What improvements would you like to see in this discussion forum?

[waldo]

Interesting....and far from an improvement for this forum, new and existing members can be further discomforted in the knowledge that their posts and membership are topics of private back channel communications that would seek moderator actions against them. No wonder some members are leaving.

pepper your victim play with conspiracy ramblings!

[waldo]

You've successfully goaded your nemesis....have fun.

who? Lil' ole me... certainly wasn't my intent.

[socialist]

Some of you guys do nothing but bitch and complain. Charles, Greg, and Michael have done a wonderful job maintaining this forum. I'm sick and tired of the whining and complaining.

[jbg]

nice! I let your first shot go; not this one... from our private conversations you acknowledge the troll/trolling, suggest Greg is well aware of it/the troll's actions, but is simply not inclined to crack down on it. I disagree... or want to hear that (or a flavour of it) directly from Greg as pertains to his long promised intent to create his own separate thread on moderation.

you stated you didn't think anything could be gained by raising further concerns about trolling to MLW board moderation/admin; accordingly, as you stated, you chose to start you own separate thread on moderation, one intended to "go after something that might get some traction, which is reducing the number of bloody suspensions and redefining what gets you punished in the first place." I don't agree with your want to isolate trolling from the/your concern mix and question your intent to belittle the raised trolling concerns of the now designated/relegated "complainers/whiners".

Sounds like some people need day camp counselors to keep the peace.

Some of you guys do nothing but bitch and complain. Charles, Greg, and Michael have done a wonderful job maintaining this forum. I'm sick and tired of the whining and complaining.

Basically I agree. And their efforts are volunteers and they are not often thanked. They don't even get the pay of camp counselors for children's day camp. Edited April 13, 2014 by jbg

[Argus]

nice! I let your first shot go; not this one... from our private conversations you acknowledge the troll/trolling, suggest Greg is well aware of it/the troll's actions, but is simply not inclined to crack down on it. I disagree... or want to hear that (or a flavour of it) directly from Greg as pertains to his long promised intent to create his own separate thread on moderation.

you stated you didn't think anything could be gained by raising further concerns about trolling to MLW board moderation/admin; accordingly, as you stated, you chose to start you own separate thread on moderation, one intended to "go after something that might get some traction, which is reducing the number of bloody suspensions and redefining what gets you punished in the first place." I don't agree with your want to isolate trolling from the/your concern mix and question your intent to belittle the raised trolling concerns of the now designated/relegated "complainers/whiners".

I wasn't belittling the subject of trolling. I was belittling your infantile slap-fest with BC. You two are like a pair of girls who wore the same dress to the junior prom and want to spend the night scratching and spitting at each other. You are contributing precisely NOTHING to the subject of this thread by it.

And by the way, posting other people's private correspondance in public without at least asking permission is graceless, but of a style with your determination to lower this forum to nothing but a sneering, mocking exchange of contempt between posters.

Edited April 14, 2014 by Argus

[Argus]

Interesting....and far from an improvement for this forum, new and existing members can be further discomforted in the knowledge that their posts and membership are topics of private back channel communications that would seek moderator actions against them. No wonder some members are leaving.

Private communications are none of your business, nor do the moderators concern themselves with them.

[bush_cheney2004]

Private communications are none of your business, nor do the moderators concern themselves with them.

I agree 100%, but it is still very interesting to read about the lengths that some will go to in their attempt(s) to organize attacks against other members. I mean...seriously ???? Who does that ????

Edited April 14, 2014 by bush_cheney2004

[waldo]

I wasn't belittling the subject of trolling. I was belittling your infantile slap-fest with BC. You two are like a pair of girls who wore the same dress to the junior prom and want to spend the night scratching and spitting at each other. You are contributing precisely NOTHING to the subject of this thread by it.

