Surprise - UN Does Nothing Against Sudan Slaughter of Primitive Tribe

[jbg]

Being an anti-Zionist certainly doesn't mean you're necessarily an anti-Semite. There's Jews themselves who are anti-Zionists.

Now, as per jbg's theory, I'm sure there are some anti-semites who do cover their racism by using the term "anti-Zionism". But you can't invalidate the term "anti-Zionism" or its legitimate, non-racist sentiment just because a bunch of hateful ignorant dolts use it as a cover for their hate. You can't throw baseless accusations around and label someone an anti-semite simply because they are anti-Zionist, That's pure slander/libel and is as illegal as anti-semitism is, ironically.

I disagree because I use the word Zionism. To me, Zionism, like Wahabbism, is an ideology which is willing to do what it can in order to achieve its goal of domination. Their difference is that one is upfront about its willingness to trample all over human rights, while the other lies, twists and tries to deflect in order to cover for its atrocities. However, at the end, they both bring misery, destruction and death to others who they believe are not the same as them or play the according to their rules. They are ideologies that should be rejected as they're simply bad for humanity.

The word "Zionism" appears nowhere in the OP. I have a real problem with the drumbeat of criticism of Israel and none of the atrocities such as those covered in the OP.

[Hudson Jones]

There are many reasons that Israel is being singled out by some leftists in the West.

Here is a snippet from an article that talks about one of the reasons: https://goo.gl/EXQqjH

Certain conflicts over the past 50 years—South Africa, Israel/Palestine, Algeria, Vietnam—have stood out as exceptional for many in the west, especially for those on the left. The common denominators, the strands that tie these conflicts together, are western imperialism and/or the related phenomenon of white-settler colonialism. These two factors are crucial for understanding how it is that the Israel/Palestine conflict has gained such a prominent position within the political imagination of the modern left.

Here is a more direct commentary on the Zionist approach to responding to criticism of Israel: http://goo.gl/SllLy7

Those who assert that Israel is being “singled out” aren’t interested in assessing where to rank Israel on the scoreboard of global human rights violators. They’re just setting listeners up for an old familiar punch-line: Why is Israel being “singled out?” Because the world hates the Jews. Why do some Jews harp on Israel’s depredations? It’s because they hate themselves.

The charge of “singling out” is at once disingenuous and obfuscatory. It’s another way of saying that substantive criticism of Israel (not to mention organized political and economic action, including boycott and divestment, in support of such criticism) amounts to anti-semitism. It’s intended to stifle criticism — and indeed, honest discussion — and thereby distract attention away from the real-life conditions in the West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza: from the house demolitions; the land theft; the “administrative detentions;” the de jure and de facto deprivation of elementary rights of assembly and speech; the relentless settlement building; the roadblocks, checkpoints, and general interruption of free movement; the theft and wildly unequal distribution of water; the containment wall built on Palestinian territory; the settler violence against Palestinian individuals and property; the use of banned weaponry; the collective punishment of the entire Palestinian people; the bantustanization of the West Bank; the violations of international law; the blockading of Gaza; the manifest racism; and the daily harassment and indignities consciously and systematically imposed on an occupied populace.

To defend such policies and practices is morally impossible. To equate the actions undertaken by the Israelis with those of the weak and stateless Palestinians is ethically obtuse. To ignore altogether the events on the ground in the West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza by raising the hoary accusation of anti-semitism, wrapped in the packaging of “singling out,” is unconscionable.

[BubberMiley]

Now that an answer was provided, it's time to abandon thread and try again in a few weeks.

[bush_cheney2004]

Seems like the Jew haters always have an excuse for their single minded goal....millions of others will just have to wait for their "human rights" until the hate for "Zionists" is satisfied.

[BubberMiley]

Isn't it a CPC playbook debate tactic to declare everyone who disagrees to be "haters" of some sort? You can't talk about Harper without being called a "Harper hater". I guess if you can't debate facts, start the name-calling and run away.

[Moonlight Graham]

The word "Zionism" appears nowhere in the OP. I have a real problem with the drumbeat of criticism of Israel and none of the atrocities such as those covered in the OP.

I also responded to what you talked about in your OP. But you also made a statement about anti-zionism in your 2nd post in this thread, which is what people were also responding to, so I don't understand why it matters if Zionism didn't appear in the OP:

My own theory is that most anti-Zionism is re-labelled Jew-hatred.

[Moonlight Graham]

I have a real problem with the drumbeat of criticism of Israel and none of the atrocities such as those covered in the OP.

You know, It's pretty disgusting that you seem to only be criticizing the lack of media attention and UN action surrounding the situations like those in the Nuba region because as a result Israel gets a larger share of the international criticism, and not because you actually give two sh*ts about the suffering people in the Nuba mountains etc.

Israel gets an incredible level of support from governments like the US and Canada, unlike the people in the Nuba mountains and elsewhere around Africa, so you can't have your cake and eat it too. C'mon friend.

[cybercoma]

I disagree because I use the word Zionism. To me, Zionism, like Wahabbism, is an ideology which is willing to do what it can in order to achieve its goal of domination. Their difference is that one is upfront about its willingness to trample all over human rights, while the other lies, twists and tries to deflect in order to cover for its atrocities. However, at the end, they both bring misery, destruction and death to others who they believe are not the same as them or play the according to their rules. They are ideologies that should be rejected as they're simply bad for humanity.

