Considering the behavior of bike riders

[The_Squid]

This is a non-issue. The only ones calling for this are road-raging motorists who think that they should own the roads.

Go to Europe. Cycling is huge. There are no licensing requirements and, often, no need for helmet laws. What we need in Canada is proper infrastructure for cyclists. Incentives to get people on bikes, not some silly unenforceable licensing scheme that will have no positive outcomes and will end up costing taxpayers and cyclists more money.

[Canuckistani]

This is a non-issue. The only ones calling for this are road-raging motorists who think that they should own the roads.

Go to Europe. Cycling is huge. There are no licensing requirements and, often, no need for helmet laws. What we need in Canada is proper infrastructure for cyclists. Incentives to get people on bikes, not some silly unenforceable licensing scheme that will have no positive outcomes and will end up costing taxpayers and cyclists more money.

Unfortunately there's no thumbs up smiley here - but I agree wholeheartedly. It's true that in Amsterdam, say, they have more head injuries per capita for cyclists than in Vancouver, where helmets are mandatory, and supposedly worn by 75% of cyclists (never looks that way to me). In Amsterdam they have far fewer car/bike collisions, so injuries are much less, but they do have more cyclist collisions and resulting head injuries. I always wear my helmet. I support the law because I have to pay more taxes if some numbnuts gets a brain injury. But, the argument is that if helmets weren't required, more people would cycle, and the more people are cycling the safer it is for every cyclist.

It's also true tho that Peeves has a point about cyclist behavior. What I see riders doing here, they would never get away with in Europe - they'd be called out by the other cyclists. So we do need some way to make cyclists act more responsibly. Better enforcement I guess.

Edited June 29, 2012 by Canuckistani

[Guest Peeves]

Yes please.

There obviously are no stats, and anecdotal evidence is bound to engender nay sayers, so suffice it to say, I personally have read where that has happened. Therefore it is hearsay and opinion. On the other hand you asked so nicely I think I should respond in more detail.

Here is a list of tips and laws, of course good bike riders know them and the *&^%$#@!*bad ones never get caught! Of course that's just my opinion.

http://daviswiki.org/Bicycling_Tips

Here please find a few that a few (obviously newbies) seem to have missed.

The speed limit for bikes is 15 mph on central campus and 10 mph in parking lots. Elsewhere, all posted speed limits must be observed. Rumor has it that campus bike cops enforce the speed limit, although enforcement seems to be rare. If you want to be sure of how fast you are going there are a variety of speedometers available from any of the bike shops in town, that are fairly cheap (especially in comparison to a ticket), and are very easy to install.

Don't cruise through stop signs. Bicycle stop sign violations are a common ticket given in Davis, and can make you a victim of a bike trap. Contrary to popular belief, you don't need to put your feet on the ground to be legal. You just need to come to a complete stop. Davis cops have been known to ticket people based on this imaginary standard and the tickets have been thrown out when challenged in court. The confusion arises from a requirement that a rider must be able to stop and put at least one foot on the ground when riding on a highway. The law doesn't say your stops have to actually be like this. If you do treat stop signs as yield signs, at least be smart about it and watch where you're going. Make sure that it is clear and you're not taking anyone's right of way. Contrary to what some would have you believe, it's perfectly safe if you're aware of your surroundings. It has been legal in Idaho for about 30 years with no statistically significant increases in bicycle injuries. Oh, and watch out for cops, assuming you don't like being ticketed, because it isn't legal here.

A legal stop is defined as having the wheels of your vehicle stop moving. This is completely possible on a bike, without having to put one foot on the ground, but only for a few seconds (unless you're pretty skilled at this).

Don't speed through parking lots. Cyclists are small, fast-moving objects that often aren't visible to drivers until attached to a fender or bumper. If you are on your bike you must obey the same laws as a car in parking lots (i.e. flow of traffic, not crossing lines). If you don't want to follow the laws then you can hop off your bike and walk wherever you want. Just please keep your eyes open.

Beware of motor vehicles turning right. It's difficult for a driver who wants to turn right to see cyclists coming up from behind. In one of the few Davis bicycle fatalities, a cyclist was killed by a tractor-trailer turning right.

Use Hand Signals to let cars know what you are going to do. It is also helpful to other bikers, especially at high-traffic areas where one person is turning. You can get ticketed for not using hand signals, just like a car driver can get a ticket for not using their turn signal. Some turns are harder to make one handed, or the rider doesn't have the skill to pull off a one-handed turn, and in those cases signalling before reaching the turn is accepted by authorities.

