Scotty Posted January 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 (edited) Your intentions are irrelevant when it comes to another's offence. Do you think sexual harassment, for example, depends on the harasser's intent? "I didn't mean to harass her. She's just taking it the wrong way." That doesn't raelly fly. What if she's offended because I say women shouldn't be in the work place but should be at home looking after their children? Would I dare make that opinion known around the office? And if I did, would women complain to the boss and get me in trouble? And don't try to suggest circumstances where I'm trying to intimidate someone. That's not the meaning of the 'offending' question. Suppose I tell it to a male colleague, and he tells it to some women and the women at the office find out. Could I not be subjected to some sort of HR complaint? In Europe I bet I could. There are far more limits on freedom of speech in Europe in order to control offensive opinions and behavior. Edited January 17, 2013 by Scotty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted January 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 (edited) Not possible. You don't get to define whether or not another person is offended. This is not about defining whether people get offended. It is about whether we do too much to protect people from being offended. By all means, if you really want to, be offended. But don't ask the government, or human resources, or a web site administrator to punish someone because their opinion offends you. Because I believe the more we're protected from ideas and words that offend us the more insular we become and thus the more easily we become offended by anything which challenges our comfortable assumptions. Edited January 17, 2013 by Scotty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted January 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 It is a little insensitive. What is 'sensitive'? How sensitive should we, as members of a society, be acting? Should we be walking on tippy toes in everything we say and do so as to not cause offense? Much like all those stores with their big "HOLIDAY SALE" which everyone knows is for Christmas but which they don't say for fear of giving offense. Which of course, itself causes offense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted January 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 CC, you may find this article of interest: The Supposed Virtue of Not Being Offended Here are some quotes from an article that I think is very well written: [/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color] Ok, I quoted these parts as a teaser but the whole article is worth a read. I am very much in favour of growing a thicker skin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted January 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 I made the statement that if you offend someone, you should try not to be offensive going forward. I think that's common courtesy. What if you strongly hold a particular opinion on social mores or politics and it offends someone? Should you repress your views? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 You can - but you are telling people how to behave to a degree. It's a choice. Of course and as a member of civil society, we ought to expect a certain standard. Spray painting Swastikas on Synagogues is rightfully condemned, for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 How is being anti-social a disorder? I may consider myself anti-social, it's not a disorder, but just the way I have always been. but I am sure there is a prescription I could get to cure my anti-social behaviour. All other aspects of my life are just fine, and I am also ok with being mostly anti-social. You're using the term colloquially. There is such a thing as clinical antisocial personality disorder. It has a very particular definition, which admittedly only tangentially has anything to do with being offensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 If you are being offensive to someone you are being social, sure not in a very nice manner, but it is not anti-social behaviour. This is a pretty pedantic view of the matter. Being insufferable while in the company of others would not keep you in the company of others very long. Hence, it's anti-social behaviour because people rightfully won't put up with you unless forced to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 What if she's offended because I say women shouldn't be in the work place but should be at home looking after their children? Would I dare make that opinion known around the office? And if I did, would women complain to the boss and get me in trouble? And don't try to suggest circumstances where I'm trying to intimidate someone. That's not the meaning of the 'offending' question. Suppose I tell it to a male colleague, and he tells it to some women and the women at the office find out. Could I not be subjected to some sort of HR complaint? In Europe I bet I could. There are far more limits on freedom of speech in Europe in order to control offensive opinions and behavior. I'm not really interested in organizational policy, so I'm not really sure how this relates to my arguments in this thread so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 This is not about defining whether people get offended. It is about whether we do too much to protect people from being offended. By all means, if you really want to, be offended.Who is we? You seem to be suggesting that there are inappropriate laws or business practices that protect people from being offended, but you haven't given any particular examples or expanded on the argument enough that I'm even sure what you're talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 What if you strongly hold a particular opinion on social mores or politics and it offends someone? Should you repress your views? You certainly shouldn't force your views on someone that finds them offensive. Say you're black and I happen to hate black people. Should I be able to tell you every day that I think you're a nigger and tell you what filthy scum you are? Should I go on to tell you that I think you should be hung or shipped back to Africa? That's just a viewpoint. Should it be repressed? If someone doesn't want to be exposed to things that they find offensive, they should be free to escape those things. The problem arises when they're not free to escape them and you force them to be subjected to them against their will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Who is we? You seem to be suggesting that there are inappropriate laws or business practices that protect people from being offended, but you haven't given any particular examples or expanded on the argument enough that I'm even sure what you're talking about. Hate speech laws are an example of an inappropriate law that prevents people from being offended by someone inciting hate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Show me the exact law that you're talking about and tell me what parts you have a problem with and why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Of course and as a member of civil society, we ought to expect a certain standard. Spray painting Swastikas on Synagogues is rightfully condemned, for example. I'm not a moralist, I guess. I see these rules as producing a result and I feel comfortable living by the Golden Rule but I don't see them as necessary. There are lots of types of people who feel it's necessary to offend and I don't think less of them, necessarily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 What is 'sensitive'? How sensitive should we, as members of a society, be acting? Should we be walking on tippy toes in everything we say and do so as to not cause offense? Much like all those stores with their big "HOLIDAY SALE" which everyone knows is for Christmas but which they don't say for fear of giving offense. Which of course, itself causes offense. I forgot to add, "but that's okay". There's nothing wrong with being insensitive. In fact, I would imagine, like being offended, it's not a choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Manny Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I forgot to add, "but that's okay". There's nothing wrong with being insensitive. In fact, I would imagine, like being offended, it's not a choice. To you it's ok, but to some others it's not. What about passing judgement, deciding, as opposed to being non-judgemental of others. How are you with that kinda stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I guess insensitive would be the same as being over sensitive. Sometimes one can help it, sometimes one can't. Either way, I would hate to be judged on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Manny Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Yeah, I think I understand what you mean now. Not having strong emotions about things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Yes, we should all be stoics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Manny Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Yes, we should all be stoics. Or cowboys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Cowboy Stoics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Yes, we should all be stoics. Or adults. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shady Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 But you often characterize my arguments as racist, don't you? He likes to characterize a lot of people as racist. The funny thing is, that when I called somebody a bigot for posting what I thought was a bigoted opinion, I received a 30 day suspension. Funny how that works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 He likes to characterize a lot of people as racist. I don`t think so. If you have some links that show me calling lots of people racist then I will concur. The irony here is that people seem to be protesting being unjustly called something but they`re doing the same thing to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Or adults. Because adults don't have feelings? We've already made the distinction between being offended and acting on that. There's appropriate and inappropriate ways of handling it. Just as there's appropriate and inappropriate ways to conduct yourself when you're being offensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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