And by the way, posting other people's private correspondance in public without at least asking permission is graceless, but of a style with your determination to lower this forum to nothing but a sneering, mocking exchange of contempt between posters.

you've repeatedly raised your own concerns about trolling and this boards principal troll, but suggest raising additional concern will get no further, as you say, 'traction'. I disagree simply because, unlike you/your statement, I do not believe the board admin is at all aware of its pervasiveness or the moderation position that refuses to deal with it. My raised concern is echoed many times over in this thread by other members (we, the designate/relegate 'complainers/whiners') and through the private correspondence sent my way. You started your own moderation 'concern thread' with a pointed emphasis on suspensions; to again, as you said, "go after something that might get some traction, which is reducing the number of bloody suspensions and redefining what gets you punished in the first place." Of course, one of the leading reasons behind your raised concern over the "number of bloody suspensions"... is that many/most of them stem from reactions to the flagrant trolling/troll and the moderation position/practices that reflect upon the related "number of bloody suspensions". In any case, other than the reference to what you privately said concerning admin/Greg's recognition of the degree of trolling, I don't believe I've stated anything you said in private that you haven't said publicly. As I said, I let your first shot go... but after the second one I chose to question your selective preference in how to deal with concerns about moderation... or is it you're simply miffed because your own 'concern thread' on moderation isn't getting any/much, uhhh.... as you say, traction?

[waldo]

I agree 100%, but it is still very interesting to read about the lengths that some will go to in their attempt(s) to organize attacks against other members. I mean...seriously ???? Who does that ????

more peppered conspiracy for your victim play

[jbg]

I agree 100%, but it is still very interesting to read about the lengths that some will go to in their attempt(s) to organize attacks against other members. I mean...seriously ???? Who does that ????

I think some people have more important things to do in life than to conjure up group attacks on screen names.

[Argus]

I agree 100%, but it is still very interesting to read about the lengths that some will go to in their attempt(s) to organize attacks against other members. I mean...seriously ???? Who does that ????

In point of fact, MLW member Waldo PMed me after reading of the moderation topic I had begun, unable to post because he had been suspended. I simply responded to it, largely disagreeing with him. As most of have noted, MLW member Waldo does not accept disagreement lightly.

Edited April 14, 2014 by Argus

[Argus]

you've repeatedly raised your own concerns about trolling and this boards principal troll

My concern is with moderation policies on a number of stances. You are fixated, one might even suggest obsessed with a particular troll, far beyond his value. My concerns go beyond the personal indignation you feel towards him. And as I said in that PM I regard your own behaviour on this web site as almost as bad as his. The level of snarling, mocking, denigrating contempt in your posts is your stock in trade here. In point of fact, I don't believe I have ever seen you participate in a discussion without it. Honestly, are you like this in real life?

[WWWTT]

MLW member Waldo does not accept disagreement lightly.

That actually fuels the activity on this forum.

If everyone agreed immediately, I think this place would be to boring and I would lose interest.

If you agree with me, then you would either reply with a comment like "I agree" or not reply.

If you disagree, for whatever reason, you would then more and likely reply with your response.

WWWTT

[Argus]

That actually fuels the activity on this forum.

If everyone agreed immediately, I think this place would be to boring and I would lose interest.

Let us just say that some of us approach discussions here in an agressive fashion suitable to Roman gladiator fights, a kind of no-holds-barred, go-for-the-throat determination to destroy their interlocutor. And this sort of 'discussion' cannot help but lead to insults and vituperation.

I make no claim to being a saint, and when someone takes an absurd position my contempt for that position is seldom entirely absent from my posts (and it can spill out onto the person holding that position). But I do try to maintain a semblence of politeness on most occasions.

[bush_cheney2004]

My concern is with moderation policies on a number of stances. You are fixated, one might even suggest obsessed with a particular troll, far beyond his value. My concerns go beyond the personal indignation you feel towards him.

Perhaps, but your continued characterization and labeling of any other MLW member as a "troll" does not serve this forum well and only continues the cycle. If you really believed in making improvements beyond such petty insults, then it wouldn't continue to happen.

[WWWTT]

Let us just say that some of us approach discussions here in an agressive fashion suitable to Roman gladiator fights, a kind of no-holds-barred, go-for-the-throat determination to destroy their interlocutor. And this sort of 'discussion' cannot help but lead to insults and vituperation.