Many drivers don't use turn signals as they should. Don't count on a car to signal, nor for that matter a bicyclist. Use hand signals yourself if there is any chance of a collision.

Pedestrians have the right-of-way at crosswalks and at corners. They do not have the right of way if they jay-walk, but that does not mean you have the right to run them over either.

Be visible. Your bicycle should have a headlight and a flashing rear light. Reflective clothing, a bright-colored helmet and reflectors on the moving parts (pedals, spokes) also help. If you have an exceptionally low bike (children, adults on low recumbent bikes), a flag is the only way to be visible to even cautious and well intentioned drivers.

Funny stuff huh!

[Canuckistani]

It is only your opinion. Some bad cyclists are caught. We had one who rode down a pedestrian while she was legally crossing a crosswalk and severely injured her. He was caught and in a whole world of grief, as would be any driver, who do this sort of thing much more frequently than cyclists. June is bike month in Vancouver, and the police go on a blitz to ticket cyclists - they over do it. Unfortunately they under do it the rest of the year. And giving a cyclist a ticket because she crossed on a cyclist activated crossing, ie the cross traffic had a red, but didn't first come to a complete stop - that's pretty chickenshit.

If a cyclist severely injures a pedestrian, we read about it, especially if they are not apprehended. We don't read about many incidents like that, vs the number of pedestrians killed or severely injured by motor vehicles.

I once chased down a cop who rode thru a stop sign on his bike. He told me "we wouldn't ticket you for that." Sure, I bet, yet even the cops do it.

I don't philosophically have a problem with licensing bikes, but it does seem a bit impractical.

[socialist]

at least they are not pumping toxic fumes into the atmosphere. we need less vehicles and more bikes on the road.

[GostHacked]

Licenses are to both document and to identify. Tags on a bike might prevent those causing injury from escaping unidentified.

Since they have the same rights on the road, why are they not carrying insurance and having bikes tagged with plates?

Of course it would be near impossible to police, but I in my delusional wish list would like to see some recourse for bringing a two wheel offender to task.

Now, they hit and run in too many cases.

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/01/04/get-cyclists-off-sidewalks-woman-pleads

Bikes are not allowed on sidewalks to begin with from what I understand. And licenses do not prevent stupidity.

[Guest Peeves]

Bikes are not allowed on sidewalks to begin with from what I understand. And licenses do not prevent stupidity.

Bikes aren't allowed to do a lot of things that they do. Then when they do do them, they ride off into the sunset free and clear all too often.

[BubberMiley]

Then when they do do them, they ride off into the sunset free and clear all too often.

Pedestrians get away with stuff "all too often" too. Should we just have our papers hanging from our necks to identify us?

[eyeball]

Don't cruise through stop signs. Bicycle stop sign violations are a common ticket given in Davis, and can make you a victim of a bike trap. Contrary to popular belief, you don't need to put your feet on the ground to be legal. You just need to come to a complete stop.

I've read that some cities expect cyclists to regard stop signs and red lights as a yield sign instead. It's apparently been shown that doing so keeps traffic moving more smoothly and quickly than it would if every cyclist stops. Of course I wouldn't be surprised in the least to find the biggest hurdle to such an implementation in many jurisdictions in North America would be the pure intolerance of motorists in the face of such unmitigated gall.

As for the traffic I sometimes get tangled up in I sometimes wonder where the relationship between speedbumps kayaks and motorboats is going.

[Guest Peeves]

Pedestrians get away with stuff "all too often" too. Should we just have our papers hanging from our necks to identify us?

A pedestrian can readily be caught, there's the rub.

[Black Dog]

Bikes aren't allowed to do a lot of things that they do. Then when they do do them, they ride off into the sunset free and clear all too often.

So do cars. And they're licensed!

[GostHacked]

Bikes aren't allowed to do a lot of things that they do. Then when they do do them, they ride off into the sunset free and clear all too often.

And you think a license would prevent that from happening? Should there be a long bike registry?

[Guest Peeves]

And you think a license would prevent that from happening? Should there be a long bike registry?

Sigh.... I just don't know anymore. Pedaling reason seldom gets one any place I fear. So I now want every bike to have a 8 db warning device like a back up device on construction vehicles. And , riders must have bright clothing, and a night light. Possibly an advance man running ahead with a Town Crier bell and voice.

