Violence Near Olympics in Caucasus - Where's the Outrage

[jbg]

Often, when Israel clamps down on Palestinian terror, there are a spate of investigations, whether by the media or the U.N. There was the famous, or infamous, Goldstone Report (link). The criticism is intense. Sometimes it is justified, sometimes not.

Worthy of note is the lack of world attention to more flagrant and more deadly abuse. The article, (link, excerpts below), is just one of hte many instances where non-Western countries conduct out-and-out massacres of opposing civilians. There is no U.N. investigations. Cameras are not shoved in Putin's face.

Not that Canada gets it much better when it is forced to confront FN violence or the U.S. when it shut down the Black Panthers and Weather Underground in the early 1970's.

There should be a single, not double-standard when it comes to warfare against innocent civilians.

An Olympics in the Shadow of a War Zone

BAKSAN, Russia — On Friday, exactly a week before the Olympics were set to open just 180 miles away, Russia’s security forces appeared on Makhov Street at 8:30 a.m. and cordoned off the area around a brick and stone house. One of the men inside called his father, who said it was the first he had heard from his son in 10 months.

“He said, ‘Papa, we’re surrounded,' ” the father said. “ 'I know they’re going to kill us.’ Then he said farewell.”

The Russians and the men inside exchanged gunfire, pausing only to allow a woman and two children to leave the house. By the time the shooting ended in the afternoon, four men inside were dead, according to official accounts. The Russians then blew up the house, leaving a bloodied pile of rubble and a crowd of sullen, angry neighbors.

For the first time in history, the Olympics are being held on the edge of a war zone. The conflict is one of the longest running in the world, a simmering, murky battle between increasingly radicalized militants who operate in the shadows of society and a security force that can be brutal, even when lethally effective.

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In 2013, violence between militants and security forces left 529 people dead in the North Caucasus, according to a list compiled by the news site Caucasian Knot that does not include the attacks in Volgograd, a city farther north. Of those killed, 127 were Russian security officers, a death toll on a scale of the 160 soldiers who died during the same period in NATO’s war in Afghanistan.

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Paradoxically, the most radicalized vision of an Islamic insurgency has little appeal among the majority of people in the region. There is no cult of martyrdom here except online. While the region is overwhelmingly Muslim, few appear to support either the goal of separatism or the imposition of an explicitly Islamic form of government.

The actions of the Russian security officers, however, fuel resentment, as do ethnic tensions and impoverishment. In Kabardino-Balkaria’s capital, Nalchik, a sense of disenfranchisement resulted in an uprising against security forces in 2005 that resulted in 135 deaths.

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Many of the ethnic groups in the Caucasus are related to the Circassians, who consider Sochi part of their homeland, conquered by the Russians in the 19th century after what activists today hope to publicize as an act of genocide.

[Michael Hardner]

I think you're complaining about human nature, though. While it's not fair that people should care more about a lost dog in their neighbourhood than a massacre on the side of the world - it's just a reflection of our failings. One such failing is our inability to criticize ourselves as much as our friends, our friends as much as our acquaintances, and our acquaintances more than strangers.

I say "more than" in the last phrase because it seems to me that certain countries - like Israel or the US - are a fallback for criticism at a higher level of scrutiny as you point out. I'm not at all sure why that is, but I have some ideas.

[Boges]

It does look pretty bad though. Especially when you consider it cost $51 billion.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/bennyjohnson/proof-that-sochi-is-a-godforsaken-hellscape-right-now?bffb

Vancouver pulled a great Games off for what $7 Billion?

[guyser]

Vancouver pulled a great Games off for what $7 Billion?

Yup

And most know that way more than half the money (Sochi) wnrt to fraud, payoffs,graff, etc.

Russians being Russians

Funny story today, the head guy said at a presser that he was tired of western journalists making things up about Sochi, why some had complained about leaky showers and he said " Not true, we have video surveillance that some of these people put the shower on and walk away for hours"

He was pulled from the press conference right away.

Surveillance....in bathrooms. Beware of the mirrored ciellings too !

[bush_cheney2004]

Yup

And most know that way more than half the money (Sochi) wnrt to fraud, payoffs,graff, etc.

Russians being Russians

Wow, that's shocking ! Only 25% of the money would go to fraud and payoffs in Quebec.

[jbg]

Wow, that's shocking ! Only 25% of the money would go to fraud and payoffs in Quebec.

Turner's NDP government in BC, where the Olympics were held, wasn't much better. Thus the election of the Liberals, led by Campbell.

[Remiel]

I say "more than" in the last phrase because it seems to me that certain countries - like Israel or the US - are a fallback for criticism at a higher level of scrutiny as you point out. I'm not at all sure why that is, but I have some ideas.

