Technology: Time, Networks, Honesty & Reputation

[August1991]

Long ago, I thought that advances in technology saved people time doing things.

Then later, I thought that new technology was all about networks - people connecting to one another.

More recently, I have been thinking that advances in technology are largely about honesty and reputation. (The Internet is a remarkable method to determine reputation..) 

(IMV, advances in mathematics are dependent on the occasional genius.)

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From fusion to climate, what is "technology"?

Edited December 13, 2016 by August1991
Minor

[kimmy]

2 hours ago, August1991 said:

what is "technology"?

Is there something wrong with the dictionary definition?  A technology is a method of doing something... from the first time a human used a rock to grind grain into a more edible form, to the latest advances in integrated circuit manufacturing, it's all still about finding better ways to do things. Applied mathematics is a technology that allows us to quantify, model, and analyze. Newton invented calculus because he needed better tools to solve the problems he was studying... other mathematicians may be interested in it from a purely theoretical standpoint, but even then their research further expands the capabilities of mathematics as a technology for solving actual problems. Nuclear theory eventually led to nuclear technology.

Ultimately, whenever people apply knowledge to solving problems, that's "technology".

3 hours ago, August1991 said:

advances in technology saved people time doing things.

yes.

3 hours ago, August1991 said:

new technology was all about networks - people connecting to one another.

Technology is about solving problems, and the problem of how to connect people to one another is one of the most fundamental problems in human history. Whether it be using ravens to deliver notes or smoke signals or the invention of the telegraph and the radio or the latest social networking website, finding better or at least new ways to communicate is one of the most fundamental human needs and therefore one of the most fundamental applications of technology.* In particular, finding new and better ways of connecting buyers and sellers is an area of technology that has obviously huge economic importance.  I was thinking the other day that the arrival of eBay was perhaps a milestone the history of commerce.  Perhaps Amazon as well... although, not from the outset, but at some point they evolved from Online Book Retailer to international retail platform. Currently I think sites like AliExpress and similar are breaking new ground... regular suckers like you and me can now get directly in contact with the dodgiest manufacturers in China.

By the way, August, as I write this message I can simply highlight portions of your previous post and then click the "Quote This" pop-up that appears in my browser. The new forum software is great!  For purposes of this thread... it is an advance in communications technology!

3 hours ago, August1991 said:

advances in technology are largely about honesty and reputation. (The Internet is a remarkable method to determine reputation..) 

When I first read this, my initial reaction was spontaneous out-loud laughter.  I think the Internet has proven itself to be the most technologically sophisticated means of distributing utter bullshit in the history of our species. Goebbels is probably jizzing in his grave at the possibilities of what he could have done if he had the internet at his disposal. I think the current #PizzaGate fiasco demonstrates everything that need be said about the Internet as far as "honesty" is concerned.

However, I do agree that this is an area of technology of ever-increasing importance. Honesty and reputation... how to ensure your online credentials with your bank, how to protect yourself from identity fraud, how to ensure that you're buying real products from real suppliers when you purchase things online. This sort of thing.

* other fundamental applications of technology:  healthcare, food production, energy production, transportation, shelter and comfort.

 -k

[Michael Hardner]

McLuhan wrote the seminal book on this - "Understanding Media".  He explained, among other things, that technology is the extension of human faculties.  He also explained that humans are as unaware of the changes in our cultural sphere from technology as fish are unaware of water.  That's why he preferred probing discussion on the effects, on stimulating discussion rather than handing down edicts.

Social interaction technology is built on web technology, is built on web technology, is built on internet technology, is built on network and computer technology, is built on electronics technology, is built on the technology of electronics, the telegraph and faster-than-light communication.  Also embedded in there is the technology of movable type, of television, of language itself.

It's a vast topic and the answers are as difficult as the changes and problems are pervasive.  A factory worker laid off in Iowa and a cat picture on facebook are effects of the same root phenomenon.  We are powerless to prevent it, but we can and will adapt and discussion will help IMO.

[?Impact]

45 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

the technology of movable type, of television, of language itself

When we closed down analog television, all the capture, storage, and display technology unique to that medium was discarded. Todays video broadcasts still rely heavily on radio technology for prorogation, but the encoding of the moving picture and sound have absolutely nothing to do with what was developed for the television industry. The only significant technology development for television that made its way into the digital market was the helical scan used for videotape which made its way into some data storage tape, but may not last that much longer because most of the industry is linear serpentine and the helical scan niche is disappearing.

What did remain from the television industry was the writing, producing, financing, marketing, and sale of content. Do we call that 'technology', or is it 'culture' or more appropriate 'business' or 'industry'? The rather broad definition of technology that kimmy gave as "a method of doing something" of course would include all of that. I tend to think of technology as more of the tools. For example in banking, I see the technology as how I record transactions and current balance for an account (e.g. a paper ledger or a computer program and storage), and not the fact that I record it. 

[Michael Hardner]

Great point, I would also include that.  Methodology and technology are bound together in interesting ways.  Language itself is a technology.

[eyeball]

6 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

McLuhan wrote the seminal book on this - "Understanding Media".  He explained, among other things, that technology is the extension of human faculties.  He also explained that humans are as unaware of the changes in our cultural sphere from technology as fish are unaware of water.

Didn't have much faith in the faculties of people or fish did he?  Take a fish out of water and you'll see just how aware of it they really are.

[August1991]

On 12/13/2016 at 4:56 AM, kimmy said:

When I first read this, my initial reaction was spontaneous out-loud laughter.  I think the Internet has proven itself to be the most technologically sophisticated means of distributing utter bullshit in the history of our species.

 -k

When I first read this, I initially thought: "I think she's got it."

But then, unlike Shaw, I wondered....

Edited December 17, 2016 by August1991

[Michael Hardner]

Quote

advances in technology are largely about honesty and reputation.

I read this again and have a new appreciation for this statement.  What you have discovered is a truism of technology and communication: it reorganizes our senses and makes us rebuild our natural network of trusted entities.  Similarly, it makes us drop our guard for some reason.

Examples include the phishing email scams targeted at seniors, memes, fake news...

McLuhan wrote about a similar example when radio was introduced to the Bedouins and erstwhile-conservative elder tribespeople were beguiled by bawdy stories coming from the new device.

[August1991]

On 12/17/2016 at 10:31 AM, Michael Hardner said:

McLuhan wrote about a similar example when radio was introduced to the Bedouins and erstwhile-conservative elder tribespeople were beguiled by bawdy stories coming from the new device.

Any more than a character in a Woody Allen movie, I can't speak for Marshall McLuhan. But when Kimmy argued that the Internet is the most sophisticated method to pretend to be other than what one is  ("distributing utter bullshit" - in Kimmy words), I had to respond.

Internet? Some 60 million years ago, certainly since dinosaurs, feathers can signal other than what one is - bullshit, as the kids say .

Edited December 19, 2016 by August1991

[Michael Hardner]

The most sophisticated thing in the known universe is the human brain, so arguably... fake news IS more complicated than feathers !

(Could this be the weirdest argument ever tried on MLW ?)