Public Sector Unions

[JerrySeinfeld]

The nation of the united states is so unfortunately stricken by a bad racial past.

Thanks to the Democrats, this division continues to this day. Affirmative action (racial discrimination) has been rampant in government for decades. This is what happens: the public sector is the new "black middle class". Teachers and government workers - people who rely on higher taxes to continually improve their own standard of living.

What you have is a whole swath of people who live off of the wealth of others. That's what government is.

Obama loves this. That's why he expanded government so rapidly. More black government workers and less wealth creators is the recipe for endless democrat governments.

You may say this is racist, but really, who is racist? If people were hired for merit instead of for race, then we wouldn't have to call democrats racist. But that's what they advocate: hiring people or accepting them to university for race instead of merit. Disgusting and racist.

Edited September 14, 2012 by JerrySeinfeld

[Michael Hardner]

Hi Jerry - you really don't seem to be initiating a good discussion with this post.

It's kind of a general rant against affirmative action.

[JerrySeinfeld]

Hi Jerry - you really don't seem to be initiating a good discussion with this post.

It's kind of a general rant against affirmative action.

No it's more than that. It's an explanation of how affirmative action and it's commensurate government unions have fueled democrat power and it's certainly worthy of discussion.

Race is an alive issue in the united states because of these policies. Democrats depend upon it.

Edited September 14, 2012 by JerrySeinfeld

[Argus]

The nation of the united states is so unfortunately stricken by a bad racial past.

Thanks to the Democrats, this division continues to this day. Affirmative action (racial discrimination) has been rampant in government for decades. This is what happens: the public sector is the new "black middle class". Teachers and government workers - people who rely on higher taxes to continually improve their own standard of living.

This is just more of the same drivel you were spouting lat week about how it's the Democrats who are responsible for racial divides and not the Republicans. You can't seem to grasp the fact that minorities are unlikely to vote for a party which clearly doesn't like them (the Republicans). You also can't seem to understand that affirmative action was supported by both parties, as well as often being mandated by the US court system. It's only in last couple of decades some on the right have begun questioning it.

What you have is a whole swath of people who live off of the wealth of others. That's what government is.

Are you referring to Blacks, Public Servants, or anyone on welfare? Despite your topic title this seems to have precious little to do with public servants and just more anger about Blacks voting Democrat.

I myself have decried the warehousing of people on welfare. The problem I have with the Republicans is their answer is simply to cut welfare. There's no actual plan to get these people skills training and jobs because that in itself would cost a lot of money and the supporters of the Republican Party don't care about anyone but themselves. They don't want to spend money on getting people into jobs. All they want is to get their taxes cut, so simple answers please them.

But there are no simple answers about what to do with people, blacks or otherwise, who have been living in a culture of dependency for generations, often in geographical areas where no one has work of any substance and where such work is not available. Simply cutting their welfare and food stamps, health care and home heating oil support, etc. etc. is just going to make them more miserable, cause more death, more poverty, and almost certainly more crime. The answer is to improve education and job skills training, not just cut people off because it's cheaper.

You may say this is racist, but really, who is racist? If people were hired for merit instead of for race, then we wouldn't have to call democrats racist.

Hmm. I won't say all Republicans are racists, but the evidence would suggest all racists are Republicans.

And I'm not really a supporter of Affirmative Action.

Edited September 15, 2012 by Argus

[eyeball]

But there are no simple answers about what to do with people, blacks or otherwise, who have been living in a culture of dependency for generations, often in geographical areas where no one has work of any substance and where such work is not available. Simply cutting their welfare and food stamps, health care and home heating oil support, etc. etc. is just going to make them more miserable, cause more death, more poverty, and almost certainly more crime. The answer is to improve education and job skills training, not just cut people off because it's cheaper.

How does improving education and job skills training deal with geographical issues associated with unemployment such as the unavailability of work and mortgages for example? Our living was based on a dependency on fish and forests for generations, which are still here I might add but they're off limits now. Because of affirmative action for entitled corporations strangely enough.