[The_Squid]

Sigh.... I just don't know anymore. Pedaling reason seldom gets one any place I fear. So I now want every bike to have a 8 db warning device like a back up device on construction vehicles. And , riders must have bright clothing, and a night light. Possibly an advance man running ahead with a Town Crier bell and voice.

Or, our cities/towns could invest in cycling infrastructure.

[Guest Peeves]

Or, our cities/towns could invest in cycling infrastructure.

That would be nice.

Around here I think they call them sidewalks.

[Black Dog]

That would be nice.

Around here I think they call them sidewalks.

I'm not sure where you're from-I'll assume it's Toronto-so if you want to make the streets and sidewalks safer for pedestrians, take it up with the dinosaurs at council who are intent on driving the city back to the 1950s through their obsession with preserving road space for cars alone.

[GostHacked]

Sigh.... I just don't know anymore. Pedaling reason seldom gets one any place I fear.

It's not reasonable, or practical. Even if the biker is licensed, that person can still get away and easily negating your stance on licensing. Unless you want a nice little plate hanging from the back of the bike.

Here in Ottawa we have a huge infrastructure for bikes and it's pretty damn good. I can go from one end of the city to the other just on the bike paths alone. And they are mixed with cyclists, skateboarders, rollerbladers, pedestrians .... and there is little to no problem.

Respect and common sense is what is needed when out on the paths/roads. No amount of licensing can replace that and be just as effective.

If I cyclist wants to jump out in front of me, they sure can. I drive a 14 year old beat up Subaru, a couple more scratches won't hurt.

[Canuckistani]

Here in Ottawa we have a huge infrastructure for bikes and it's pretty damn good. I can go from one end of the city to the other just on the bike paths alone. And they are mixed with cyclists, skateboarders, rollerbladers, pedestrians .... and there is little to no problem.

Sounds terrible. Peds and cyclists don't mix. Especially cyclists who actually want to get from A to B or are athletic. The speed difference is just too great. Cyclists ideally would have their own paths, but from what I see in Vancouver, that is almost never the case, and paths are poorly maintained and not sufficient. Cyclists need to be on the roads so they can go at a decent speed and take the shortest distance to where they are trying to go.

[GostHacked]

Sounds terrible.

It is not terrible at all. Most that are on the paths will give standard warnings to people ahead. It's called sharing the road.

Peds and cyclists don't mix. Especially cyclists who actually want to get from A to B or are athletic. The speed difference is just too great. Cyclists ideally would have their own paths, but from what I see in Vancouver, that is almost never the case, and paths are poorly maintained and not sufficient. Cyclists need to be on the roads so they can go at a decent speed and take the shortest distance to where they are trying to go.

In many cases the shortest distance is through the paths, and not fighting traffic at all. Cycling is not all about speed. Many occasions me and a friend have hit the paths on our bikes just to cruise around and check out the scenery. Biking along the canal is quite beautiful and you gotta stop and sit on the bench and people watch for a bit and take in the scenery. Also the nice ladies wearing bikinis and rollerblading on a hot summer day are a bonus .

And when on these paths here in Ottawa, you have to expect all sorts of traffic. Common courtesy and a little respect for others on the path is really all that is needed.

You can't license common courtesy or respect.

[Canuckistani]

In many cases the shortest distance is through the paths, and not fighting traffic at all. Cycling is not all about speed. Many occasions me and a friend have hit the paths on our bikes just to cruise around and check out the scenery. Biking along the canal is quite beautiful and you gotta stop and sit on the bench and people watch for a bit and take in the scenery. Also the nice ladies wearing bikinis and rollerblading on a hot summer day are a bonus .

Absolutely, that is one type of bike rider. Pedal three strokes and then cruise. Nothing wrong with that. Unfortunately planners often see only those riders, not those who are commuting and want to get from A to B as quickly as possible, or who are riding for exercise and want a good workout. They get neglected, and need consideration too. The problem with bike paths is that then drivers expect riders to be on them, or the govt even legislates that they do so. It just doesn't work. Look at the killing of the triathletes in Quebec recently. Some guy ran into and over what, 5 of them riding on the road, and the comment was that they should have been on the adjacent, dirt, bike path. Come on.

[Guest Peeves]

http://www.safecycling.ca/riding-your-bike/cycling-advice/68-riding-your-bike/283-more-rules-of-the-road-interpreting-the-hta

From Ottawa..

