Law and Order in America

[BubberMiley]

Ah, the old tin foil hat argument. Doesn't get any shallower than that.

[GostHacked]

More shallow??

The cops dont want to hurt the kids, but then break his arm trying to get him off the bus. To server and protect... right?

And more just doing their job.. right??

Edited February 8, 2015 by GostHacked

[Argus]

More shallow??

The cops dont want to hurt the kids, but then break his arm trying to get him off the bus. To server and protect... right?

And more just doing their job.. right??

I've said before that it is the military mindset which has crept into policing, and their determination that all they deal with MUST obey their commands - or else. When I was young, if a school principal had asked for a raid because he suspected a single student was dealing drugs one fat cop might have showed up and asked the kid to open his locker. Now we get a SWAT team with police dogs and drawn weapons. Ridiculous. At least the principal had to resign and the city and police had to pay out a million bucks, but there's no indication police learn anything from this. Honestly, I'd almost want to disband all SWAT teams except there are occasions - rare - when they are needed. But police use them far too much, in both the US and Canada. And police have presumed too much on their Godlike powers to enforce the law to think they can enforce their own orders too.

Maybe a rule that said any use of a SWAT team has to be cleared with the mayor would help. Not that mayor's can't be idiots but they're at least more likely to consider public sentiment.

Edited February 8, 2015 by Argus

[GostHacked]

I've said before that it is the military mindset which has crept into policing, and their determination that all they deal with MUST obey their commands - or else. When I was young, if a school principal had asked for a raid because he suspected a single student was dealing drugs one fat cop might have showed up and asked the kid to open his locker. Now we get a SWAT team with police dogs and drawn weapons. Ridiculous. At least the principal had to resign and the city and police had to pay out a million bucks, but there's no indication police learn anything from this. Honestly, I'd almost want to disband all SWAT teams except there are occasions - rare - when they are needed. But police use them far too much, in both the US and Canada. And police have presumed too much on their Godlike powers to enforce the law to think they can enforce their own orders too.

Maybe a rule that said any use of a SWAT team has to be cleared with the mayor would help. Not that mayor's can't be idiots but they're at least more likely to consider public sentiment.

Now ramp that up and apply the same logics to the threats of radical islamic terrorism, and how the militarized police come into play.

[Argus]

Now ramp that up and apply the same logics to the threats of radical islamic terrorism, and how the militarized police come into play.

When they do I'll be concerned. The police are an issue NOW.

And btw, I have no issue with increasing oversight for CSIS or others intelligence agencies. I think there ought to be a parliamentary committee overseeing them, just as the opposition has suggested.

[GostHacked]

When they do I'll be concerned. The police are an issue NOW.

Ask yourself, 'how and why did the police become heavily militarized?' and I will say '9/11'. Remember, the government wants to keep you safe from terrorism. If so, why is it scaring me more than the terrorists?

And btw, I have no issue with increasing oversight for CSIS or others intelligence agencies. I think there ought to be a parliamentary committee overseeing them, just as the opposition has suggested.

Agreed.

[GostHacked]

Another example of just a few bad apples.

I do not know what warranted the traffic stop, but being dragged out of your car like this is concerning. And again we see more uniforms show up to help their fellow officers with proper and within guidelines detainment.

Typical 'stop resisting' bull from the cops while 6 cops are on him. You just try to move with 6 cops on you, and then the tazer comes in. A few kicks the female voice again sai s 'Roll over'. You try rolling over where you have 6 cops on you and you are getting tazed. But if you cannot comply then you are resisting and more blows and more tazer action.

The last line really takes it.

'Ya'll hold up, we are red right now.' Sure let's flip that camera off now so we can really administer some justice.

[jacee]

Police kill sleeping child:

Charges dropped

http://www.policestateusa.com/2014/aiyana-stanley-jones-raid/

DETROIT, MI A Special Response Team shattered a familys window in the middle of the night, hurled a flashbang onto a couch next to a sleeping girl, then charged in and shot her in the head. The hyper-aggressive tactics were made worse by the fact that police had taken it upon themselves to raid both sides of a duplex, when their suspect was only known to reside in one of them.

