Netanyahu: It was Mufti of Jerusalem who convinced Hitler to kill Jews

[DogOnPorch]

As for the Mufti pushing Hitler to deal with the Jews pouring out of Europe...did you read the first set of minutes??

Summary:

Mufti: Do something.

Hitler: I'd love to but the African Campaign isn't complete.

Mufti: Well, do something when it's complete.

Hitler: Sounds like a plan...

[Rue]

What Netanyahu said is public record. At this point Marcus you fabricate issues he never raised. Anyone can read what he originally stated and what he then clarified. I posted what he said. You ignore both and have gone off on an imagined rant about issues he has never raised and call then call all Zionists liars with your Zionist lies chant which again shows your agenda is to come on this board and try and incite negativity about Zionists which has nothing to do with this thread.

Your attempt to name call Zionists and use this thread as a platform to do so once again renders your comments lacking in any credibility.

You posing as an expert on the holocaust also speaks loudly.

Your using words like Zionist liar speak loudly. You come on this forum to engage in name calling. In my opinion that is trolling.

Edited November 6, 2015 by Rue

[marcus]

What Netanyahu said is public record.

It's not public record. You are, once again, spreading misinformation.

Let me know where you can find the following conversation (that Bibi said took place) in public record - You won't, because they never had such a conversation.:

Hitler didn’t want to exterminate the Jews at the time, he wanted to expel the Jews. And Haj Amin al-Husseini went to Hitler and said, “If you expel them, they’ll all come here.” “So what should I do with them?” he asked. He said, “Burn them.”

DogOnPorch: The mass killings started before the meeting between the Mufti and Hitler. I want you to find one credible historian that says otherwise.

Mass killings of Jews became commonplace following the Nazi invasion of the Soviet Union on June 22, 1941. Death squads called Einsatzgruppen, formed at the order of Reinhard Heydrich, director of the Reich Main Security Office at the time, were tasked with murdering Jewish civilians and Communist Party officials with the help of local citizens.

Link

[GostHacked]

Here is Netanyahu saying exactly what has been correctly quoted by marcus.

[DogOnPorch]

It's not public record. You are, once again, spreading misinformation.

Let me know where you can find the following conversation (that Bibi said took place) in public record - You won't, because they never had such a conversation.:

Hitler didn’t want to exterminate the Jews at the time, he wanted to expel the Jews. And Haj Amin al-Husseini went to Hitler and said, “If you expel them, they’ll all come here.” “So what should I do with them?” he asked. He said, “Burn them.”

DogOnPorch: The mass killings started before the meeting between the Mufti and Hitler. I want you to find one credible historian that says otherwise.

Mass killings of Jews became commonplace following the Nazi invasion of the Soviet Union on June 22, 1941. Death squads called Einsatzgruppen, formed at the order of Reinhard Heydrich, director of the Reich Main Security Office at the time, were tasked with murdering Jewish civilians and Communist Party officials with the help of local citizens.

Link

My previous post:

Before January 1942, the Holocaust was a patchwork of extremes...ranging from deportation to an encounter with the Einsatzgruppen if you were an unlucky Russian/Ukrainian Jew.

Do you even read posts?

[marcus]

Do you even read posts?

I do and I keep seeing you and other Bibi apologists continue to cover for Netanyahu's lies.

1) The conversation Bibi said the Mufti and Hitler had, never happened. Not according to any public record or any historian.

2) The Nazis started killing Jews before the Mufti met Hitler.

3) Zionists were the pioneers of terrorism in the Middle East

4) Two of the leaders of the terrorist groups, became Israeli prime ministers

[DogOnPorch]

I do and I keep seeing you and other Bibi apologists continue to cover for Netanyahu's lies.

1) The conversation Bibi said the Mufti and Hitler had, never happened. Not according to any public record or any historian.

2) The Nazis started killing Jews before the Mufti met Hitler.

3) Zionists were the pioneers of terrorism in the Middle East

4) Two of the leaders of the terrorist groups, became Israeli prime ministers

So the Wannsee Conference never happened?

[marcus]

So the Wannsee Conference never happened?

This happened:

1) The conversation Bibi said the Mufti and Hitler had, never happened. Not according to any public record or any historian.

2) The Nazis started killing Jews before the Mufti met Hitler.

3) Zionists were the pioneers of terrorism in the Middle East

4) Two of the leaders of the terrorist groups, became Israeli prime ministers

[DogOnPorch]

This happened:

1) The conversation Bibi said the Mufti and Hitler had, never happened. Not according to any public record or any historian.

2) The Nazis started killing Jews before the Mufti met Hitler.