Unfortunately, far too many cyclists in Canada do not operate their bicycles as a vehicle but rather behave as though they have neither rights nor responsibilities on the road. This phenomenon can be traced to both misinterpretation and lack of understanding of the law as it affects cyclists. In this article, I shall discuss some of the common mistakes made by cyclists in relation to Ontario's traffic laws and the risks they create. The first two are improper lane positioning at intersections, and riding in crosswalks from bike paths (strictly speaking these are not bike paths but rather recreation paths for use by different types of users).

You may read further at link. Meanwhile kudos to Ottawa.

[Black Dog]

http://www.safecycling.ca/riding-your-bike/cycling-advice/68-riding-your-bike/283-more-rules-of-the-road-interpreting-the-hta

From Ottawa..

You may read further at link. Meanwhile kudos to Ottawa.

No doubt better education of cyclists is important, but unless you want to address the issue of infrastructure, you're just sidestepping the real issues.

[Canuckistani]

Most important to my mind is educating drivers that cyclists have a right to be on the road, and that they need to be taken into consideration. That means no swinging doors open in the path of a cyclist - that's why we ride a doors width away from parked cars, which gets the drivers foaming because they feel we're not over to the right far enough. It means not passing a cyclist and then immediately pulling a right in front of them. It means passing a cyclist with at least 1m distance between you. (In Australia this is the law and should be here too). It means not parking in bike lanes. It means signalling your turns. It means not pulling out of parking lots or alleys right in front of an approaching cyclist. It means not running stop signs when the cyclist has the right of way. (Yes, drivers run stop signs too) Etc etc.

[Bonam]

As someone who extensively walks, drives, and bikes around the city, I can say the following:

- Following the exact same rules of the road in the exact same ways as a motor vehicle, while on a bike, does not make sense. Treating stop signs as yield signs while on a bike seems perfectly reasonable, for example.

- Biking on a sidewalk is often the only safe way to get to certain areas of the city on a bike. Urban arterial streets with no bike lanes during rush hour are suicidal to try to bike on, and it may be impossible to get somewhere on a bike without using them.

- Bikers are really freaking annoying when you are in a car, and they are also really freaking annoying as a pedestrian if they are biking on the sidewalk.

- Bikers can be hard to see, especially at night, since many bikers don't use any/adequate lights while riding at night.

- Bike lanes that are painted onto roads are often very dangerous, because despite the bike lane, cars often turn right and can cut off cyclists. Also, cars parked in the curb lane immediately to the right of the painted bike lane starting to pull out or open a left door can be hugely dangerous for the cyclist.

I think the only realistic solution is more bike infrastructure. For the same reasons (differences in speed, level of protection, visibility, viewing angles, maneuverability, response time, etc) that we have separated roads and sidewalks rather than expecting cars and pedestrians to coexist on the same surface, bikes need an entirely separate 3rd type of infrastructure. This exists in most cities to some extent, but is usually insufficient.

[guyser]

You come across an an apologist ...until the very end.

- Following the exact same rules of the road in the exact same ways as a motor vehicle, while on a bike, does not make sense. Treating stop signs as yield signs while on a bike seems perfectly reasonable, for example.

It makes sense . Unless you subscribe to the notion that stopping a car is reasonable at certain times of the day and night.

- Biking on a sidewalk is often the only safe way to get to certain areas of the city on a bike. Urban arterial streets with no bike lanes during rush hour are suicidal to try to bike on, and it may be impossible to get somewhere on a bike without using them.

Biking on a sidewalk is illegal. You are sluffing off the danger a bicyclist has to the pedestrian. Is that fair? No it isnt.

If it is impossible to get there, then that is the city planners fault. ITs almost impossible to get anywhere at certain times of th day for car drivers.

- Bikers are really freaking annoying when you are in a car, and they are also really freaking annoying as a pedestrian if they are biking on the sidewalk.

Cars are freaking annoying when you are on a bike.See point above.

- Bikers can be hard to see, especially at night, since many bikers don't use any/adequate lights while riding at night.

While true, a headlamp is required to ride at night. A motorcycle is hard to see at night too.

- Bike lanes that are painted onto roads are often very dangerous, because despite the bike lane, cars often turn right and can cut off cyclists. Also, cars parked in the curb lane immediately to the right of the painted bike lane starting to pull out or open a left door can be hugely dangerous for the cyclist.

So the issue is car drivers in this case? I agree.

I think the only realistic solution is more bike infrastructure.

Nail meet hammer.