BC Latest Polling Results

[maplesyrup]

New Democrats continue to lead the Liberals:

New Democrats: 42%

Liberals: 40%

Green: 11%

Reform BC: 2%

Social Credit: 1%

Other: 2%

Mustel Group Market Research

[Big Blue Machine]

If only it was that close during the federal election between the Cons and Libs. With the Cons in the lead of course.

[August1991]

From MS link above:

The increase in support for the BC Liberals comes largely from male voters; 47% would support BC Liberals (up from 36% in July) in contrast to 38% supporting the NDP (down from 44% in July). Among women, 46% would vote NDP and 31% would support the BC Liberals (similar findings to previous polls).

This implies a large gender split.

The election is nine months from now in May 2005? The NDP leader is new, unknown and a woman? The Green's are taking about 10% of the vote? The NDP vote is concentrated in the south in certain urban ridings?

With 36% of the popular vote in BC, the Tories got 22 out of 36 seats. What are the chances of Campbell getting re-elected?

[maplesyrup]

Speaking of the Tories, apparently there has been a merger between the Unity Party and the Conservative Party of BC. Some people feel Campbell is too close to Martin so they plan to run candidates under the Conservative banner in the coming election.

Vaughn Palmer has a column about it today in the Vancouver Sun.

[caesar]

Seemingly the Unity leader acted without approval of the rest of the party; it will probably not happen. Gordon Campbell is not like the Federal Liberals and in fact is very right wing; we don't need another right wing party. We need one that is more towards the center.

[maplesyrup]

Latest Mustel Group Poll results show Liberals up 6% on the NDP. Liberals are stronger in the Lower Mainland, and the NDP stronger in the rural areas.

Press Release

[caesar]

Are people really falling for the bunch of bs this Campbell government is handing out. They have put us another 3 billion dollars in debt even after cutting services and selling off our assets. Is everyone in BC brain dead?

Another 4 years of Campbell is a depressing thought. Anyhow, the polls for the federal election didn't come out too close so who knows????

[Slavik44]

Are people really falling for the bunch of bs this Campbell government is handing out. They have put us another 3 billion dollars in debt even after cutting services and selling off our assets. Is everyone in BC brain dead?

Another 4 years of Campbell is a depressing thought. Anyhow, the polls for the federal election didn't come out too close so who knows????

which should acutally worry peopel considering, the polls for the federal election were biased agaisnt the governing party. That being said I wonder if the next 4 years woudl get better under the liberals, I mean if we look at basic economics it is well outlined that there is a tendancy for homostasis in the economy, that will dictate a downswing before an upswing as it takes a while for thigns to balance out. Perhpas swingign back and forth every 4 years will keep B.C'ers from every seeing the benifiet of any parties policies. Of course i would prefer a centrist party to be the one to take over and put B.C on the path to long term success.

[takeanumber]

Why can't BC ever elect a moderate party?

Going from the hard left to the hard right, to me, is just insane. You end up cutting too much one year (which acts a drag on the economy) and then spend too much during another year (which racks up even more debt, resulting in higher interest payments, which is a longer term drag on the economy)

To me it's just insane that a moderate, centralist alternative never seems to come up in the deck.

But that's just how BC is I suppose. The moderate middle isn't large enough.

[playfullfellow]

When I lived in BC (over 15 years ago), things were a lot more moderate and centrist was the predominant view. BC was flourishing and life was overall pretty good. There were plenty of good paying jobs. Then it seems that after the Vander Zalm fiasco, everything went down hill. Special interest groups starting ruling the politicians, especially enviromentalist type groups. Unions got everything they wanted to buy their votes. Things went downhill from there. Debt went up, incomes dropped and taxes went up. There has been one scandal after another over the past few years and it doesn't seem to matter which party is in power. The problem lies in that no decent person who might make a good politician wants to get involved in that chaos. They will only get villified and hung out to dry if they don't toe the party line or suck up to the right groups.

BC needs to give its head a shake and decide whether they want to continue to trade out their government every 4 years or settle down and get things back in order again. They also have to realize that special interest groups don't always look out for the best for people as a whole, they have their own agendas.

[maplesyrup]

I grew up in Quebec and thought provincial politics there was nuts until I moved to BC. Politically in a lot of ways these are two crazy but similar provinces.

The only good thing is once and awhile, in spite of the overwhelming media support for the right of centre parties, the New Democrats in BC, still manage to occasionally get elected. Quite an amazing feat when you really think about it.

How many recent BC premiers have bit the dust over some scandal?

Clark

Harcourt

Bennett

Van der Zalm

I'm sure there are more!

[takeanumber]

True.

I still think that special interests can check each other.

