Stephane Dion Takes on the NDP

[UofGPolitico]

Just like the Bloc, the NDP would have Quebec’s Bill 101 apply to federal institutions, with no second thought about the negative impacts such a move would have on official language minorities across the country.

Just like the Bloc, the NDP argues that a majority of 50%-plus-one is the only valid rule in a democracy. Yet even the NDP requires a two-thirds majority to amend its own constitution.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2012/03/12/stephane-dion-ndps-separatist-pandering-threatens-national-unity/

Those are just two of the points Stephane Dion makes in his op-ed piece. He was on Power & Politics tonight being very aggressive with Peter Julian. It was pretty heated. Stephane Dion as we know does get a little dramatic sometimes, but he does have a point. The NDP are a predominantly Quebec-based party now, at least for the time being, and there are people in that party with known ties to the sovereignty movement. Their own interim leader for god sakes used to be a card carrying member of the Bloc! Stephane Dion obviously has his own reasons for attacking them on this, least of which is he was the author of the Clarity Act which challenges many of the views the NDP has expressed at least tacit support for in the past.

Its interesting to finally see the Liberals CHALLENGING the NDP as opposed to standing in agreement with them on almost every issue. It can only help re-define them.

[Evening Star]

Its interesting to finally see the Liberals CHALLENGING the NDP as opposed to standing in agreement with them on almost every issue. It can only help re-define them.

Strongly agree. If the Liberals were to really take a stand on this, it's one of the things that could convince me to vote Liberal.

In general, I do agree that the Liberals need to figure out what they stand for, as they can't really be the NDP.

[j44]

I'm amazed that he is actually learning some leadership skills and communications strategy and getting out in front of this before the NDP have a full time leader.

I caught a minute of the panel on p and p today and heard Rob silver freak out on Ian Capstick's comment that Dion 'offended the separatists' in the past. Good God. Capstick has the be the most smug and obnoxious guy on television.

I'll be interested to see how Mulcair responds.

[madmax]

For the record..

Dion Vs BQ

Dion= 14 seats

BQ= 49

NDP vs BQ

NDP=59 seats

BQ=4

[August1991]

I read his article, and I was even tempted to send an email to his office to say that he is honest, correct and courageous.

If you are a federalist, Dion is clear-minded. He's no Uncle Tom.

---

But like Whitney Houson had a better voice than Dolly Parton, Thomas Mulcair has better comunication talents than Stéphane Dion. Such is politics, and the music business.

Edited March 14, 2012 by August1991

[Evening Star]

Dion is no Dolly Parton!

[August1991]

Dion is no Dolly Parton!

On the contrary, Dion is a Parton to a Houston, or a Streisand. He's even a Dion to a Mulcair.

[Evening Star]

I get the point you're trying to make. I just don't think you're giving Dolly Parton enough credit.

[TheNewTeddy]

There is Federalism, which is pure and white.

There is Separatism, which is dark and black.

And there is Nationalism, which is shades of grey.

Dion thinks this is a black and white issue when it's not. The Liberals are "White" and won 14 seats according to the post above. The Bloc is Black and managed, at it's best, 54.

The NDP is Grey and took 59.

[August1991]

I get the point you're trying to make. I just don't think you're giving Dolly Parton enough credit.

You're right.

Pauline Marois is no Dolly Parton.

[Newfoundlander]

For the record..

Dion Vs BQ

Dion= 14 seats

BQ= 49

NDP vs BQ

NDP=59 seats

BQ=4

At least Dion was opposing the Bloc Quebecois, as opposed to the NDP who were mimicking them.

[punked]

There is Federalism, which is pure and white.

There is Separatism, which is dark and black.

And there is Nationalism, which is shades of grey.

Dion thinks this is a black and white issue when it's not. The Liberals are "White" and won 14 seats according to the post above. The Bloc is Black and managed, at it's best, 54.

The NDP is Grey and took 59.

Best summation of a new dynamic I have seen. Dion just like Liberals before him knows they need Separatism to stay strong as a party so late at night when no one is looking they sit up and pry for the Bloc to rise again. This is Dion stoking those fires saying a party which is so Federalist they actually disbanded their provincial party because they were not strong enough on the issue doesn't agree with him so they must be soft on Separatism.

Separatism wont be killed off with a bang there will be no defining battle to end the movement. You can't just win a referendum and expect all the people who want their country to walk off into the night. It will be killed off over time through compromise which will make us a stronger country. The Liberals had their time in Federalism now we actually need the NDP so we can watch the slow death of Separatism.

[Newfoundlander]

If the NDP believe in asymmetrical federalism, does that mean they are willing to give the provinces more authority? Are we looking at more decentralized provinces under an NDP government?

[punked]

If the NDP believe in asymmetrical federalism, does that mean they are willing to give the provinces more authority? Are we looking at more decentralized provinces under an NDP government?