3) Zionists were the pioneers of terrorism in the Middle East

4) Two of the leaders of the terrorist groups, became Israeli prime ministers

What was the purpose of the Wannsee Conference?

[marcus]

What was the purpose of the Wannsee Conference?

The purpose was not to have Bibi make things up. Things like a conversation where Hitler was convinced by the Mufti to kill the Jews, instead of expelling them. Not only did such a conversation never happened, but the killings had already started.

Are you trying to argue otherwise?

[DogOnPorch]

The purpose was not to have Bibi make things up. Things like a conversation where Hitler was convinced by the Mufti to kill the Jews, instead of expelling them. Not only did such a conversation never happened, but the killings had already started.

Are you trying to argue otherwise?

What was the purpose of the Wannsee Conference?

[marcus]

What was the purpose of the Wannsee Conference?

I don't have the time to dance around the topic with you. You don't get to change the topic of this thread.

Unless you can show otherwise, then it stands that:

The conversation Bibi said the Mufti and Hitler had, never happened. Not according to any public record or any historian. Therefore, Bibi lied when he said:

Hitler didn’t want to exterminate the Jews at the time, he wanted to expel the Jews. And Haj Amin al-Husseini went to Hitler and said, “If you expel them, they’ll all come here.” “So what should I do with them?” he asked. He said, “Burn them.”

Edited November 9, 2015 by marcus

[eyeball]

What was the purpose of the Wannsee Conference?

To institute the Final Solution. No one is arguing otherwise unless its to read more into what happened. Edited November 9, 2015 by eyeball

[DogOnPorch]

I don't have the time to dance around the topic with you. You don't get to change the topic of this thread.

Unless you can show otherwise, then it stands that:

The conversation Bibi said the Mufti and Hitler had, never happened. Not according to any public record or any historian. Therefore, Bibi lied when he said:

Hitler didn’t want to exterminate the Jews at the time, he wanted to expel the Jews. And Haj Amin al-Husseini went to Hitler and said, “If you expel them, they’ll all come here.” “So what should I do with them?” he asked. He said, “Burn them.”

I'm not referring to what Netanyahu said. I'm asking what the purpose of the Wannsee Conference was.

What was it?

[Rue]

Marcus for someone who does not have time to discuss the topic you keep resurrecting the thread. How is it you have time to keep responding but only lack the time when someone asks you a question and you won't answer it?

Do you really think that makes you credible?

Your attempt to ignore Dog is embarrassing. You don't have the time? You certainly do, you have all the time in the world as you evidence to misrepresent the holocaust and role of the Mufti as you now insist on doing.

It is public recoird that Adolph Eichman's Deputy or Executive Assistant, Dieter Wisliceny, stated in testimony at the Nuremberg trials that and I quote,

"the Mufti's importance most not be disregarded'".

One last time, here for anyone to read is even for you a short easy to understand explanation of the role of the Mufti you now deny:

www.newenglishreview.org/blog_direct_link.cfm/blog_id/62584.

Go on Marcus tell your audience you have no time to read it.

At this point Marcus I contend you try revise history in your continuing need to call Netanyahu a liar and assert the Mufti had no role in the holocaust.

You positions I would argue rely on people's ignorance of history and hatred of Jews to perpetuate a denial of the Mufti's role.

Dieter Wisliceny stated the Muft repeatedly suggested to Ribbentrop and Himmler to exterminate the Jews. That is far more credible than your selectivity when it comes to discussing the holocaust and suddenly having no time to discuss the Wawannee conference.

You don't even have the decency to admit what the conference is about. You can't get yourself to even acknowledge the holocaust..

The Mufti' is role in calling for the use of cynide gas to kill more Jews faster, is fact. His visits to witness exterminations at concentration camps and urgings in such visits to use better methods than bullets is fact. Anyone can find it on public domain, the same internet you rely on to deny the holocaust at this point.

For you to deny the holocaust by refusing to acknowledge the Wawaneee confence and try turn deny what the Mufti's role is speaks for itself.

Even the very historians you quote, never denied the Muft's role.

The actual issue you have tried to use to call Netanyahu a liar is not over the Mufti's role during the holocaust and never was.

It was over a poor choice of words that leant to the impression that Netanyahu gave the Mufti's role a stronger influence then it may have, NOT that he had a role. You have now shown in your words on this thread you twisted the actual dispute from what it was to not discuss the extent of the Mufti's influence, but to whether he had a role-you then deny he had a role and call Netanyahu a liar for saying he had a role.. Public domain proves he did have a role.