I think that's called Madisonian thought.

The downside is that the lower class gets neglected, unless something can be done in this country to improve the mobility of the lowerclass.

Anyway.

The main reason I dislike unions is because, in part, I have a low opinion of Buzz Hargrove, and second, because what has transpired in BC.

[maplesyrup]

Why do you have a low opinion of Buzz Hargrove? His job is to represent his union members and get the best possible wages, benefits, and working conditions possible for them. The CAW are by far the most progressive labour union in the country, constantly challenging its memebers to re-educate themselves to our new Canada, where women for example, are treated as equals, with respect and dignity. It has not been an easy road to hoe.

Buzz's occupation actually sounds like a pretty noble occupation to me.

[maplesyrup]

I just don't understand why we don't adopt some system of guaranteed annual income, which certainly would help to reduce our massive bureaucracy, I think. Think about it - no more social assistance, unemployment insurance, old age pension departments, etc. We could probably eliminate 1/2 the number of civil servants in the country.

[caesar]

no incentive to work. collect the guarantee and then make more money in black market activities; prostitution, drugs, etc. The rest of us will be working our butts off and going no where supporting these lazy bums. No thanks. I don't mind helping out seniors on fixed budgets with inflation eating up their cash; handicapped people should recieve more money for living expenses and enabling them to find meaningful employment that they are capable of or single mothers with young children. But anybody who is physically and mentally capable of work should pull their share of the load

[playfullfellow]

Guaranteed income does not work because it is just an incentive for people to sit on their butts and do nothing. Denmark tried a similar thing in the 70's. The program was not so much as a guaranteed income for but a guaranteed income for people with disabilities, out of work people and people who were on welfare. The unemployment rate shot through the roof, taxes shot up and the working class carried the 18-22 percent who were not working by their own choice or not. Inflation went up, debt went up and job loses were rising. The government had to change it's ways or go bankrupt. It took almost 20 years to repair the damage done by these programs and it produced a generation of people who do not really want to work for a living.

MS, if you want to further explore the socialist or as you prefer far left way of life, do some research on Denmark and Holland. They have tried these types of programs you like and they have failed.

[Stoker]

MS, if you want to further explore the socialist or as you prefer far left way of life, do some research on Denmark and Holland. They have tried these types of programs you like and they have failed.

I think a fair question to ask MS is how s/he would ensure that these programs would work, unlike the programs in other nations that have failed?

Doesn't mean I'm intrested in the programs, just intrested to see what MS would do differently. In principle, I'm with caesar and playfullfellow

[maplesyrup]

I am not suggesting that incentives be taken away from people to work - raising the minimum wage is an excellent example to encourage people to work.

But in Canada no one, and I mean no one, should be without food clothing, medical care and access to education.

[Cartman]

do some research on Denmark and Holland

I will look into these cases...sounds interesting.

If memory serves, the GAI was supported by all three (PC, Libs, NDP) major parties in the early 80's, but it never made top priority. I think MS is just saying that there should be more centralization with these programs as many were not designed for this era.

I think the PC's liked the idea because it was perceived as a way to squeeze out some admin costs.

I like the idea of shaking up bureaucracies every now and then.

[caesar]

- raising the minimum wage is an excellent example to encourage people to work.

Not really; everything goes up in price and no one is any further ahead. It must be done to keep cheapskate employers from paying unfair wages as prices go up but it does not work as a real incentive to make some people look for work.

[Big Blue Machine]

Minumum wage is only for part-time summer students, not 40 year old people.

[caesar]

yes sure; not really. There are many adults working for minimum or barely better especially since you are no longer allowed to quit your job; many cheapo bosses don't feel obligated to give out raises.

Gordon Campbell is trying to have all of us working for minimum wage to help out his rich employer friends. Easier for them to make money when they don't have to pay a living wage

[August1991]

What would happen if it were illegal to buy or sell any car for less than 30,000$? What kind of cars would we see in the marketplace?

Minimum wage legislation does not help poor people. There are other, better ways to do this.

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear August1991,

Minimum wage legislation does not help poor people. There are other, better ways to do this.

Indeed, many argue that the abolishment of minimum wage would employ more (I think Diane Francis of 'Alberta report took this stance some years ago). However, we would have to face the notion of having 'shantytowns' on the edge of the city.

PS. I have sent you an urgent e-mail, (actually 2) I hope you see it soon.

[maplesyrup]

Are we going through this stuff once again?

Why is it always the rich who exploit the poor that want to abolish minimum wage, whereas the poor want minimum wages raised? :angry:

If you want a prosperous and healthy society for all, raise the minimum wage to $15-$20 per hour depending on the cost of living where you live in Canada.