The NDP believes if we work with the provinces ALL THE provinces, instead of telling them (look at the newest crime bill the provinces had no input in with the Conservatives, look at many many programs under the Liberals) you can have Federalism that works. That is what they ran on talking to not only Quebec but Alberta, NS, and so and agreeing on how things especially those things that effect the provinces can work better from coast to coast. Being good for Quebec and being good for BC are not mutually exclusive things. Lets find common ground and build up from there.

[Smallc]

The Liberals are "White" and won 14 seats according to the post above. The Bloc is Black and managed, at it's best, 54.

That's pretty selective. Under Chretien, the Liberals had almost as many seats and more votes than the Bloc.

[punked]

That's pretty selective. Under Chretien, the Liberals had almost as many seats and more votes than the Bloc.

No one wants Quebec to go back to the Chretien days when Separatism was alive and well except Liberals because their party had purpose.

[PIK]

No one wants Quebec to go back to the Chretien days when Separatism was alive and well except Liberals because their party had purpose.

Latest polls showing the NDP losing ground to the bloc.

[Smallc]

No one wants Quebec to go back to the Chretien days when Separatism was alive and well except Liberals because their party had purpose.

After the referendum, Separatism was at it's lowest level since...ever. That was also under Chretien. The only thing that brought it back up at all was sponsorship.

[mentalfloss]

I was watching the debate between Dion and Julian last night on CBC, and Dion was an absolute fail. He was obfuscating facts, interrupting Julian, and just being a complete shit the whole time. It was a complete farce.

[punked]

After the referendum, Separatism was at it's lowest level since...ever. That was also under Chretien. The only thing that brought it back up at all was sponsorship.

That must be why Bouchard won one more seat in 1998 promising another referendum even before sponsorship broke right? Because Chrietien crushed separatism so much they gave the Separatist a majority government again. Smallc you are way off the mark on this one.

[cybercoma]

If a simple majority is not enough for a referendum on confederation, then Newfoundland's presence is illegitimate. That's all it takes, but there's a hell of a lot more needed for a true secession than voting in a referendum.

Nobody wants Quebec to leave but the separatists and the NDP in Quebec is not a separatist party, regardless what some of you might think. If the CPC would have won 52 seats in Quebec, I highly doubt some of you would be saying they're just a different shade of "blue" or a replacement Bloc. Technically the CPC should stand for more provincial autonomy--even though pushing the tab for their pet projects onto the provinces suggests they don't--and therefore could be seen as even stronger supporters of Quebec's independence. Of all the federalist parties, the CPC is the closest to the separatists. In fact, Harper himself wanted to build a wall around Alberta, while Mulcair was working for the provincial Liberals against the PQ during the referenda in the 90s. So while some of you have this ridiculous idea that NDP is BQ light, perhaps you might want to take a look into your own backyard for which politicians and which party brass actually have the separatist sentiment in their blood.

[punked]

Latest polls showing the NDP losing ground to the bloc.

Wont matter because the Bloc lost more then just public opinion in the last vote, they lost seats which means they lose resources, Harper took all their money away, and the organization is suffer we can see this in the PQ playing out right now. They might not even make it to the next election organization wise. They are the weakest they have ever been right now, and with policies that reflect what the NDP is pushing anyway it will be a much harder fight for them in the future. Let the NDP get a new leader, rally around them and then tell me about the polls seriously.

[Newfoundlander]

The NDP believes if we work with the provinces ALL THE provinces, instead of telling them (look at the newest crime bill the provinces had no input in with the Conservatives, look at many many programs under the Liberals) you can have Federalism that works. That is what they ran on talking to not only Quebec but Alberta, NS, and so and agreeing on how things especially those things that effect the provinces can work better from coast to coast. Being good for Quebec and being good for BC are not mutually exclusive things. Lets find common ground and build up from there.

So if they brought in a national daycare system, or a gun registry they wouldn't impose it on provinces if they didn't want it, as well as allow them to explore alternative forms of health car delivery?

[Newfoundlander]

I was watching the debate between Dion and Julian last night on CBC, and Dion was an absolute fail. He was obfuscating facts, interrupting Julian, and just being a complete shit the whole time. It was a complete farce.

I thought he did well, a bit to aggressive but I can't blame him. Especially seeing Julian wouldn't answer questions.

[madmax]

At least Dion was opposing the Bloc Quebecois, as opposed to the NDP who were mimicking them.

The NDP kicked the BQs butt.. Something no party had been able to do successfully ever since the BQ formed after leaving the Progressive Conservatives of Brian Mulroney.

If I recall correctly The Conservatives share the "Quebec is a Nation" stance..

"Prime Minister Stephen Harper says he will introduce a motion recognizing that Quebecers form a nation..."

and I believe the NDP do as well.

The Liberals do Not.

That said..

I am very very very happy to see the BQ go...

But there are some on this forum that would love to restart the old battle and breath some life back into the smoldering ashes of the BQ.

I would rather see people throwing stones at the NDP..

THen having to deal with another 20 years of the BQ dominating Quebec.