I am inclined to think that it is because at some level we are influenced to reserve the harshest criticism for those who are most likely to listen. The US and Israel may be criticized so much because we believe they can be swayed by our words. Russia and the Arab dictators not so much.

[guyser]

Turner's NDP government in BC, where the Olympics were held, wasn't much better. Thus the election of the Liberals, led by Campbell.

Yea cuz $3.5B vs $26B is almost the same.....or 'wasn't much better.'

[On Guard for Thee]

Wow, that's shocking ! Only 25% of the money would go to fraud and payoffs in Quebec.

Off tyopic. Try to focus.

[jacee]

Often, when Israel clamps down on Palestinian terror, there are a spate of investigations, whether by the media or the U.N. There was the famous, or infamous, Goldstone Report (link). The criticism is intense. Sometimes it is justified, sometimes not.

Worthy of note is the lack of world attention to more flagrant and more deadly abuse. The article, (link, excerpts below), is just one of hte many instances where non-Western countries conduct out-and-out massacres of opposing civilians. There is no U.N. investigations. Cameras are not shoved in Putin's face.

Israel only aspires to be like Russia?

Pity.

[jbg]

Maybe it isn't about rules, but about respect.

Does Israel only aspire to be respected as much as North Vietnam?

Pity.

Israel only aspires to be like Russia?

Pity.

These posts display the problem of the double standard. Israel exists in the real world and not some idealized bubble. The other countries show no hesitation in employing tactics you rightly condemn. Can you cut Israel and the U.S. a little slack in not being perfect?

[Rue]

The Olympics refused to commemorate the massacre of Israeli athletes when they should have during the summer Olympics. That was bi partisan politics at its worse-same as when the Olympic committee allowed Lebanon demand a curtain be put up between them and Israel when they were practicing on the court.

The Olympics to me is two parts. Athletes genuinely busting their hump and they ceased being amateurs years ago defeating the very purpose of the Olympics through no fault of their own. They have no choice but to be sponsored if they are to eat. So I applaud their guts and effort and leave them out of any criticism.

The other part for me are the corrupt officials, government lackies and Olympic officials stealing billions in kick backs while their fellow country men and athletes get nothing and as far as I am concerned the fixed judging of figure and ice dancing, the bs referees treating the Yank and Canadian hockey teams differently than the European ones, on and on not to mention the sheer partisan biases make me wanna puke.

The Spanish Nazi is no longer heading the Olympics but it still rots with corruption.

As for the media's double standards they have always held the US and Israel to a different standard. There has always been excuses made for Arab countries, China, Russia and African and Asian countries massacring their people.

Kofi Anan is till talking out his butkus over why he did nothing in Rwanda and Malawi.

The current South Korean head is a studdering dolt-a meaningless figure if there ever was one.

The European Union and the UN are both jokes. They have shown complete paralysis on doing anything ressembling expressing unified policy. They are fractured, partisan networks of egomaniacs. The UN is nothing but a den of corrupt officials stealing from their own countrymen.

[jacee]

These posts display the problem of the double standard. Israel exists in the real world and not some idealized bubble. The other countries show no hesitation in employing tactics you rightly condemn. Can you cut Israel and the U.S. a little slack in not being perfect?

Depends.

Is this thread is just another stupid 'Look! Someone else is bad too!' excuse to justify Israel's bad behaviour and call people anti-semites when they disagree? (And btw, nice strawman, lumping IsraelUS. Are they ONE?)

In comparison ... I've seen a lot of nasty trash talk when the issue of Indigenous Canadians is being discussed, but I've never seen someone try to excuse it by saying "But the US did it too!" Mature people realize that's about the weakest excuse possible for bad behaviour, and only serves to emphasize that it IS bad behaviour.

It's immature, offensive, and disgusting to me ... and reminds me even more of the children who died in Israel's disgusting bombing of Gaza. with this stupid apologist thread, you certainly accomplished the opposite of what you set out to!!!! :angry:

"Cut Israel some slack" ... for killing children? NEVER!!!!!

Comprenez?

Can we please ditch this STUPID thread now and have intelligent conversation and not this STUPID, childish

"But-but-but they did it too!"

STUPID crap!!!

Grow the F*** up!!!!

[jbg]

The Olympics refused to commemorate the massacre of Israeli athletes when they should have during the summer Olympics. That was bi partisan politics at its worse-same as when the Olympic committee allowed Lebanon demand a curtain be put up between them and Israel when they were practicing on the court.

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The European Union and the UN are both jokes. They have shown complete paralysis on doing anything ressembling expressing unified policy. They are fractured, partisan networks of egomaniacs. The UN is nothing but a den of corrupt officials stealing from their own countrymen.

You caught my point in starting this thread beautifully.