Why are so few willing to discuss the science?

[bush_cheney2004]

I brought something new to the discussion and it precipitated a flurry of posts from folks, (some who hadn't shown their face and others who slip in with irrelevant posts), who never addressed it in any fashion that the forum rules suggest, even mandate.

No, nothing new or informative has been presented.

It is a 100% regurgitation of previous arguments and theories labeled as "science".

[Je suis Omar]

As has already been pointed out, there is nothing new here. It has been flogged to hell and back long ago.

I agree, the propaganda Meisters have been doing their level best to derail discussions based on science.

Now, have you any science that you want to add now that you have received information that illustrates your source, and therefore you, were mistaken. Or do you just want to spout one and two liner memes.

[On Guard for Thee]

I agree, the propaganda Meisters have been doing their level best to derail discussions based on science.

Now, have you any science that you want to add now that you have received information that illustrates your source, and therefore you, were mistaken. Or do you just want to spout one and two liner memes.

Nope. Your first line here pretty well sums up where you are coming from.

[bush_cheney2004]

This just in.....secret tapes reveal that Cheney and Gang decided to bring down WTC7 too because the attack

and destruction of both WTC towers and killing thousands of Americans and other nationals wasn't enough

false flag damage and horror.

[GostHacked]

Wow, two terrible threads where the trolls come out to play with each other. Sad really.

[Je suis Omar]

Wow, two terrible threads where the trolls come out to play with each other. Sad really.

Why are so few willing to discuss the science?

[Je suis Omar]

Wow, two terrible threads where the trolls come out to play with each other. Sad really.

That is, simply a glib comment, GostHacked. Surely you can come up with something better than what appears to be a simple copy & paste of (of what I think is) your only other glib comment.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Je suis Omar

[Argus]

This is how Bill Maher dealt with 9/11 truthers and controlled demolition crackpots:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zJdEI3rFvCY

But he's in on the conspiracy, and is nothing but a sock puppet for the Bush administration!

[Je suis Omar]

But he's in on the conspiracy, and is nothing but a sock puppet for the Bush administration!

Another poster addressing the science.

[GostHacked]

That is, simply a glib comment, GostHacked. Surely you can come up with something better than what appears to be a simple copy & paste of (of what I think is) your only other glib comment.

I can get more glib if you want. I actually posted an interesting video that you seemed to have missed.

[Je suis Omar]

I can get more glib if you want. I actually posted an interesting video that you seemed to have missed.

I'd rather you discussed the science, GH. There's precious little of that going on here.

I may well have missed it; I've been busy. Point me to it and by all means I'll have a look.

[On Guard for Thee]

But he's in on the conspiracy, and is nothing but a sock puppet for the Bush administration!

I seem to be hearing similar sound effects echoing in this thread.

[Je suis Omar]

As has already been pointed out, there is nothing new here. It has been flogged to hell and back long ago.

You posted your points, I discussed them with you, then I gave two sources, both of them from professionals in this very field under discussion and you haven't once addressed any of the material, not a once.

All you have done is coddled up to other unprofessional folks who have likewise ignored all the items under discussion.

Here's a few more questions for you to ignore:

1) Who are the people who run the website that you used as a source and what are their professional qualifications ?

2. What is the date that that information was first posted?

3. What is/are the date(s) of subsequent updates?

[Je suis Omar]

http://www.ae911truth.org/images/articles/2014/11/twenty-five-points-10-19-14-3.pdf

Areas of Specific Concern in the NIST WTC Reports

Below is a series of twenty-five provable points which clearly demonstrate that the reports produced by the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) on the destruction of the World Trade Center (WTC) were unscientific and fraudulent. Therefore NIST itself including its lead authors, Shyam Sunder and John Gross - should be investigated.

WTC 7 THE THIRD SKYSCRAPER

1. OMISSION OF GIRDER STIFFENERS SHOWN ON FRANKEL DRAWING #9114

Technical Statement: NIST maintains that WTC 7 collapsed due to fire acting upon the 13th floor A2001 girder between columns 79 and 44 and the beams framing into it from the east. They said that the beams expanded by 5.5 (revised in June 2012 to 6.25), broke the girder erection bolts, and pushed this girder off its column 79 seat. This girder fell to floor 12, which then precipitated a cascade of floor failures from floor 12 down to floor 5, and column 79 then became unsupported laterally causing it to buckle. It is then said that column 79's buckling caused the upper floors to cascade down, which started a chain reaction a north-to-south then east-to-west horizontal, progressive collapse with a global exterior collapse that was captured on the videos.

