MiddleClassCentrist Posted June 8, 2012 Report Posted June 8, 2012 (edited) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/albertas-red-deer-river-hit-by-oil-leak/article4241238/ http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/spill-sends-22000-barrels-of-oil-mix-into-alberta-muskeg/article4219809/ Let's add in the one that happened before last year's election but mysteriously didn't appear in the news until AFTER the election. http://www.davidsuzuki.org/blogs/panther-lounge/2011/05/albertas-biggest-oil-spill-in-30-years-is-a-call-to-action-for-canadians/ Probably some more that were unreported by our benevolent corps. Why are we stripping envronmental legislation? Why are we not punishing these billion dollar corporations making these careless mistakes? In the next century, water will become our most valuable resource as world demand for water increases. Why are we toxifying it with this short sighted conservative economic policy? Edited June 8, 2012 by MiddleClassCentrist Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
mentalfloss Posted June 8, 2012 Report Posted June 8, 2012 Sounds like you're pitting east vs. west with such divisive comments. Quote
MiddleClassCentrist Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Posted June 8, 2012 Sounds like you're pitting east vs. west with such divisive comments. It's pathetic that the MSM has towed that line. Seems like they are in the back pocket of the oil corps too... "Let's develop them sustainably" "Booming dollar hurts manufacturing, which is dutch disease" They have successfully brainwashed their mindless followers that sustainable development is pitting east vs. west and that the well known fact that a high dollar hurts exports no longer applies because we have oil sands. Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
TwoDucks Posted June 8, 2012 Report Posted June 8, 2012 Sounds like you're pitting east vs. west with such divisive comments. Sounds like you're due for a promotion. How does cabinet minister sound? Quote
MiddleClassCentrist Posted June 9, 2012 Author Report Posted June 9, 2012 Sounds like you're due for a promotion. How does cabinet minister sound? Only if he has a fraud conviction. Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
Anti-Am Posted June 10, 2012 Report Posted June 10, 2012 Albertas premiere said the spill was an exception. So much for the premiere caring about Albertans. Quote
Smallc Posted June 10, 2012 Report Posted June 10, 2012 But it is an exception. They don't happen very often, really. Quote
Anti-Am Posted June 10, 2012 Report Posted June 10, 2012 But it is an exception. They don't happen very often, really. That was the 2nd in a month apparently. Quote
Anti-Am Posted June 10, 2012 Report Posted June 10, 2012 How much of this clean up will tax payers pay? And how much will this company not pay? Quote
jacee Posted June 10, 2012 Report Posted June 10, 2012 (edited) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/albertas-red-deer-river-hit-by-oil-leak/article4241238/ http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/spill-sends-22000-barrels-of-oil-mix-into-alberta-muskeg/article4219809/ Let's add in the one that happened before last year's election but mysteriously didn't appear in the news until AFTER the election. http://www.davidsuzuki.org/blogs/panther-lounge/2011/05/albertas-biggest-oil-spill-in-30-years-is-a-call-to-action-for-canadians/ Probably some more that were unreported by our benevolent corps. Why are we stripping envronmental legislation? Why are we not punishing these billion dollar corporations making these careless mistakes? In the next century, water will become our most valuable resource as world demand for water increases. Why are we toxifying it with this short sighted conservative economic policy? And this is what the oil companies want to pipe through BC ... Gord Johnston’s tranquil life along the Red Deer River in central Alberta was shattered Thursday night as the nauseating scent of crude oil hung in the air and a coffee-coloured liquid lapped the banks near his home. He reported the oil leak and, within two hours, a helicopter dispatched by a local oil company landed on his 57-acre property near Sundre, Alta., to fly him over the devastating scene. Mr. Johnston, who works in the oil patch, could see oil“boiling up” in the river at the site of a pipeline crossing. By Friday morning, the situation had worsened. Oil clotted one of the province’s most crucial waterways and soaked nearby wetlands. He found a dead fish coated with oil and brought a tar-covered baby beaver to a wildlife refuge. “My place is destroyed,” Mr. Johnston said, as he prepared to abandon his home and later head for a hospital to be treated for exposure to the fumes. “My whole life’s work is gone. I’ve pretty well lost it all here.” Loretta Leonhardt, who owns property where the latest spill occurred, said she is concerned. “We all love the oil industry in Alberta, but I think they’ve been really lax on what they’ve been doing for the environment,” she said. “And I think it’s time they’re called to task on some of this stuff. http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/my-place-is-destroyed-resident-in-wake-of-albertas-red-deer-river-oil-spill/article4241238/?service=mobile Well call me naive but ... Why did Johnston have to report the leak ... Don't they monitor and KNOW when leaks happen? I guess not. Oil is dangerous and it should be handled much more carefully than appears to be the case ... and it shouldn't be cheap. Edited June 10, 2012 by jacee Quote
