Shady Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 There's a difference between being socialist, a democratic socialist, and a social democrat. Pure semantics. The NDP constitution is pretty scary. In fact, it has little difference from the Soviet constitution of the 1930s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 It's not semantics at all. I'm a social democrat and I'm highly opposed to democratic socialism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 I would bet on mulcair ,then topp. Nash is to far left and dewar would be good at running a homeless shelter or other organizations that helps out people, running canada, no way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 I would bet on mulcair ,then topp. Nash is to far left and dewar would be good at running a homeless shelter or other organizations that helps out people, running canada, no way. Topp definitely won't be second place. As much as I would like to see him lead the party, the membership doesn't like the fact that he doesn't have a seat. Nash isn't too far left at all. She just focuses on social issues moreso than economic ones. That's her liability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 Nash isn't too far left at all. She just focuses on social issues moreso than economic ones. But she was finance critic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 Excellent points being made here! Please keep them coming,and please if not asking too much please provide links! Thnx WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 21, 2012 Report Share Posted January 21, 2012 But she was finance critic! I guess I don't know enough about her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newfoundlander Posted January 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 I think you have made it quite clear you hate the NDP. As you say in the Liberal leadership thread: I get that though because you are a Liberal. I would much rather the Liberals as the alternative so our country don't gt destroyed by the NDP. We don't need to be a social welfare state like those in Europe that completely screwed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 We don't need to be a social welfare state like those in Europe that completely screwed. You don't think the welfare of society is important? The Canadian government does and has. That's why they give tax-breaks to businesses and try to "create" jobs, as well as continue to provide and administer CPP, EI, and healthcare funding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilter Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 Like I've told you before socialist I'm not a Liberal. Can the NDP leader not decide policy, because that's what I've heard? Maybe I'm wrong. Would you like us to answer that question with a yes or a no as in: Can the NDP leader not decide policy,Yes the NDP leader can not decide policy Can the NDP leader not decide policy, NO the NDP leader can not decide policy answers this stupid method of questioning which is unanswerable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) I would much rather the Liberals as the alternative so our country don't gt destroyed by the NDP. We don't need to be a social welfare state like those in Europe that completely screwed. I get it you are a Liberal, who doesn't even know what the NDP stands for that is fine but this game for footsie you play acting as if the NDP would destroy the country ignores how almost every western Democracy except for Canada has a Conservative party, and a Labour party and that the Liberal parties were squeezed out a long time ago for not having ideas of standing for anything. Edited January 22, 2012 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newfoundlander Posted January 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 I get it you are a Liberal, who doesn't even know what the NDP stands for that is fine but this game for footsie you play acting as if the NDP would destroy the country ignores how almost every western Democracy except for Canada has a Conservative party, and a Labour party and that the Liberal parties were squeezed out a long time ago for not having ideas of standing for anything. The NDP would ruin this country by raising all of our taxes and driving business away. Last week we saw Megan Leslie applauding the loss of jobs, and Nathan Cullen agreeing with her. Look how Obama has screwed up the United States and his views aren't half as hardcore as someone like Peggy Nash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 The NDP would ruin this country by raising all of our taxes and driving business away. Last week we saw Megan Leslie applauding the loss of jobs, and Nathan Cullen agreeing with her. Look how Obama has screwed up the United States and his views aren't half as hardcore as someone like Peggy Nash. The Conservatives would ruin thi country by cutting all of our social programs and sparking off violent civil disorder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Let me know when we're done playing the hyperbole game. Seriously though... corporate taxes continue to drop and they're given all sorts of bonuses and other incentives to set up shop here. Guess what. They still leave. So now we have lower taxes which adversely affects the government's ability to mitigate the social and economic destruction left in these business's wake and there's a Conservative government in office that's just going to keep cutting social programs. That's ok though. We can put all the unemployed and people who ask too many questions behind bars. We're building lots of prisons, spending tons on the police, and buying toys for the military. Edited January 25, 2012 by cybercoma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) I'm not a big Obama fan or anything but I don't see at all how he has screwed up the US. Leaving aside that he's limited in what he can do without Congress's support, it seems pretty clear that he's largely been dealing with a mess that was handed to him by the Bush administration. Having said that, if Obama is too far left for you, you should probably avoid the Liberals as well. Edited January 25, 2012 by Evening Star Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newfoundlander Posted January 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 I'm not a big Obama fan or anything but I don't see at all how he has screwed up the US. Leaving aside that he's limited in what he can do without Congress's support, it seems pretty clear that he's largely been dealing with a mess that was handed to him by the Bush