Netanyahu Ambition Over Patriotism?

[Rue]

Well sparky I wouldn't worry and you can tell Jonesy and Guyseryand Marcusy while you are at it that the melodrama including words like spittingin Obama's face are funny.

I think you all need to find something better as a vehicle to try brow beat the board with yet another excuse to dump on Israel/Zionism/Netanyahu, etc.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Well sparky I wouldn't worry and you can tell Jonesy and Guyseryand Marcusy while you are at it that the melodrama including words like spittingin Obama's face are funny.

I think you all need to find something better as a vehicle to try brow beat the board with yet another excuse to dump on Israel/Zionism/Netanyahu, etc.

There are some facts to be considered. The speech was unprecedented in US history - no foreign leader has ever spoken in Congress against the wishes of the sitting President. Milchan did obtain nuclear equipment in the US. Richard Kelly Smyth, an employee of Milchan's, got prison time for his activities.

[Shady]

There are some facts to be considered. The speech was unprecedented in US history - no foreign leader has ever spoken in Congress against the wishes of the sitting President. Milchan did obtain nuclear equipment in the US. Richard Kelly Smyth, an employee of Milchan's, got prison time for his activities.

Sitting presidents have no authority to wish or unwish somebody from speaking on invitation from congress. Congress is an equal branch of government, much to the shagrin of Obama. It's not congress' fault that the sitting president has so alientated such a long and historic ally. That's on him.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Well sparky I wouldn't worry and you can tell Jonesy and Guyseryand Marcusy while you are at it that the melodrama including words like spittingin Obama's face are funny.

I think you all need to find something better as a vehicle to try brow beat the board with yet another excuse to dump on Israel/Zionism/Netanyahu, etc.

One more point. Did you read my first line? The issue I address is on the US side, not the Israeli side. The Israelis will do what they have to. The Americans must make sure that they keep within their own laws when dealing with Israel and this has clearly not been that case IMO.

BTW I never used the phrase you mention above.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Sitting presidents have no authority to wish or unwish somebody from speaking on invitation from congress. Congress is an equal branch of government, much to the shagrin of Obama. It's not congress' fault that the sitting president has so alientated such a long and historic ally. That's on him.

Except the 'right' you speak of so casually of has never been used before.

Edited March 7, 2015 by SpankyMcFarland

[Shady]

Except the right you speak so casually of has never been used before.

That's incorrect. Congress has invited many people to speak to joint sessions. The last major speech was Tony Blair in 2003 defending the invasion of Iraq.

[SpankyMcFarland]

That's incorrect. Congress has invited many people to speak to joint sessions. The last major speech was Tony Blair in 2003 defending the invasion of Iraq.

Not the same. Blair's visit was welcomed by the President. If Blair had opposed the invasion, I would consider that a similar situation.

Show me an example of a foreign head of govt. getting himself invited without the consent of the sitting President. I believe there was a proposal by a French official to come in the early 19th century and this was fiercely resisted.

This creates a precedent. Why shouldn't Steve get an invite to talk about Keystone?

[Shady]

Not the same. Blair's visit was welcomed by the President. If Blair had opposed the invasion, I would consider that a similar situation.

Show me an example of a foreign head of govt. getting himself invited without the consent of the sitting President. I believe there was a proposal by a French official to come in the early 19th century and this was fiercely resisted.

This creates a precedent. Why shouldn't Steve get an invite to talk about Keystone?

Of course he was welcomed by the presdient, the president was Bush. It's not congress' fault that it wasn't a Democrat in the White House. Just like it's not congress' fault that there isn't a Republican in the White House. Regardless, the president doesn't have any constitutional power to consent or dissent. It's not his or her choice. Usually it's cleared with the White House to remedy any schduling issues. Not asking permission. If you're under that impression, then you're wrong.

Steve could absolutely get an invitation to speak, however the issue is hardly of the same importance.

KATHLEEN PARKER: As far as all this concern with protocol, when did we start caring so much? But secondly, and I understand why the White House is upset about it, because it does come at a time when they're trying to do something very serious, which is negotiate with Iran, but the Speaker has asked before for Netanyahu to come and invited him before, in 2011. He did go to the White House because he was worried about messing up then negotiations with Iran, and the White House did not respond for a month, according to the Speaker's office. And when they did, they basically said it's, it's your call.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/ken-shepherd/2015/03/02/hardball-kathleen-parker-blows-simplistic-narrative-netanyahu

[SpankyMcFarland]

I disagree with the title of the thread. Bibi may be mistaken to make this speech but it's reasonable to conclude he believes he is doing it in his own country's best interests. Having renounced US citizenship at some point (does anybody know exactly when?), he has no duty of loyalty to the US.