MiddleClassCentrist Posted June 11, 2012 Author Report Posted June 11, 2012 Well call me naive but ... Why did Johnston have to report the leak ... Don't they monitor and KNOW when leaks happen? I guess not. Oil is dangerous and it should be handled much more carefully than appears to be the case ... and it shouldn't be cheap. We need fewer regulations. Johnston shouldn't have been able to report the leak without being ostracised for being so divisive. Shunned and cast out of Alberta. Who cares about water? We let's just genetically modify ourselves to drink oil! Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
Fletch 27 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 Ummm, Thomas Mulcair came out today stating that he supports pipe-lines... Well, ones that run from the west to the east (for some odd reason). Talk to your boy Mulcair as to why his recent flip-flop... Clearly not a "conservative" thing.... http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/albertas-red-deer-river-hit-by-oil-leak/article4241238/ http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/spill-sends-22000-barrels-of-oil-mix-into-alberta-muskeg/article4219809/ Let's add in the one that happened before last year's election but mysteriously didn't appear in the news until AFTER the election. http://www.davidsuzuki.org/blogs/panther-lounge/2011/05/albertas-biggest-oil-spill-in-30-years-is-a-call-to-action-for-canadians/ Probably some more that were unreported by our benevolent corps. Why are we stripping envronmental legislation? Why are we not punishing these billion dollar corporations making these careless mistakes? In the next century, water will become our most valuable resource as world demand for water increases. Why are we toxifying it with this short sighted conservative economic policy? Quote
MiddleClassCentrist Posted June 11, 2012 Author Report Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) Ummm, Thomas Mulcair came out today stating that he supports pipe-lines... Well, ones that run from the west to the east (for some odd reason). Talk to your boy Mulcair as to why his recent flip-flop... Clearly not a "conservative" thing.... Anyone can see the difference between supporting pipelines and not supporting the foreign oil and gas industry's ability to operate without any environmental regulation/consequences. Maybe become less of a comedic act and more of a rational poster to be taken seriously. Edited June 11, 2012 by MiddleClassCentrist Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
Fletch 27 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 VEry simple question to you then. Why does Mulcair support a pipe-line that runs to the East and NOT one that runs to the West? Please answer me that. Anyone can see the difference between supporting pipelines and not supporting the foreign oil and gas industry's ability to operate without any environmental regulation/consequences. Maybe become less of a comedic act and more of a rational poster to be taken seriously. Quote
eyeball Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 VEry simple question to you then. Why does Mulcair support a pipe-line that runs to the East and NOT one that runs to the West? Please answer me that. Speaking for myself I support this because it eliminates the threat of plowing it through 600 fish bearing watersheds that I depend on for my livelihood. Better distribution of the wealth generating potential of this oil in Canada is also better for my livelihood. The idea of not fuelling the economic growth of an already powerful totalitarian state halfway around the world sounds like it would also be better for my livelihood and bottom line. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Fletch 27 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 Umm yea, what are those large bodies of water called again? You know, the worlds largest supply of fresh water? Where Salmon, Pickerel, trout and things live? Never mind.. I googled it... They are called the "great lakes".. So, with Muclairs letst comments.. Are you saying that you now support a pipe-line? And also only one that runs from the West to Quebec? I guess thanks are "kinda" in order. Thank you for your support of a pipe-line.. Regardless of the direction it takes and ultimate destination. Speaking for myself I support this because it eliminates the threat of plowing it through 600 fish bearing watersheds that I depend on for my livelihood. Better distribution of the wealth generating potential of this oil in Canada is also better for my livelihood. The idea of not fuelling the economic growth of an already powerful totalitarian state halfway around the world sounds like it would also be better for my livelihood and bottom line. Quote
GostHacked Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 We need fewer regulations. Johnston shouldn't have been able to report the leak without being ostracised for being so divisive. Shunned and cast out of Alberta. Who cares about water? We let's just genetically modify ourselves to drink oil! ' I think it's less about regulations (more may be needed) as there is a culture of keeping quite about things. We already drink and eat oil through various forms of petrochemicals in our food and water. Quote