Edited March 14, 2015 by jacee

[GostHacked]

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/18/us/dallas-police-fatal-shooting-mentally-ill-man-video/

One of two Dallas police officers called to the scene tells Harrison to drop the tool, a command the officers repeat at least four times as Harrison's mom screams, "Jay! Jay! Jay!"

Within 5 seconds of that first command, the 39-year-old schizophrenic man is shot five times -- including twice in the back as he crashes headlong into the home's garage door, just a few feet from his mother.

Video from one officer's body camera fades to black as Harrison's mother wails, "Oh, they killed my son! Oh, they killed my son!" The officers continue to tell Harrison to drop the weapon.

[GostHacked]

Here is the longer video.

[guyser]

Those cops should never be cops again for the rest of their lives.

Not to mention they should personlly pay all damages. So damn sickening.

[GostHacked]

Those cops should never be cops again for the rest of their lives.

Not to mention they should personlly pay all damages. So damn sickening.

It is sickening. I was reading more on the CNN link and then watched the 18 minute video, the CNN article did not get a few things right. But hey that's MSM for ya. After the shooting you can hear the one cop repeat 'oh shit' over and over again ... he knows he f'd up.

Sometimes it takes a few seconds for 'drop the screwdriver' to actually dropping the screwdriver, but it only took 5 seconds from the that moment to the moment they both opened fire on the man.

So next time one thinks they need to call the cops for help, they could end up dead by the cops that were called to help. It's happened before.

[On Guard for Thee]

Those cops should never be cops again for the rest of their lives.

Not to mention they should personlly pay all damages. So damn sickening.

You can almost see the steroids oozing from these brain dead morons. Pay damages!...hell they should be locked up.

[guyser]

You can almost see the steroids oozing from these brain dead morons. Pay damages!...hell they should be locked up.

Ok you win, lock em up.

But one condition, general pop please.

I do realize that may bring hardship and would be hypocritical of me, but I am willing to suspend that for a spell.

[On Guard for Thee]

Ok you win, lock em up.

But one condition, general pop please.

I do realize that may bring hardship and would be hypocritical of me, but I am willing to suspend that for a spell.

And may I suggest Angola.

[Argus]

You can almost see the steroids oozing from these brain dead morons. Pay damages!...hell they should be locked up.

That's not going to happen. This will be considered 'a good shoot'. The suspect had a deadly weapon, after all.

You know, there was a time, way back in the dark ages, when cops would, in most cases, fight with people when necessary, especially if there were multiple cops and just one suspect. I mean they would jump them, wrestle something like a pipe or screwdriver out of their hands, and handcuff them. And it would have been considered pretty routine. Now, at any sign of resistance it seems they go for the taser, and if the person has anything in their hand, be it a screwdriver, a pipe, a piece of wood, they just blast away. All the guy had was a screwdriver. They could have backed away to try and defuse the situation. But it seems like cops don't like to back away much, not even when they can and society has given them the leeway not to have to. If they feel threatened, they can shoot, and that's that.

Edited March 24, 2015 by Argus

[On Guard for Thee]

That's not going to happen. This will be considered 'a good shoot'. The suspected had a deadly weapon, after all.

You know, there was a time, way back in the dark ages, when cops would, in most cases, fight with people when necessary, especially if there were multiple cops and just one suspect. I mean they would jump them, wrestle something like a pipe or screwdriver out of their hands, and handcuff them. And it would have been considered pretty routine. Now, at any sign of resistance it seems they go for the taser, and if the person has anything in their hand, be it a screwdriver, a pipe, a piece of wood, they just blast away. All the guy had was a screwdriver. They could have backed away to try and defuse the situation. But it seems like cops don't like to back away much, not even when they can and society has given them the leeway not to have to. If they feel threatened, they can shoot, and that's that.

