cabbage patch? Egyptian F-16s...made in the USA 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted August 13, 2019 Report Share Posted August 13, 2019 1 hour ago, DogOnPorch said: LOL...the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs, eh? About as biased as they get re: anti-Israel. Interesting that the FAS article and the one you hate show the same information. Your slip is showing. Fine lets use a different source to show the same info. https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/senate-passes-bill-to-enshrine-military-aid-package-to-israel-into-law-1.6340748 Quote The American Israel Public Affairs Committee in a statement said the act “seeks to ensure that Israel has the means to defend itself, by itself, against growing and emerging threats — including Iran’s presence close to Israel’s northern border.” Israel is lobbying the United States and Russia to oust Iran from Syria, where it has assisted the Assad regime in crushing a civil war. The act also expands a stockpile of weapons that the United States keeps in Israel. Israel may access the stockpile in wartime. It also urges space research cooperation between Israel and the United States. A version of the bill, which has bipartisan backing, is under consideration in the U.S. House of Representatives. AIPAC urged its advance and passage. Also approved by the Senate this week, after having garnered House approval, is the $639 billion National Defense Authorization Act. AIPAC praised the act for including $500 million for U.S.-Israel missile defense cooperation and up to $50 million for U.S.-Israel cooperation to detect enemy tunnels into Israel. The National Defense Authorization Act has passed both chambers and now goes to President Donald Trump for his signature. The AIPAC lobby is very strong in the USA. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-israel-defense/key-u-s-lawmakers-want-to-boost-israels-38-billion-defense-aid-package-idUSKCN1GB2NQ Quote WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. senators who just returned from a trip to Israel called on Tuesday for an increase in the $38 billion in military aid the United States is currently providing Israel, signaling support for more funds for Israeli missile systems. Senators Lindsey Graham, a leading Republican foreign policy voice, and Chris Coons, a Democratic member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, said they considered the provision of $38 billion over 10 years, “a floor.” ----- The United States and Israel signed an agreement in September 2016 to give Israel $38 billion in military assistance over the next decade, the largest such aid package in U.S. history but one that included concessions by Israel’s government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 2 hours ago, GostHacked said: Interesting that the FAS article and the one you hate show the same information. Your slip is showing. Fine lets use a different source to show the same info. https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/senate-passes-bill-to-enshrine-military-aid-package-to-israel-into-law-1.6340748 The AIPAC lobby is very strong in the USA. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-israel-defense/key-u-s-lawmakers-want-to-boost-israels-38-billion-defense-aid-package-idUSKCN1GB2NQ I'm not doubting that Israel gets money via the results of Camp David. What you don't seem to understand is that ALL countries that signed on got the benefits. Not just Israel. Only two of the main participants of the Arab-Israeli Wars HAVEN'T signed onto this peace treaty...which has held since its signing...that would be Syria and the PLO/PA. Your buds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J4L Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 On 8/13/2019 at 8:35 AM, DogOnPorch said: Why does Israel get billions from the USA? Religion. Attend any US Evangelical Church on any given Sunday, and you will understand why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 1 hour ago, J4L said: Religion. Attend any US Evangelical Church on any given Sunday, and you will understand why. Nope...an event/signing called the Camp David Accords in the late 1970s. Other peace treaties grew from this framework started by Carter/Sadat/Began/Meir. Sadat's famous flight to Israel for peace... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J4L Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 (edited) It's religion dude. In terms of human nature, religion overrides politics 100% of the time. Edited August 14, 2019 by J4L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 None of the anti-Israel crowd want to touch on the Pakistan topic. Not even one. They scurry like friggin cockroaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, J4L said: It's religion dude. In terms of human nature, religion Trump's politics 100% of the time. You're entitled to your own opinion...but not your own facts. Israel gets its US bucks from signing a peace treaty with the Arabs. The Arabs who signed got similar benefits for choosing peace over war. The PLO and Syria decided war was the answer. No Camp David bucks for them...though the PLO gets millions from other pro-terrorism sources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 2 hours ago, WestCanMan said: None of the anti-Israel crowd want to touch on the Pakistan topic. Not even one. They scurry like friggin cockroaches. Can always make another thread that deals with that specific topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J4L Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, DogOnPorch said: You're entitled to your own opinion...but not your own facts. Israel gets its US bucks from signing a peace treaty with the Arabs. The Arabs who signed got similar benefits for choosing peace over war. The PLO and Syria decided war was the answer. No Camp David bucks for them...though the PLO gets millions from other pro-terrorism sources. Dude. You have no understanding of human nature or the Christian New Testament for that matter. I beg you to go to a Evangelical Church of your choosing any given Sunday. BTW, Americans are far more religious than Canadians. You just do not seem to comprehend the reality of the situation or history for that matter. Politics mean jack shit to these people when nearly half of the American public believes the only way Jesus Christ will be resurrected will be for the Children of Israel (Jews) to return and live in the Holy Land. I cannot believe you are not comprehending the significance of this. BTW, why don't you trace the donations to the Republican Party, and who their largest financial backer is. I'll give you a hint. Check where they are Sunday evenings. Edited August 14, 2019 by J4L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCanMan Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 2 hours ago, GostHacked said: Can always make another thread that deals with that specific topic. No need. It’s on-point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 36 minutes ago, WestCanMan said: No need. It’s on-point. Incorrect, technically it's off topic. That's how threads work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 58 minutes ago, J4L said: Dude. You have no understanding of human nature or the Christian New Testament for that matter. I beg you to go to a Evangelical Church of your choosing any given Sunday. BTW, Americans are far more religious than Canadians. You just do not seem to comprehend the reality of the situation or history for that matter. Politics mean jack shit to these people when nearly half of the American public believes the only way Jesus Christ will be resurrected will be for the Children of Israel (Jews) to return and live in the Holy Land. I cannot believe you are not comprehending the significance of this. BTW, why don't you trace the donations to the Republican Party, and who their largest financial backer is. I'll give you a hint. Check where they are Sunday evenings. Learn for God's sake. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_David_Accords Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J4L Posted August 14, 2019 Report Share Posted August 14, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said: Learn for God's sake. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_David_Accords Do you have reading comprehension problems?. RELIGION OVERRIDES POLITICS. Try spewing that nonsense at any American synagogue or church. American foreign policy has always been shaped by it's wealthiest citizens, which happen to be of the Christians and Jews. Edited August 14, 2019 by J4L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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