administration. Having said that, if Obama is too far left for you, you should probably avoid the Liberals as well. I do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted January 25, 2012 Report Share Posted January 25, 2012 Oh cool, I thought you were a Liberal somehow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle 3 dogs Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) Does anyone care about the NDP leadership? The race will be concluding in two months and I've still seen little on it, nobody seems to talk about the race or care that much about it. Is this because the NDP's newfound apparent relevance was really just Jack Layton being lovable, and whoever replaces him will not be him, so the party's relevance is gone? Edited January 27, 2012 by Uncle 3 dogs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Is this because the NDP's newfound apparent relevance was really just Jack Layton being lovable, and whoever replaces him will not be him, so the party's relevance is gone? If that was the case, why did the NDP's surge only manifest itself 8 years after Layton first became leader? And why has the party maintained second place in opinion polls since his death? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newfoundlander Posted January 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 If that was the case, why did the NDP's surge only manifest itself 8 years after Layton first became leader? And why has the party maintained second place in opinion polls since his death? It took that long for Quebeckers to see his smile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 Is this because the NDP's newfound apparent relevance was really just Jack Layton being lovable, and whoever replaces him will not be him, so the party's relevance is gone? Actually I believe that the conservatives and liberals are the ones that believe this the most.Or imply this is the reason for the NDP's success.So that their success may die with Jack. Wishfull thinking. WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 Actually I believe that the conservatives and liberals are the ones that believe this the most.Or imply this is the reason for the NDP's success.So that their success may die with Jack. Wishfull thinking. WWWTT Actually, I still believe that the NDP has a marvelous opportunity, even without Jack! This is their chance to finally modernize past the 1960's union goon philosophy and become like the Tony Blair Labour Party! Jack appeared to understand this. If the NDP were ever to achieve power they had to move beyond taking their support from unions with declining memberships and whatever fringe groups were not already scooped up by the Greens or the other parties. No, they had to seize the "a bit left of centre" position, formerly occupied by the Liberals. Fluke or not, they have won an excellent power base! They just need to hold on to it! Their choice of new leadership will tell the tale. If they look to the future they will squeeze out the Liberals and be free to rival the Tories. If they go back to the past then they will lose much of what they have won. It is far more likely that Canadians will respond to a modern Labour-style party than they will to one stuck in the 70's. They should recruit from some of their prairie provincial brothers and dump some of the old farts that have hung on in Ottawa all these years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 (edited) Ha, there are many things that could be said about the federal NDP's current caucus but it most certainly does not consist of "old farts"! (The Saskatchewan provincial NDP on the other hand...) Anyway, we agree that they have a strong opportunity and power base to hold onto. Quebec is a potential natural base for a labour/social democratic party, as long as they play their cards right. I don't see the Liberals becoming dominant in Quebec or the prairies any time soon. Actually, I still believe that the NDP has a marvelous opportunity, even without Jack! This is their chance to finally modernize past the 1960's union goon philosophy and become like the Tony Blair Labour Party! Jack appeared to understand this. If the NDP were ever to achieve power they had to move beyond taking their support from unions with declining memberships and whatever fringe groups were not already scooped up by the Greens or the other parties. No, they had to seize the "a bit left of centre" position, formerly occupied by the Liberals. Fluke or not, they have won an excellent power base! They just need to hold on to it! Their choice of new leadership will tell the tale. If they look to the future they will squeeze out the Liberals and be free to rival the Tories. If they go back to the past then they will lose much of what they have won. It is far more likely that Canadians will respond to a modern Labour-style party than they will to one stuck in the 70's. They should recruit from some of their prairie provincial brothers and dump some of the old farts that have hung on in Ottawa all these years. Edited January 28, 2012 by Evening Star Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August1991 Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 (edited) Does anyone care about the NDP leadership? The race will be concluding in two months and I've still seen little on it, nobody seems to talk about the race or care that much about it.I largely don't care about the federal NDP leadership.The federal NDP caucus is largely based in Quebec and its MPs will not win re-election in the next federal election. Remember Vegas? I watched her recently on Radio-Canada. She's a young woman who won a lottery; she will not win re-election. ---- Voters in Quebec are looking for any reasonable alternative to the Chrétien/Trudeau/Lévesque/Parizeau separatist/federalist debate. If you were a kid in a family of divorcing parents, what would you do? Take sides? Most Quebec voters are so fed up (tanné), they`ll vote for anyone who doesn't take sides. They are tired of the arguments. In 2011, they voted for Layton and the NDP. In 2012 or 2013, they may vote for Harper, or Sarkozy or even Obama. Edited January 28, 2012 by August1991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 If that was the case, why did the NDP's surge only manifest itself 8 years after Layton first became leader? And why has the party maintained second place in opinion polls since his death? Not to mention the latest Angus poll has the NDP leading in BC, Quebec, and the Atlantic provinces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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