[SpankyMcFarland]

Of course he was welcomed by the presdient, the president was Bush. It's not congress' fault that it wasn't a Democrat in the White House. Just like it's not congress' fault that there isn't a Republican in the White House. Regardless, the president doesn't have any constitutional power to consent or dissent. It's not his or her choice. Usually it's cleared with the White House to remedy any schduling issues. Not asking permission. If you're under that impression, then you're wrong.

Steve could absolutely get an invitation to speak, however the issue is hardly of the same importance.

[/b][/u]

I need hardly remind you of the importance of precedence in political or legal matters. So, firstly, let us clear up a very basic point one way or the other. When was a foreign head of govt. last invited to speak to Congress without the consent of the President?

[Shady]

I need hardly remind you of the importance of precedence in political or legal matters. So, firstly, let us clear up a very basic point one way or the other. When was a foreign head of govt. last invited to speak to Congress without the consent of the President?

Consent isn't needed.

[Shady]

However, I'm guessing 2003, Tony Blair.

[guyser]

Guyser from reading your posts Bush can get a good idea of the education system in Canada .

..says the so called 'lawyer' who couldnt spell subpoena and a few other legal words?

Ah...such irony.

[Rue]

I agree 100% with what Netanyahu said. I believe more Americans will agree with him than Obama.

I think he should have given the speech outside Congress not inside it.

I believe given he is in an election at home, he should have not used the appearance in Congress to his advantage.

But he did.

The speech itself was not partisan. The act of choosing to state it in Congress was an deliberately so.

The speech itself is something the vast majority Israelis agree on. Its not what was said, but where it was said.

That said, Obama is not innocent.

For the last 8 years he has demonstrated the most blatant of biases against Israel. He lied to get elected. He lied blatantly about his position on Israel.

He has been openly pro Muslim Brotherhood. He embraced not one but two blatantly anti semitic, anti Christian Muslim Brotherhood leaders, Morsi and Erdogan.

He blatantly armed and trained ISIL which turned rogue on him. He went to Cairo, Egypt presenting himself as the Muslim President. The President wink wink nudge nudge who understood Muslims. Say now. His father is Muslim Brothrhood. His step father is Muslim Brotherhood. His half brother is the biggest Muslim Brotherhood financier and personally responsible for keeping the genocidal regime of Sudan running its continuing war against Christians.

Where was Obama as Morsi called on Egyptians to kill Coptic Christians? Where is his moral outrage over Boca Raton? Where was he whenErdogan made openly anti semitic speeches? Where? Well we know where he is-telling Israel to know their place. Talking down to Israel like some step n fetch it slave about what is good for them. Telling them like some arrogant, petulant fool that he knows what is good for them.

Really now. This fool who was made a blubbering idiot by Putin in Syria and Ukrain. A man so pathetic that Merkel had to lambast him like a school boy over Ukrain. Even his supposed best buddy Cameron ran and distanced himself from him over Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Libya.

The French? Well while Obama remains silent, they actually sent troops to Mali to put down Al Quaeda. What was Bam Bam doing?

What has this man done? Here is a man who can't even understand let control ISIL and he would now have people believe he gets Iranians?

Yah like he gets Saudi Arabia, Egypt,the UAE,Jordan, Israel, Kuwait, UAE all who were allies of the US and now consider Obama a major issue and impediment to their security?

Yah this is the same Obama whose policies predicted Yemen, Syria.

But hey some have it figured out right. I mean come on Iran is harmless. Why would a country that exports terrorism all over the world, that is engaging in a civil war in Iraq and Yemen, that has repeatedly attacked Kurds, that has repeatedly funded and loaded Hezbollah with missiles, that has repeatedly funded Hamas, why wouldn't it be trusted?

I mean come on it is a model of democratic responsibility what with the way it massacres its Christians, Bahaiis, Zoroastreans, gays,feminists, trade unionists, Jews. Hey come on now its good at destroying Buddist monuments too. Hey about its prisons. They torture journalists, students, opposition leaders,anyone suspected of not being a good Muslim.

But hey now, no problem.Bam Bam will get a good deal. He knows.

Right Iran doesn't have the ability yet to make weapons.

Right.

Got it.

[Rue]

Did I spell Iran write?

There is a heated debate going on in both Israel and the US as to how to deal with Iran. No doubt about it.

