On Guard for Thee Posted April 11, 2015 Report Share Posted April 11, 2015 I agree with On Guard For Thee. The most common definitions that I have found; Gender - The state of being male or female (typically used with reference to social and cultural differences rather than biological ones.) Sex - Either of two main categories (male or female) into which humans and many other living things are divided on the basis of reproductive functions. Correct and thanks for posting that definition. I was going to but figured it was a waste of time. To conflate the two simply shows a lack of appreciation of the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-1=e^ipi Posted April 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2015 Seems to be gender identity is something each individual decides. For some of us its really not a decision. We are born that way. We are attracted to the opposite sex and we just know. You are mixing up gender identity with sexual orientation a bit here. But anyway... I get gender issues can get complicated, but I'm still at a loss to the following: What does it mean to identify as a gender in the absence of gender roles? I don't understand how anyone that rejects gender roles as relics of the past can identify with a gender. Yet the vast majority of people identify with a gender (are either cisgendered or transgendered). So surely someone can enlighten me on the thought process on identifying with a gender. Is it just a matter of having cognitive dissonance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-1=e^ipi Posted April 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2015 (edited) Gender is a biological fact, verifiable with a DNA test (even before birth). It's not an "identity". If you have a "gender identity" that is not that which the DNA test says, then you have a mental illness. Personally I find the usage of sex and gender can be ambiguous at times, but do you not agree that the following are distinct?: Gender Identity, Genetic Sex, Phenotypical Sex. Edited April 11, 2015 by -1=e^ipi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-1=e^ipi Posted April 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2015 Gender - The state of being male or female (typically used with reference to social and cultural differences rather than biological ones.) So are you saying that gender identity depends on accepting a gender role? Sex - Either of two main categories (male or female) into which humans and many other living things are divided on the basis of reproductive functions. But what about intersex individuals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted April 11, 2015 Report Share Posted April 11, 2015 Perception is reality to the individual. Only if the individual is mentally ill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 So Bryan - You perceive that you are absolutely correct. Does that mean that you are mentally ill? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Guy Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 To -1 - I am following this thread because I find the different perceptions to be interesting. I believe that to follow a focussed disagreement, the two sides must agree to the definition of the terms being used in the discussion. That is why I post the most objective definitions that I could find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 So Bryan - You perceive that you are absolutely correct. Does that mean that you are mentally ill? No. You worrying about "perception" is the problem. What you perceive is irrelevant. Stick with facts instead of feelings, and maybe you won't get so confused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 No. You worrying about "perception" is the problem. What you perceive is irrelevant. Stick with facts instead of feelings, and maybe you won't get so confused. Except you apparently dont understand the difference between facts and feelings. I may have been born with a certain form of genetalia, (thats sex) but it doesnt mean I have to concur with what that genetalia suggests. (thats gender) Anymore than if I was born with black skin that I automatically like Reggae music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 I'm sorry, but if you have a penis, it doesn't suggest that you're male, it confirms it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 I'm sorry, but if you have a penis, it doesn't suggest that you're male, it confirms it. It doesn't confirm that you feel male. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Except you apparently dont understand the difference between facts and feelings. I may have been born with a certain form of genetalia, (thats sex) but it doesnt mean I have to concur with what that genetalia suggests. (thats gender) Anymore than if I was born with black skin that I automatically like Reggae music. For your analogy to work, that black person would have to insist that he's really caucasian, because he just "feels white". I "feel" a lot younger than my actual age, can I change the date on my birth certificate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 It doesn't confirm that you feel male. It's what you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 For your analogy to work, that black person would have to insist that he's really caucasian, because he just "feels white". I "feel" a lot younger than my actual age, can I change the date on my birth certificate? Your assumptions are hilarious, and also a bit sad, as they seem to be racist. Are you actually saying all black people are born to love Reggae. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-1=e^ipi Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 For your analogy to work, that black person would have to insist that he's really caucasian, because he just "feels white". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Your assumptions are hilarious, and also a bit sad, as they seem to be racist. Are you actually saying all black people are born to love Reggae. You're the one who thinks that musical tastes are relevant to the discussion. If anyone is racist here, it's you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Your assumptions are hilarious, and also a bit sad, as they seem to be racist. Are you actually saying all black people are born to love Reggae. Where did you read that from what he said. You're the only one who mentioned reggae. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-1=e^ipi Posted April 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 I'm sorry, but if you have a penis, it doesn't suggest that you're male, it confirms it. So are Eunuch's not male? How about intersex people with ambiguous genitalia? How about transmen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Wow that is some sick s**t. Maybe stick to flailing around with your silly formulae. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 You're the one who thinks that musical tastes are relevant to the discussion. If anyone is racist here, it's you. Its your rather warped version of my analogy that says so much about you. But at least u have a confidant in tin hat there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Where did you read that from what he said. You're the only one who mentioned reggae. Because I read that his assumption is that your mind must adhere to your physical attributes, whether it be whats between your legs or what color you are, etc. I disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 Because I read that his assumption is that your mind must adhere to your physical attributes, whether it be whats between your legs or what color you are, etc. I disagree. What is between your legs has nothing to do with reggae music. As usual, you're flailing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 What is between your legs has nothing to do with reggae music. As usual, you're flailing. I guess you just arent getting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 I guess you just arent getting it. You're making analogies that don't work. You're equating physical sex atridubtes with cultural practices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted April 12, 2015 Report Share Posted April 12, 2015 You're making analogies that don't work. You're equating physical sex atridubtes with cultural practices. Now you are really mixed up. I was simply trying to point out that sex and gender are two very different things. I used the a similar assumption about skin color and musical preferences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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