The first omission concerns flange-to-web stiffeners on the south end of the girder (A2001). See drawing 9114. These omitted stiffeners would prevent the girder flange from folding when the girder web moved beyond the seat, requiring twice the possible expansion of the beams framing into the girder from the east to move the girder far enough to the west for it to fall off its seat.

[Je suis Omar]

I can get more glib if you want. I actually posted an interesting video that you seemed to have missed.

I wonder, were any of those helicopter pilots and passengers called to testify anywhere; were they questioned, were they identified?

[Je suis Omar]

So any actual science that debunks the hysteria must be outdated...how typical.

It's outdated because scientists have done experiments that illustrate that what that site, NIST, you, ... have advanced is false. Organics do not mix with molten aluminum to create a "like a fireplace log" situation.

"The fundamental flaw of the aluminum hypothesis, though, is that the implied temperature of the white glow remains above 1200°C/2200°F, regardless of the metal involved. An independent researcher suggested that the molten substance could be lead from storage batteries, but this explanation fails as do all hypotheses based on alternative metals because the temperature required for the yellow-white glow of the metal is beyond the capability of the building fire.

Jones also notes that molten aluminum appears silvery as it melts at 660°C/1220°F, and that it remains silvery when poured in daylight conditions, regardless of the temperature. It is theoretically possible to continue heating liquid aluminum way past its melting point and into the yellow-white temperature range, but the office fire was not a plausible source for such high temperatures, ... ."

http://www1.ae911truth.org/en/affiliate-marketing-program/899-what-was-the-molten-metal-seen-pouring-out-of-the-south-tower-minutes-before-its-collapse-steel-and-iron-or-aluminum-andor-lead.html

Edited April 5, 2015 by Je suis Omar

[On Guard for Thee]

It's outdated because scientists have done experiments that illustrate that what that site, NIST, you, ... have advanced is false. Organics do not mix with molten aluminum to create a "like a fireplace log" situation.

"The fundamental flaw of the aluminum hypothesis, though, is that the implied temperature of the white glow remains above 1200°C/2200°F, regardless of the metal involved. An independent researcher suggested that the molten substance could be lead from storage batteries, but this explanation fails as do all hypotheses based on alternative metals because the temperature required for the yellow-white glow of the metal is beyond the capability of the building fire.

Jones also notes that molten aluminum appears silvery as it melts at 660°C/1220°F, and that it remains silvery when poured in daylight conditions, regardless of the temperature. It is theoretically possible to continue heating liquid aluminum way past its melting point and into the yellow-white temperature range, but the office fire was not a plausible source for such high temperatures, ... ."

http://www1.ae911truth.org/en/affiliate-marketing-program/899-what-was-the-molten-metal-seen-pouring-out-of-the-south-tower-minutes-before-its-collapse-steel-and-iron-or-aluminum-andor-lead.html

You are wasting your time.The internet is full of crap science for those who want to try to make up a conspiracy where none exists. You did your best,but its all been done before. Might I suggest finding a new conspiracy to persue.

[Je suis Omar]

You are wasting your time.The internet is full of crap science for those who want to try to make up a conspiracy where none exists. You did your best,but its all been done before. Might I suggest finding a new conspiracy to persue.

It's apparent I am wasting my time. Folks like you will only go as far as your minds let you go, then they freeze up and your offerings become the disjointed ramblings like this, above. The same tired old memes, issued in the same semi-catatonic fashion.

Which leads back to the central issue of this thread - Why are so few willing to discuss the science?

Hell you're not even willing to discuss the things raised on your own sources.

[On Guard for Thee]

It's apparent I am wasting my time. Folks like you will only go as far as your minds let you go, then they freeze up and your offerings become the disjointed ramblings like this, above. The same tired old memes, issued in the same semi-catatonic fashion.

Which leads back to the central issue of this thread - Why are so few willing to discuss the science?

Hell you're not even willing to discuss the things raised on your own sources.

Speaking of semi catatonic, dont you ever begin to feel like a gerbil running along on one of those wheels...As already discussed, whenever the conspiracy folks try to flog another theory that gets debunked, they simply move along to the next, etc., etc.But carry on if you wish.