There are probably no simple answers because the questions are so complicated. I'd move if I could take my house with me but if I leave it behind I'll go bankrupt.

[Shady]

Anyone paying any attention to the Chicago teachers strike?

In Philadelphia, 44 percent of the teachers put their children in private schools; in Cincinnati, 41 percent; Chicago, 39 percent

WT

That must be one heck of a school system if 40% of teachers choose to send their kids to private schools.

However, the worst part of the teacters strike, is that it hurts families and children that can least afford it. The largest percentage of children attending Chicago public schools are minorities, and families that earn less than $30,000 dollars per year. So it's also a transfer of weath, from a lesser income group to a higher income group.

Middle-class parents and two-earner households scrambling for child care may not sympathize. According to the union's own figures, the average Chicago public school teacher makes $71,000 a year in salary, and that's before pensions and benefits generally worth $15,000 or more a year. Senior teachers make much more. That's not a bad deal compared to the median household income of $47,000 for a Chicago worker in the private economy

WSJ

Apparently a 16% pay increase isn't good enough. What economy are they living in?

[punked]

Anyone paying any attention to the Chicago teachers strike?

That must be one heck of a school system if 40% of teachers choose to send their kids to private schools.

However, the worst part of the teacters strike, is that it hurts families and children that can least afford it. The largest percentage of children attending Chicago public schools are minorities, and families that earn less than $30,000 dollars per year. So it's also a transfer of weath, from a lesser income group to a higher income group.

Apparently a 16% pay increase isn't good enough. What economy are they living in?

You do know the teacher strike is about lowering classroom sizes, and rolling back funding cut backs right? The teachers already said no to a 14% wage increase because that wouldn't have helped students. This is one of those times where Shady knows nothing at all.

[cybercoma]

But it's a public union striking. It must be bad, right? They just want more money! Freeloading public service employees!

What's that? They turned down a raise. LIES! They want more funding for the classrooms? LIES! They want smaller class sizes? LIES!

It has to be about their benefits and salaries. Nobody strikes for any other reason.

Stop lying, punked!

[punked]

But it's a public union striking. It must be bad, right? They just want more money! Freeloading public service employees!

What's that? They turned down a raise. LIES! They want more funding for the classrooms? LIES! They want smaller class sizes? LIES!

It has to be about their benefits and salaries. Nobody strikes for any other reason.

Stop lying, punked!

Yep an idiot would respond this story that way with actually reading what the teachers demands were.

[Argus]

Anyone paying any attention to the Chicago teachers strike?

That must be one heck of a school system if 40% of teachers choose to send their kids to private schools.

This is the United States. Anyone who makes enough money sends their kids to private schools unless they live in a suburban area where the schools are of high quality. City schools, be it Chicago, Detroit, Washington, Houston, Boston or wherever, will be filled with the kids of people who didn't make enough to find better. Basically, all the white people who could afford to fled the urban public schools decades ago when the courts ordered desegregation. Needless to say that led to them also having little issue cutting back funding to those public schools. So now they're of low quality and full of minorities.

[Shady]

You do know the teacher strike is about lowering classroom sizes, and rolling back funding cut backs right? The teachers already said no to a 14% wage increase because that wouldn't have helped students. This is one of those times where Shady knows nothing at all.

Complete nonsense. They turned down a raise because it wasn't as big of a raise as they wanted. Class sizes are already small in Chicago. That's a fake issue to deflect from their more greedy demands. I hope that Rahm Emanuel stands his ground!

Chicago teachers also have the shortest school year of any of the major cities.

[punked]

Complete nonsense. They turned down a raise because it wasn't as big of a raise as they wanted. Class sizes are already small in Chicago. That's a fake issue to deflect from their more greedy demands. I hope that Rahm Emanuel stands his ground!

Chicago teachers also have the shortest school year of any of the major cities.

Well they have a settlement Shady so soon we will have details wont we? From what I can see this is about standardized tests, pulling money from the system and the kids. In fact you are the only person I have read say this is about money. I guess in Shadyland which is the fantasy world you live in that might be true. I live in the real world as I often have to remind you.