No, nothing will likely happen. This sort of thing has seemingly become routine in the states. There are a couple of question marks in my mind right off the bat: first is why were the police there in the first place, and second, unfortunately there is a gap in the video were its a bit of a blur between when the kid is simply standing at the door with his screwdriver ( he didnt look too menacing at that point) and when the shots begin to ring out. Did he make a threatening move, hard to say. Of course we know what the cops will say. I dont know what the mother saw but of course whatever she has to say will be overrun by two of Dallas finest.

[GostHacked]

No, nothing will likely happen. This sort of thing has seemingly become routine in the states. There are a couple of question marks in my mind right off the bat: first is why were the police there in the first place, and second, unfortunately there is a gap in the video were its a bit of a blur between when the kid is simply standing at the door with his screwdriver ( he didnt look too menacing at that point) and when the shots begin to ring out. Did he make a threatening move, hard to say. Of course we know what the cops will say. I dont know what the mother saw but of course whatever she has to say will be overrun by two of Dallas finest.

I would argue that it is not just in the USA, but everywhere. Not to the extent as we see it in the USA, (technology + large population).

There is another 18 minute video of the incident from the other officers body cam. It is even more damning than the 1 and 3 minute clips I posted. Even if you go with the 1 minute video, by the time the camera rolls and the guy is down is about 20-30 seconds. How the cops are to assess a situation in that short of a time frame , especially when nothing stressing is going on (mom acts calm and all the other stuff) but as soon as the guy shows at the door the cops escalate the situation instantly.

[guyser]

I would argue that it is not just in the USA, but everywhere.

Not everywhere, at least in civilized countries.

Did you know that in England (stats yr 2010) no people were shot by cops...none...nada...zero

Australia...6

Germany...even fewer.

USA...400+

[Argus]

Not everywhere, at least in civilized countries.

Did you know that in England (stats yr 2010) no people were shot by cops...none...nada...zero

Australia...6

Germany...even fewer.

USA...400+

Canadian cops are not terribly hesitant to start shooting, either.

[GostHacked]

Canadian cops are not terribly hesitant to start shooting, either.

Yatim in Toronto is a good example.

[guyser]

Both true, but 14 is a long way from being the US. I wish it were the same as Aus numbers but we gte ionlfuenced heavily from the south

[Je suis Omar]

Last but not least, police officers save American lives. Al Qaeda, not so much.

Had you heeded Al Qaeda's frequent warnings about US terrorist actions against various and sundry peoples around the globe, many lives could have been saved - many orders of magnitude more than died on September 11 and the vast majority of those, the poor from around the globe who had never done a thing to the US except that they felt they deserved a share in the wealth of their own nations.

[Je suis Omar]

... terrorists can find more love in Canada !

Really, Dick?

:::::::::::::::::::

Americas Terrorist Training Camp

30th October 2001

Whats the difference between Al Qaeda and Fort Benning?

By George Monbiot. Published in the Guardian 30th October 2001

If any government sponsors the outlaws and killers of innocents, George Bush announced on the day he began bombing Afghanistan, they have become outlaws and murderers themselves. And they will take that lonely path at their own peril. Im glad he said any government, as theres one which, though it has yet to be identified as a sponsor of terrorism, requires his urgent attention.

For the past 55 years it has been running a terrorist training camp, whose victims massively outnumber the people killed by the attack on New York, the embassy bombings and the other atrocities laid, rightly or wrongly, at Al-Qaedas door. The camp is called the Western Hemisphere Institute for Security Cooperation, or WHISC. It is based in Fort Benning, Georgia, and it is funded by Mr Bushs government.

Until January this year, WHISC was called the School of the Americas, or SOA. Since 1946 SOA has trained over 60,000 Latin American soldiers and policemen. Among its graduates are many of the continents most notorious torturers, mass murderers, dictators and state terrorists. As hundreds of pages of documentation compiled by the pressure group SOA Watch shows, Latin America has been ripped apart by its alumni.

...

http://www.monbiot.com/2001/10/30/americas-terrorist-training-camp/

[bush_cheney2004]

Really, Dick?

Yeah...really. Fort Benning has a much better jump school.