Many in Israel running for office now claim Neyanyahu should have kept his true opinions behind closed doors.

Many believe when dealing with Iran, the best way,is behind closed doors.

Netanyahu believes that Obama has insulted Israel over and over again publically and

so he was obliged to do the same in reverse.

Some argue not so, Netanyahu should have taken the high road and he's just grandstanding to get re-elected.

Make no mistake Netanyahu is posturing not just to a domestic audience during an election, but the US, Iran and

the Egyptians, Jordanians Saudi Arabians,Kuwaitis, and UAE all in total disagreement with Iran getting the bomb

and watching from the sidelines to see what happens and whether Obama sells them not just Israel out as well.

There is absolutely no doubt in my mind, the Arab nations I mentioned totally are behind Netanyahu's comments

and Netanyahu is worried about them all wanting to get the bomb if Iran does and so a need to posture on their behalf

as well.

The alleged dispute within Israel and the US on how to deal with Iran, i.e., by appeasement or sanctions has gone on since the Shah was

deposed and its not just between Netanyahu and Obama but all the other countries I mentioned and Netanyahu as well.

As for the dispute as to whether there should be an air strike on Iran or covert operations to try assist its people take down its government that

is another closed door argument for military and intelligence types but if anyone bothered to analyze Netanyahu's actual record he rarely if ever

authorized any military attacks or strikes. He growls so he does not have to bite. His posturing many argue have made it possible for him not to habe to use military strikes.

The fact is Obama is committed to an alliance with Iran and Hezbollah in the same reckless and incompetent way he entered into a relationship

with Erdogan and the Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas and ISIL.

Does anyone really think Obama is going to win over Iran? In the middle of alleged negotiations they tested long range missiles and openly insulted

Obama calling him weak.

The Iranians are playing high stake poker. If this was just about nuclear energy, they would not have as they do to this day, refuse to allow inspections of certain sites.

Obama is mistaken if he thinks he will sell all of these Sunni governments and Israel out like he did Syria,Lebanon, Yemen, Sudan,Nigeria,Mali Ukraine, Georgia.

He is mistaken if he thinks he can talk down to Netanyahu in public over and over again like some colonial imperial know it all talking to a step and fetch it slave.

He's managed to insult Britain and France over Ukraine, Mali, Iraq, Canada over the oil pipeline, NATO in regards to Putin Germany in regards to Ukraine, and even Mexico over certain free trade issues. Netanyahu is certainly not the only ally insulted by hum.

The thing about Obama is he insults allies and enemies equally.He can't miss the opportunity to have that pompous jack ass holier than thou Kerry lecture the world on how smart Obama and Kerry are and are the only two who understand how anything works.

The world, is waiting the 2 idiots out. Any deal with Iran will be flawed, compromised and undone by the next President if he's Republican and at this point if anyone thinks anyone who is a Democrat will get elected good luck.

I regret any appearance of insult to the US but I do not agree appeasing Obama is best for Israel. Obama has shown disrespect time and time again against Israel and his own Congress not to mention Egypt and the other Arab nations I mentioned. He has held himself above protocol so he should not be expected to be protected by it.

Cooler heads will prevail. There will be no air strike or anything else. The deal will be a failure and allow Iran and Israel wiggle room to save face.

In fact it will be a meaningless deal and a whole new round of covert operations will begin as the Middle East leaders,world leaders and Republicans

count down this lame duck President's final petulant days in office.

[GostHacked]

The west has been waiting and even trying to get things changed in Iran for over 60 years. Hows that working out?

[Shady]

The west has been waiting and even trying to get things changed in Iran for over 60 years. Hows that working out?

Not good. They're still crazy as ever.

[Hudson Jones]

Not good. They're still crazy as ever.

You keep contradicting U.S. intelligence and Chairman of the joint Chief of Staff, General Dempsey who say Iran is a rational actor:

Dempsey underscored the importance of this assertion when he said that it was based on this conclusion — that the regime is a "rational actor" — that he felt the current U.S. approach to Iran "is the most prudent path."

How long are you going to try to fight reality and try to push for a false narrative?

[Shady]

You keep contradicting U.S. intelligence and Chairman of the joint Chief of Staff, General Dempsey who say Iran is a rational actor:

Dempsey underscored the importance of this assertion when he said that it was based on this conclusion — that the regime is a "rational actor" — that he felt the current U.S. approach to Iran "is the most prudent path."

How long are you going to try to fight reality and try to push for a false narrative?