I make no claim to being a saint, and when someone takes an absurd position my contempt for that position is seldom entirely absent from my posts (and it can spill out onto the person holding that position). But I do try to maintain a semblence of politeness on most occasions.

Thanks, you proved my point in responding.

And I also agree with your statement!

Good comment!

WWWTT

[waldo]

In point of fact, MLW member Waldo PMed me after reading of the moderation topic I had begun, unable to post because he had been suspended. I simply responded to it, largely disagreeing with him. As most of have noted, MLW member Waldo does not accept disagreement lightly.

how coy - you 'responded' multiple times. Your public and private writings reinforce your concerns that trolling is a problem. You wildly contradict yourself if you don't recognize/accept that your emphasis on suspensions is directly tied to trolling and the affect it has on resultant suspensions... as in suspensions that ignore the perpetrators in favour of suspending those who, "purposely, or inadvertendly, or unrecognizingly, or unknowingly, respond to recognized board trolls." As it stands, as you fully acknowledge, the existing MLW rule against trolling is not being directly enforced; instead, members have an onus placed on them to presumes to both interpret and respond, "purposely, or inadvertendly, or unrecognizingly, or unknowingly", to a rule not being actively/directly enforced. As in backasswards!

[waldo]

Perhaps, but your continued characterization and labeling of any other MLW member as a "troll" does not serve this forum well and only continues the cycle. If you really believed in making improvements beyond such petty insults, then it wouldn't continue to happen.

and you wouldn't continue to perpetuate it

[waldo]

My concern is with moderation policies on a number of stances. You are fixated, one might even suggest obsessed with a particular troll, far beyond his value. My concerns go beyond the personal indignation you feel towards him. And as I said in that PM I regard your own behaviour on this web site as almost as bad as his. The level of snarling, mocking, denigrating contempt in your posts is your stock in trade here. In point of fact, I don't believe I have ever seen you participate in a discussion without it. Honestly, are you like this in real life?

ya ya, we each had a go at what we thought of each other... and then we proceeded to discuss our agreements as to what's wrong with moderation on this board. Look, I get it; you're clearly miffed because I repeated something you said in a private discussion. But hey, if you're not prepared to stand behind what you said..... Your reaction has managed to take the emphasis off your own moderation concern and simply fueled a victimization ploy.

[waldo]

I make no claim to being a saint, and when someone takes an absurd position my contempt for that position is seldom entirely absent from my posts (and it can spill out onto the person holding that position). But I do try to maintain a semblence of politeness on most occasions.

truthfully... given what you had just writtern, I almost responded to you in my last post as 'Saint Argus'. Apparently, you view your own reactions to your acknowledged contempt for others... those you don't agree with... differently from how you just spoke to (your perceived) recognition of how I respond to those I disagree with. Good to know!

[Argus]

Perhaps, but your continued characterization and labeling of any other MLW member as a "troll" does not serve this forum well and only continues the cycle. If you really believed in making improvements beyond such petty insults, then it wouldn't continue to happen.

I can only think of one person I label a troll here, bush_cheney2004. And I don't regard it as an insult so much as a statement of obvious fact.

[Argus]

truthfully... given what you had just writtern, I almost responded to you in my last post as 'Saint Argus'. Apparently, you view your own reactions to your acknowledged contempt for others... those you don't agree with... differently from how you just spoke to (your perceived) recognition of how I respond to those I disagree with. Good to know!

There is a difference between having an occasional drink and being an alcoholic.

I wonder if there is a 12 step program for internet flamers.

[waldo]

There is a difference between having an occasional drink and being an alcoholic.

I wonder if there is a 12 step program for internet flamers.

I hope you get the help/assistance you're inquiring on!

[bush_cheney2004]

I can only think of one person I label a troll here, bush_cheney2004. And I don't regard it as an insult so much as a statement of obvious fact.

Of course, cementing your position and opinions on the matter as very biased and subjective. No matter, as the plot has now curiously and ironically turned to you arguing with yet another member about the Great Troll Hunt, PMs, and the work our mods do to your great dissatisfaction.

[waldo]

more pepper please!