[Je suis Omar]

OGFT: "whenever the conspiracy folks try to flog another theory that gets debunked,"

It's hilarious to think that you think that's what you've done. Point to one person who came onto this thread to "debunk" the information you offered from your badly outdated source. Y'all just refused to go anywhere near the science as you ran yourself up on a stump.

Kimmy, Argus, Michael, ... rolled in to do the same thing you're attempting here, obfuscation.

OGFT: "they simply move along to the next, etc., etc"

Telling that you think that unscientific. Where would we be if all scientists threw up their hands and said, "Okay, game over! Einstein has covered it all!"?

OGFT: As already discussed,

That's all y'all discuss are these silly memes.

Are you honest enough to go back and bring forward, from any one of you government conspiracy folks' replies, since it was established that the molten metal pouring from WTC2 was not aluminum, something that shows y'all discussed anything regarding the science?

Edited April 5, 2015 by Je suis Omar

[TimG]

Are you honest enough to go back and bring forward, from any one of you government conspiracy folks' replies, since it was established that the molten metal pouring from WTC2 was not aluminum, something that shows y'all discussed anything regarding the science?

No such thing has been established. But you keep evading the real issue: even if it was molten metal you have ZERO direct evidence that it was a planned explosion. This means the real answer could be something that no one has thought of yet. That is why it is waste of time to even discuss these 'anomalies' until someone finds real *direct* evidence of a planned explosion which would have to include testimony from someone who participated in the planning. Until you have that direct evidence no one is going to take your claims seriously. So why dont you spend your time trying to find a whistle blower instead of wasting time with inconclusive and superficial analyses of the limited data available. Edited April 5, 2015 by TimG

[Je suis Omar]

TimG: even if it was molten metal

Whether it was molten metal is not at issue. You can't even bring yourself to say "molten steel/molten iron",Tim. How come?

All the science to date shows that it was indeed molten steel or molten iron. In the video you didn't watch and from the information you didn't read in my post and at the link, it's easy to see and understand that the color wasn't that of molten aluminum.

There was nothing in those towers that could create the temperatures necessary to melt steel. Basic common sense, which appears to be in short supply here, demands that scientists try to explain this.

Repeating tired old memes is futile. But the meme gang would love to see that happen. That moves everyone away from the science.

I posed a question to OGFT about finding one person from the opposing camp who has discussed the science. Are you up for it? Based on your past performance I'm going to say no, but that's just my opinion.

Show us that you are made of sterner stuff!!

Edited April 5, 2015 by Je suis Omar

[bush_cheney2004]

The 9/11 Truthers aren't interested in "the science" at all, preferring and purposely perpetuating all sorts of nonsense just for the purpose of continuing the "movement". Anything goes, so long as it attracts diminishing attention to a dying cause.

[Je suis Omar]

The 9/11 Truthers aren't interested in "the science" at all, preferring and purposely perpetuating all sorts of nonsense just for the purpose of continuing the "movement". Anything goes, so long as it attracts diminishing attention to a dying cause.

OGFT & TimG:

Here's one post that you don't have to bother checking for science. Watch out for flying memes though.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Je suis Omar

[On Guard for Thee]

OGFT: "whenever the conspiracy folks try to flog another theory that gets debunked,"

It's hilarious to think that you think that's what you've done. Point to one person who came onto this thread to "debunk" the information you offered from your badly outdated source. Y'all just refused to go anywhere near the science as you ran yourself up on a stump.

Kimmy, Argus, Michael, ... rolled in to do the same thing you're attempting here, obfuscation.

OGFT: "they simply move along to the next, etc., etc"

Telling that you think that unscientific. Where would we be if all scientists threw up their hands and said, "Okay, game over! Einstein has covered it all!"?

OGFT: As already discussed,

That's all y'all discuss are these silly memes.

Are you honest enough to go back and bring forward, from any one of you government conspiracy folks' replies, since it was established that the molten metal pouring from WTC2 was not aluminum, something that shows y'all discussed anything regarding the science?

Hey there little buddy, ever done the real science on how much explosive it would have taken to get those buildings to come down...and when you get doe looking that up, try to figure out how in the hell you could plant all that without anybody noticing. Oh excuse me sir, sorry to interrupt I just need to plant this small sack of explosive by your office window. But it seems truthers are willing to buy the idea. How quaint.