Netanyah clarified it was not his intent to blame the holocaust decision simply on the Mufti. The issued died on that clarification. The tangent you went off on that Netanyahu inferred something was put to rest. He clarified it, it died. Not you though Marcus, back you go ignoring his clarification arguing the Mufti had no role and Netanyahu lied for saying he did.

Netanyahu did not lie. The Mufti had a role. No one, not the historians you quoted, not the Nazis, not the Palestinian pro Nazis, deny his role. Why would they? They are proud of it? To this day Hamas and Hezbollah goose step and give the Hitler salute, glorify the Mufti's role in the genocide of Jews, but here you are denying this? What you don't have time to discuss it? Lol.

The Mufti was an active cheer leader for the holocau. t How integral or important his opinion was to the Nazis no one can say.

In my opinion he was a pet monkey, a stooge.

What history does show is he was active in pushing for the use of gas and wiping out Jews in a genocide. Whether he was preaching to an already converted audience or egged it on, or even pushed the others to make the final solution decision is not the issue and never was

His role in organizing a Muslim battalion to fight the British and kill Jews in Palestine during WW@ is a fact..

The issue is and remains that there is sufficient proof to evidence beyond any doubt that the Mufti repeatedly met with Ribbentoff, Himmler, and Eichman to urge mass extermination and went on many field trips to supervise and hands on witness the exterminations discussing better ways to mass kill.

We can thank the meticulous record keeping of the Nazis for that.

Its all there on public domain-the same public domain you Marcus rely on for people not to read.

Well no worries Marcus. Jew haters and those who hat Zionists, deny the holocaust, hate Israel, could care less about history.

You are preaching to you maybe a handful of Jew haters or "Zionist" haters on this forum but who else?

You think you can tell Dog or Germans about their history? I may debate Dog on many things, but do you see him denying history s you do? Its pointless. Its fact. Why are you so afraid of what he says? Will it mean the holocaust actually happened? Lol, Mr. Abbas, the leaders f Hamas Hezbollah, Iran, that means nothing to them. Not to worry. They will still deny the holocaust and advance theories that Jews invented the holocaust to create Israel. That is precisely what the Iranian government said. That is precisely what Mr. Abbas' Ph/d thesis from Moscow University says. Not to worry.

Marcus, your denial of what the Mufti did and trying to call Netanyahu a liar is dead. You can't change history. You can try exploit the holocaust to justify your need to call Netanyahu a liar and use this thread as an excuse to advance your anti Israel agenda but it doesn't.

Your ignoring what the Wawanee conference is-won't make it go away.

Your attempt to exploit the holocaust to engage in anti Netanyahu accusations is dead.

Edited November 10, 2015 by Rue

[GostHacked]

I posted a video showing that Bibi said exactly what Marcus has quoted.

[DogOnPorch]

Rue, the main unit the Mufti raised (along with one of his assistants, SS-Gruppenfuhrer Artur Phleps) was the 13th SS Handshar division (not battalion). It operated in the Balkans and was involved solely in anti-partisan/anti-Jewish operations. He also raised auxiliary units to assist the 13th....369th...370th and a few others units in Kroatia. All Muslim divisions with German officers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/13th_Waffen_Mountain_Division_of_the_SS_Handschar_%281st_Croatian%29

But, the 13th was a problem unit. It even had a revolt during training. Some of the troopers had thrown their lot in with the French Resistance and caused some mayhem. Shooting officers, etc. But, it was also one of the largest SS unit raised with a roster of 17,000+.

As for when the killing of Jews started (by the Nazis)...it started well before WW2 kicked-off. There was Crystal Night...and it just got worse from there.

The Einsatzgruppen only operated in the lawless East...Poland and Russia. Before Wannsee, Jews in Holland, France, Scandinavia, etc weren't generally given that sort of treatment (pit shootings). Many were allowed to (or managed to) escape. The SS even had a program where Jews could leave Germany legally...after paying a HUGE fee and leaving their house and belongings to the Reich. These could be bought back from the Reich once the Jews left the country (apparently). Not sure how many...if any...benefited from this program (Haavara Agreement).

The Wannsee Conference slammed all those escape routes shut...save one. That was the route still available to Jews living in Axis Minor nations in the east...Hungary, Rumania and Bulgaria. That remained viable until 1944 as these countries were still willing to pay Turkey to take their Jews. Then, Eichmann and the Mufti put an end to that, too. This precipitated that last great act of the Holocaust...the destruction of Hungary's Jews...some half a million or so. All sent to Poland and Birkenau.

Edited November 10, 2015 by DogOnPorch

[DogOnPorch]

I posted a video showing that Bibi said exactly what Marcus has quoted.

Do you feel that since Netanyahu wasn't 100% accurate in his assessment of the Mufti that the Mufti be exonerated for his activities during World War Two?