eyeball Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 (edited) Umm yea, what are those large bodies of water called again? You know, the worlds largest supply of fresh water? Where Salmon, Pickerel, trout and things live? Never mind.. I googled it... They are called the "great lakes".. I never said it wasn't also with out risk going east but the topography of the land that way is far less extreme, more stable, easier to traverse and a lot less expensive and environmentally sensitive to build on. So, with Muclairs letst comments.. Are you saying that you now support a pipe-line? And also only one that runs from the West to Quebec? I've never said I'm against Alberta developing it's oil, but I do have huge issues with the direction and destination it will be sent and above all else the dictatorial, corrupt, secretive, and stupid decision-making process that is determining that. I guess thanks are "kinda" in order. Thank you for your support of a pipe-line.. Regardless of the direction it takes and ultimate destination. I'd like to thank you for recognizing that pipelines are in fact a threat to the health and wealth generating potential of the ecosystems they pass through not to mention the lives of the people that depend on these. Would it be to much to ask for some recognition of just how threatening Harper's undemocratic handling of this issue has been to the good-will in this country? Edited June 11, 2012 by eyeball Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Fletch 27 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 Undemocratic Handling? Dude, we voted for Harper knowing exactly what we would get. Its his mandate. Dont give me this "Un-democratic" BS. We, the Majority support him as its just what we would have done. Im VERY comfortable with his handling of his job and his MANDATE of "economy number one". Democratically of coarse.. An no, I like pip-lines over any other mode of transportation.. Better than Rail or by truck.. I do think Thomas mulcairs idea of strapping little oil-baggies to the backs of little fairies is unique.. I never said it wasn't also with out risk going east but the topography of the land that way is far less extreme, more stable, easier to traverse and a lot less expensive and environmentally sensitive to build on. I've never said I'm against Alberta developing it's oil, but I do have huge issues with the direction and destination it will be sent and above all else the dictatorial, corrupt, secretive, and stupid decision-making process that is determining that. I'd like to thank you for recognizing that pipelines are in fact a threat to the health and wealth generating potential of the ecosystems they pass through not to mention the lives of the people that depend on these. Would it be to much to ask for some recognition of just how threatening Harper's undemocratic handling of this issue has been to the good-will in this country? Quote
eyeball Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 Undemocratic Handling? Dude, we voted for Harper knowing exactly what we would get. Its his mandate. Dont give me this "Un-democratic" BS. We, the Majority support him as its just what we would have done. Im VERY comfortable with his handling of his job and his MANDATE of "economy number one". Democratically of coarse.. No, you voted for transparency and accountability, fluffy blue sweaters, and even fluffier kittens, instead you're getting stealth legislation, hazmat-suits and polluted ecosystems. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Fletch 27 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 And now your telling me what i voted for???? Really? No, from what i recall it was about the Economy. Still is. You can be bitter all you want but again, hes doing what the MAJORITY asked him to do. Again, thats how Democracy works. Whats this "stealth legislation"? "Hazmat Suits"? "Poluted ecosystem"?? Are you sure your not letting your dramatic Lefty side show...? No, you voted for transparency and accountability, fluffy blue sweaters, and even fluffier kittens, instead you're getting stealth legislation, hazmat-suits and polluted ecosystems. Quote
eyeball Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 Whats this "stealth legislation"? "Hazmat Suits"? "Poluted ecosystem"?? Are you sure your not letting your dramatic Lefty side show...? No, the budget that rejigs our environmental and fisheries protection legislation is definitely a stealthy sneaky undemocratic way to make our environment subordinate to our economy, just ask the several right-wing conservatives who are taking issue with what Harper has done and how he's done it. As for the hazmat suits and polluted ecosystems, haven't you been watching the news from Alberta? Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Fletch 27 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 If its "stealthy" we wouldnt know what in it now would we? Reallll stealthy... Its called "efficiency"... Just what we like about Harper.. No waste.. And yes, musta been Stsve Harper that made that mess.. Its got his name all over it huh!? No, the budget that rejigs our environmental and fisheries protection legislation is definitely a stealthy sneaky undemocratic way to make our environment subordinate to our economy, just ask the several right-wing conservatives who are taking issue with what Harper has done and how he's done it. As for the hazmat suits and polluted ecosystems, haven't you been watching the news from Alberta? Quote
MiddleClassCentrist Posted June 11, 2012 Author Report Posted June 11, 2012 If its "stealthy" we wouldnt know what in it now would we? Reallll stealthy... Its called "efficiency"... Just what we like about Harper.. No waste.. And yes, musta been Stsve Harper that made that mess.. Its got his name all over it huh!? "In the interests of democracy, I ask how can members represent their constituents on these various areas when they are forced to vote on a block of such legislation?" Stephen Harper on Liberal Omnibus Bill, 2005 Again, why do you hate your own leader? Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
Fletch 27 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Posted June 11, 2012 Is this gonna turn into an "I know you are but what am I" thing? Really? Did school just let out? Seems that Me and a Majority still love our Harper.. Facts are facts.. Again, why do you hate your own leader? Quote
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