Edited September 16, 2012 by punked

[Michael Hardner]

It has to be about their benefits and salaries. Nobody strikes for any other reason.

I do want to ask, though - isn't this the primary reason why people strike ? To protect job security, wages and benefits ?

Individuals do this all the time, and its more effective to do it as a bloc so why is this an issue ?

[bleeding heart]

I do want to ask, though - isn't this the primary reason why people strike ? To protect job security, wages and benefits ?

Individuals do this all the time, and its more effective to do it as a bloc so why is this an issue ?

Why labour organizations in this system would be fighting for better wages and conditions?

You're right, it sounds not only rational, but perfectly....capitalist!

So it's interesting from which direction most of the hatred emanates.

[Michael Hardner]

So it's interesting from which direction most of the hatred emanates.

It's the sparring for the hearts & minds of the mythical swing voters that we're witnessing perhaps.

[Pliny]

Affirmative action is instituted racism designed to correct instituted racism. It violates equal treatment under the law as did the previous instituted racism which were mostly State segregation laws that were, previous to Affirmative action and rightly so, struck down.

The economic viability of public sector unions has been discussed before and they will eventually, because they are a special interest not concerned with the tax-paying public, bankrupt a government. Private sector unions in the US represent about only 8% of the work force today. They destroyed the US steel industry and will destroy GM, which the delusional President feels he has saved. If Obama is re-elected he will preside over its collapse. If Romney is elected he will preside over it's collapse and take the heat for it. I am hoping Obama is re-elected after which the Democrat party will self-destruct. Unfortunately, the world will also be left in an unstable state without any clear leadership. There will probably be a coalition, committee or cartel of nations,

all equal. Inevitably, as with any collectivist, centralized system some nations will be more equal than others.

The world is in a precarious position and American public unions are concentrating on things like class size and bullying bargaining rights.

It will take another term for Obama to achieve his goal of fundamentally transforming America. He believes himself to be intelligent enough to have the world live harmoniously together, although current conflict in the middle-east indicates otherwise.

[The_Squid]

Affirmative action is instituted racism designed to correct instituted racism. It violates equal treatment under the law as did the previous instituted racism which were mostly State segregation laws that were, previous to Affirmative action and rightly so, struck down.

The economic viability of public sector unions has been discussed before and they will eventually, because they are a special interest not concerned with the tax-paying public, bankrupt a government. Private sector unions in the US represent about only 8% of the work force today. They destroyed the US steel industry and will destroy GM, which the delusional President feels he has saved. If Obama is re-elected he will preside over its collapse. If Romney is elected he will preside over it's collapse and take the heat for it. I am hoping Obama is re-elected after which the Democrat party will self-destruct. Unfortunately, the world will also be left in an unstable state without any clear leadership. There will probably be a coalition, committee or cartel of nations,

all equal. Inevitably, as with any collectivist, centralized system some nations will be more equal than others.

The world is in a precarious position and American public unions are concentrating on things like class size and bullying bargaining rights.

It will take another term for Obama to achieve his goal of fundamentally transforming America. He believes himself to be intelligent enough to have the world live harmoniously together, although current conflict in the middle-east indicates otherwise.

Where do you get this shit??? You go from unions to a cartel of nations to Obama transforming America into.... ummmm... not sure what.... back to unions.... then to the Middle East!

If there was ever a case for the moderators to prescribe Ritalin to some members, that post was it!

[Pliny]

Where do you get this shit??? You go from unions to a cartel of nations to Obama transforming America into.... ummmm... not sure what.... back to unions.... then to the Middle East!

If there was ever a case for the moderators to prescribe Ritalin to some members, that post was it!

I have a cat her name is Fifi.

[Michael Hardner]

Please keep the dialogue to a higher level than this. It makes the forum look bad with insults and nonsensical answers.

[Pliny]

Please keep the dialogue to a higher level than this. It makes the forum look bad with insults and nonsensical answers.

He started it.