[GostHacked]

Do you feel that since Netanyahu wasn't 100% accurate in his assessment of the Mufti that the Mufti be exonerated for his activities during World War Two?

I really don't care either way. Almost a year of absence and you come strutting back trotting out Mufti again, with more vigor than before.

[DogOnPorch]

I really don't care either way. Almost a year of absence and you come strutting back trotting out Mufti again, with more vigor than before.

BC_Chick summoned me. Looked in a mirror and said 'DogOnPorch' three times.

The Mufti's story hasn't changed and I'm still connected to this fellow via family ties....so yeah...I have an interest.

[GostHacked]

BC_Chick summoned me. Looked in a mirror and said 'DogOnPorch' three times.

The Mufti's story hasn't changed and I'm still connected to this fellow via family ties....so yeah...I have an interest.

Some people never change too. knock yourself out I'll be in another thread.

[DogOnPorch]

Some people never change too. knock yourself out I'll be in another thread.

Why would I change? You certainly haven't.

[Rue]

At least Dog you looked in the mirror. Some people can only hide. takes character to look in the mirror. I respect your words for showing that.

we might disagree but not on your blunt honesty about the holocaust.

[Rue]

I posted a video showing that Bibi said exactly what Marcus has quoted.

And-finish.....deny the Mufti had a role in urging on the extermination of Jews. Either finish it or move on. No one has denied what Netanyahu said. the denial is over what the Muftis' role is and no amount of semantics or posing on this thread will change what Dog has tried to show you.

t

[Rue]

Thank you for your efforts Dog and you hit the nail home. the fact that netanyahu used unclear words that were rightfully criticized and had to be clarified, does not change what the Mufti did and no amount of ignoring you will change that.

The ties between Hitler and the Mufti, between Hitler and the Bath Parties in Syria and Iraq, the ties between Egypt and the Nazis, its all public

domain. The ex Nazis who helped run the Syrian, Egyptian and Iraqi governments is fact. Sadat admitted it openly. Nasser and Sadat went to their death beds with Hitler mustaches. sadat even admitted he war the Hitler mustache with Nasser deliberately. He did change it before he went to israel out of genuine remorse.

its interesting the only people who deny the Arab connection to Nazis are a handful of anti Zionists on this forum. No Palestinian extremist terrorist ever hid their admiration of Hitler. They openly cheer it but there is Marcus, trying to white wash the Nazi connection. Does hell to his script if he has to admit he cheers on Nazi groupies.

The irony is the British found themselves fighting along side Nazis trying to kill Jews int he 1948-9 war of independence. It was a cruel irony, so ironic that certain Druze, Beduins and Jordanians who had fought against the Nazis refused to fight with them and the British against the Jews.

Certain Jordanians died for donating land to holocaust survivors and refusing to kill them or war against them,

Righteous Beduins and Druze fought bravely in the IDF and are remembered. Certain Christians too.

History has made strange partners. The Soviets tried to woo Israel as a communist puppet state calling the Arab league nations Western colonial puppets then months later were in bed with ex nazis in Egypt, Syria and Iraq trying to wipe out Jews.

the KGB picked up where the nazis left off in terms of broadcasting anti semitism across the airwaves of the Middle east in the 1950's then 60's and 70's.

The KGB recycled propaganda first drafted by josef Goebbels and to this day is rebroadcast across the ME.

Old habits die hard.

Irony of ironies, Germany has been one of Israel's most loyal allies and now the Czech Republic, Poland and Ukraine. countries where anti semitism was prevalent also have reached out to Israel in genuine efforts to mend the past and help people heal. People change. Some people learn. Konrad Adenhauer, Willy Brandt, Lach Walesa, two Ukainian leaders, the former President of the Czech republic,Havel, all looked the holocaust in the eye and said never again.

Some will learn, others will not.

i fear Dog there is a new Jew coming in Europe called the Muslim. I fear in the midst of innocent migrants with unrealistic expectations are some nasty people who at the appropriate time will trigger attacks causing even more resentment and backlash and it will be impossible to know innocent from actual terrorist.

Its a mess. i think Merkel may have been too naive and unrealistic in taking in so many so fast.

In Canada we now see McCallum and certain officials saying in come 25,000 by Jan.1. That is nobel but/ what does it say about the thousands of homeless Canadians who are being pushed to the side? What about our aboriginals? its nice to save people. The intent is well and good but the cold hard reality is Syrians, Jews, what-ever, are part of a cycle of never ending political behaviour that will not end and the opressed of the day are often treated like a fashion tend for a few weeks until we move on to the next cause.