It's a label that's almost always used pejoratively and it would vastly improve discussions if you didn't use it as short hand for a point that may or may not be valid. It's always better to explain clearly what exactly you're criticizing than to rely on pejorative labels.

[cybercoma]

Israel is subject to criticism. To the point is that critics of Israel's policies within Israel don't face death. Just try criticizing Khamememi (sp) in Iran, or Sudan's leadership in Sudan.

Israel's policies are criticized, then many dismiss those criticisms as anti-semitism. The latter is my concern. That Israel gets a free pass because some would paint any criticism of their policies as racist or bigoted without warrant.

[Argus]

I disagree because I use the word Zionism.

I rest my case.

To me, Zionism, like Wahabbism, is an ideology which is willing to do what it can in order to achieve its goal of domination.

Really? Because if the Jews you so despise were really willing to do whatever it took to establish their goal they would have slaughtered or driven out all the Arabs in Israel by now, to say nothing of the Palestinians. Hell, they've had decades and done nothing. Where are the death camps? The Arab nations had no trouble driving out their Jews during this time period. Do you really think the Jews couldn't have driven the Arabs out? Of course they could have! Yet the Arab population of Israel continues to grow, as does the Palestinian population. Both, but particularly the former, present an existential threat to the existence of a Jewish state, yet no one is forcing them out! But I know the obviousness of this is beyond someone wracked by hatred and venom.

Edited July 15, 2015 by Argus

[Argus]

Israel is subject to criticism. To the point is that critics of Israel's policies within Israel don't face death. Just try criticizing Khamememi (sp) in Iran, or Sudan's leadership in Sudan.

That is part of the reason, of course. If you want to be the Times' China correspondent you better keep your criticism of the regime muted or you'll be deported, and your paper won't be allowed to replace you. But foreign correspondents can say whatever they want about Israel without fear of reprisal.

[Argus]

To equate the actions undertaken by the Israelis with those of the weak and stateless Palestinians is ethically obtuse.

And to ignore the vicious, brutal and violent behaviour of the Palestinians is morally and intellectually bankrupt.

It is similar to the brainless lefties who worked so hard to overthrow white ruled Rhodesia to put the brutal killer Robert Mugabe in power. Mugabe has since slaughtered far, far more Africans than the white Rhodesians ever did, but the lefties turn a blind eye to that.

[jbg]

To defend such policies and practices is morally impossible. To equate the actions undertaken by the Israelis with those of the weak and stateless Palestinians is ethically obtuse. To ignore altogether the events on the ground in the West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza by raising the hoary accusation of anti-semitism, wrapped in the packaging of “singling out,” is unconscionable.

.

Is Sudan stateless?

Now that an answer was provided, it's time to abandon thread and try again in a few weeks.

That was an answer? Are you kidding?

[Rue]

Moonlight Graham I am not sure what planet you are on but during the reign of Obama he has single handedly done more than any elected leader on this planet to undermine and threaten Israel's right to exist. How you write that off as US support I do not know. He has used his office to form alliances with terrorists dedicated to wiping out Israel and who will continue to kill US citizens and soldiers.

As for you questioning JBG's concern for the people of Sudan, before you infer or suggest he does not give a shit about them and exploits them for another political agenda be consistent and use the same criticism on HJ or Marcus et al when they exploit the conflict in Gaza/West Bank and I might take you more seriously.

[GostHacked]

Is Sudan stateless?

That was an answer? Are you kidding?

Sudan or South Sudan? Which one are you referring to?

[GostHacked]

Atrocities happen around the world.

JBG, I suggest simply making more threads regarding atrocities around the world. There is lots in this world to be upset about, but this is a thread to essentially spite all those who participate in being critical of Israel's actions. This is nothing more than an attempt to call others out as to why they don't speak up about other atrocities. Your care factor in this particular incident is facetious at best.

Why don't you participate in other threads other than things 'Israel' ?

[Argus]

Atrocities happen around the world.

JBG, I suggest simply making more threads regarding atrocities around the world. There is lots in this world to be upset about, but this is a thread to essentially spite all those who participate in being critical of Israel's actions. This is nothing more than an attempt to call others out as to why they don't speak up about other atrocities. Your care factor in this particular incident is facetious at best.

Why don't you participate in other threads other than things 'Israel' ?

Such threads die quickly for lack of interest on the part of most of those on the Left side of the political spectrum.

[Rue]

With due respect Ghost JBG does and his criticism is warranted but you are of course right the purpose of this thread is to call out

two faced anti Israeli critics and their double standards. On that you are right of course. He never hid that.

[jbg]

Atrocities happen around the world.

JBG, I suggest simply making more threads regarding atrocities around the world. There is lots in this world to be upset about, but this is a thread to essentially spite all those who participate in being critical of Israel's actions. This is nothing more than an attempt to call others out as to why they don't speak up about other atrocities. Your care factor in this particular incident is facetious at best.

Why don't you participate in other threads other than things 'Israel' ?

With due respect Ghost JBG does and his criticism is warranted but you are of course right the purpose of this thread is to call out

two faced anti Israeli critics and their double standards. On that you are right of course. He never hid that.

As Rue points out, I participate in threads about the CDN elections, Quebec separation, global warming, U.S. politics and crime as well as threads about Israel. And I post threads about worldwide atrocities to combat the deafening silence while the world concentrates on imperfect Western countries. Edited July 20, 2015 by jbg