They're bat-shit crazy. They throw stones at women to kill them as punishment. Their former president believed in the 12th Imam end times prophecy. Their violently anti-women, anti-Jew, anti-gay, anti-freedom of speech, anti-human rights, etc.

[GostHacked]

They're bat-shit crazy. They throw stones at women to kill them as punishment. Their former president believed in the 12th Imam end times prophecy. Their violently anti-women, anti-Jew, anti-gay, anti-freedom of speech, anti-human rights, etc.

I wonder how that happened. That coup that the US/CIA attempted did not set the course in another direction did it? Nah, can't be it. Oh wait, must be like what we see in Iraq. Take out the leadership and let the place go to absolute crap. Mission Accomplished.

[Shady]

I wonder how that happened. That coup that the US/CIA attempted did not set the course in another direction did it? Nah, can't be it. Oh wait, must be like what we see in Iraq. Take out the leadership and let the place go to absolute crap. Mission Accomplished.

Really? You mean the Koran was written after 1979? Who knew!?

[GostHacked]

Really? You mean the Koran was written after 1979? Who knew!?

Is it the Koran or those who seem to radicalize it? I mean if you follow the bible word for word, you end up to look as extreme as these islamic radicals. So, is it the book, or those who are radicalized?

[Rue]

Lol the tactic of getting into semantics as to whether Iran is rational or irrational is meaningless. A rational person would know that. If in fact Iran is rational, then all this means is its calculated and deliberate making it just as dangerous and in fact even more dangerous to Saudi Arabia,Egypt, Jordan, Israel, UAE and Kuwait and to India all who have made it clear they do not want Iran to have nuclear weapons.

Some of the craziest people for that matter are quite rational.Clifford Olson the serial killer was completely crazy but quite rational. So was Paul Bernardo.

Adolph Hitler, Stalin, Ghaddafi, all very crazy but quite capable of being rational. Most sociopaths are rational.

Lol once again stupid semantics to focus away from what Shady is saying and that is the issue of whether the Iranian regime is stable and its ideology is such that anyone should trust them with nuclear weapons.

But hey let's play semantics with the word rational.

Interesting back in the early 2000's many Israeli military leaders at the time called Iran rational. That changed when the rhetoric increased about blowing up Israel.

Bottom line? Iran's Revolutionary Guard, its proxy Hezbollah cell in Lebanon, their people are quite rational.Hezbollah is as rational as it gets, The average age of a Hezbollah member is in their 40's and they are highly educated with engineering backgrounds.

They are quite rational.

They are grounded in an ideology that is extremist and in that sense crazy but they know exactly what they are doing. Shady never said otherwise but hey anything to try change the subject and try portray Iran as a model country to trust with a nuclear weapon.

This same Hudson Jones who now pedals the rational Iran of course will not discuss its many speeches calling for the wiping out of Israel, its support of anti holocaust deniers, its systemic arrest and torture of political opposition members, students, feminists, trade unionists, democrats, progressives,

Buddists, Zoroastreans, Christians,Jews, Bahaiis, atheists, journalists and gays. No not Hudson Jones-the same person who claims to defend justice and freedom and fight against tyranny. You see he becomes remarkably silent and paralyzed when it comes to discussing the shortcomes of Iran, Syria, Hezbollah, etc. His sense of justice tends to disappear with certain countries and their regimes.

Right Shady now repeat after me,its real easy, Iran good, Israel poo poo ka ka.

It might help Shady if you sing it. its a nice tune.

The song goes like this

yoh slim shady Iran is good

its just a country misunderstood

now dah real story is about demJewz

yoh yoh man day iz real bad newz

dey get togetha and made a nation

and now day call it dah Zionist creation

we can't stop until its undone

hey attackin dem Jews its a lot of fun

you send in a missile, a bomber or two

don't really matter if you just kill a few

on we go in dis holy war

its all about shuttin dah Zionist door

just tink of these terrorists as divine enhancers

to cut out dem Zionist cancers

yoh yoh yoh

[Shady]

Is it the Koran or those who seem to radicalize it? I mean if you follow the bible word for word, you end up to look as extreme as these islamic radicals. So, is it the book, or those who are radicalized?

I agree. I don't know what so many in the Middle East follow the Koran word for word.

[marcus]

I agree 100% with what Netanyahu said. I believe more Americans will agree with him than Obama.

That's nice.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's favorability ratings with Americans have fallen in the wake of his March 3 address at the U.S. House of Representatives, a new Gallup poll finds.

Conducted between March 5-8, the new poll shows Netanyahu's favorable rating fell seven points (to 38 percent)