Thomas Mulcair is a French Citizen

cybercoma · January 20, 2012

Why is there a distinction? Citizenship means something either way, right? Or is it less of a solemn bond of allegiance when someone is a citizen by birth? Are they not still expected to be loyal to their country of citizenship? Why would you not then ask someone born in the UK to choose Canada first and give up his British citizenship when he becomes PM?

....or a Conservative cabinet minister.

Evening Star · January 20, 2012

....or a Conservative cabinet minister.

Yeah, I'm kind of bowled over by the lines that it's fine and dandy for laypeople, even MPs, to have dual citizenship but not OK for a potential PM. If you think dual citizenship is a sign of questionable loyalty, it should not be acceptable in anyone, certainly not for MPs.

cybercoma · January 20, 2012

It's pretty insulting that people would treat those with dual-citizenship as less loyal in the first place or less Canadian in the first place, particularly Mulcair. It's especially rich coming from the guy who wanted to wall Alberta off from the rest of the country, while Mulcair was fighting against sovereigntists in Quebec.

mentalfloss · January 20, 2012

People are still arguing about this?

It's such a non-issue.

scribblet · January 20, 2012

You know Scrib, I pointed out quite clearly in one post that the nitpicking details of MulCair's dual citizenship were irrelevant, that what matters is how many Canadian voters will have their choice affected by it.

So far, all I've seen from Mulcair's champions is more nitpicking details! NONE of them have made a comment on the public perception of it as an electoral factor.

Either they are obsessed with nitpicking, which I've also pointed out to be a common trait with many socialists, or they simply don't want to go there!

Either way, it's pretty boring when no one will talk about what actually matters! Punked can beat up somebody like me all he wants with his eloquence and force me to agree with him but who cares? I'm only one vote! It's obvious that the issue will affect a great many Canadian voters, perhaps enough for the NDP to lose their Opposition status.

Right, it could make a difference in an election, especially if it's out there at election time as being contrary to Layton's ideals.

I have to admit I haven't read a lot about what these wannabe leaders would do or promise on the campaign trail. It would be interesting to see a point by point list of what each proposes. I know that at least one of them has the urge to merge with the Libs. Also admit to not being in Canada right now so am unable to watch Canadian news and debates.

Evening Star · January 20, 2012

I know that at least one of them has the urge to merge with the Libs.

Which one? I haven't heard this about any of them.

scribblet · January 20, 2012

Nathan Cullen wants it, not sure if he still does, Pat Martin supports it too.

Evening Star · January 20, 2012

Martin's not a leadership candidate. You may be right about Cullen.

PIK · January 20, 2012

It's pretty insulting that people would treat those with dual-citizenship as less loyal in the first place or less Canadian in the first place, particularly Mulcair. It's especially rich coming from the guy who wanted to wall Alberta off from the rest of the country, while Mulcair was fighting against sovereigntists in Quebec.

You are either canadian or not, you can't have it both ways, that is what is really insulting.

g_bambino · January 20, 2012

You are either canadian or not...

True. And Mulcair is Canadian.

mentalfloss · January 20, 2012

True. And Mulcair is Canadian.

No, he's an evil hybrid that will sell our sovereignty to the highest Sartrean bidder!

cybercoma · January 20, 2012

You are either canadian or not, you can't have it both ways, that is what is really insulting.

You're right. Mulcair is Canadian.

cybercoma · January 20, 2012

True. And Mulcair is Canadian.

You!

WWWTT · January 20, 2012

No, he's an evil hybrid that will sell our sovereignty to the highest Sartrean bidder!

Yes your right because Canadas sovereignty is liscensed.

Harper and the conservatives can sue for patent/copyright infingement!

WWWTT

guyser · January 20, 2012

You are either canadian or not, you can't have it both ways, that is what is really insulting.

:rolleyes:

Silly is what that is.

"Dual citizens no less loyal: Study

Slamming Canada's "phoney" debate over dual citizenship...."

http://www.canada.com/windsorstar/news/story.html?id=b9aa7ac4-d1c2-4e1f-b2ed-a68fcdb0c1ba&k=65504

Exactly...phoney.

The_Squid · January 20, 2012

This is certainly a phoney issue being brought up by partisan hacks.

If you hate the NDP, then Mulcair is a traitor and needs to be jailed.... if you are an average Canadian, you think "meh.... whatever"...

cybercoma · January 20, 2012

Silly is what that is.

"Dual citizens no less loyal: Study

Slamming Canada's "phoney" debate over dual citizenship...."

http://www.canada.com/windsorstar/news/story.html?id=b9aa7ac4-d1c2-4e1f-b2ed-a68fcdb0c1ba&k=65504

Exactly...phoney.

This is funny...

Francophone respondents with dual citizenship were, in fact, more likely -- 68 per cent compared with 57 per cent for single-citizens -- to describe their sense of belonging to Canada as strong or very strong.

PIK · January 20, 2012

If it is no big deal, then why does he not get rid of it. If he became PM he would not have time to go vacationing in france. But then he never will ,so he might as well keep it.

cybercoma · January 20, 2012

why does he not get rid of it

This question has already been answered. Maybe having someone else read the thread to you would help. Get them to help you out with the parts you don't seem to understand.

guyser · January 20, 2012

If it is no big deal, then why does he not get rid of it.

:rolleyes:

He does not get rid of it because its not a big deal.

Wild Bill · January 21, 2012

He does not get rid of it because its not a big deal.

And that's a perfectly valid opinion, Guyser! The best thing to do is test the premise! Let's hope Mulcair wins and then we'll see if anyone cares!

Again, I'm not talking about folks like us, chewing and nitpicking the details and legalities. I'm talking about voters!. Guyser and others have said that it won't make a difference. Others disagree.

It is impossible to solve opinions. As I said, the premise would need to be tested in the real world.

August1991 · January 21, 2012

Quick read through this thread. Maybe I missed a post.

According to the link in my post above, in the 2006 census, 863,000 "ordinary Canadians" reported dual citizenship.

So with some 30 million Canadians, about 3% are dual citizens.

IOW, the vast majority of "ordinary" Canadians are not dual citizens. Given the immigrants to Canada, I will go further: people who choose Canada are the most Canadian of all. They could have done otherwise but they know very clearly that "you are here, or you are not."

This is certainly a phoney issue being brought up by partisan hacks.

Uh, no.

This is a very serious issue that concerns many ordinary Canadians.

Yeah, Mulcair's handling of this is a pretty good sign of why he'd be the strongest match for Harper.

I disagree.

Mulcair, like Conrad Black, has handled this question in the way of the typical elite of Quebec/Canada: "I can be a citizen of the world, or whatever I want." Mulcair shares with Black a tin ear.

----

With this dual citizenship fact, I think Mulcair has lost the NDP leadership. If I am wrong and he manages to become NDP leader, he will more certainly never be a federal PM of Canada.

In English Canada, Trudeau was often accused of being not truly a Canadian. Born in Quebec, Trudeau married a woman from BC and retired to Montreal. He lived and died in Canada. While Trudeau claimed that he was a citizen of the world, in fact he had only one passport, and one nationality.

Pierre Trudeau was, like Stephen Harper, Canadian.

IOW, this matters.

Edited January 21, 2012 by August1991

cybercoma · January 21, 2012

Mulcair is also Canadian. According to this article in 2007 there were 41 MPs born outside of Canada. Thanks for representing thousands of Canadian in your constituency, but you're not a real Canadian. You don't have the same loyalties as the man who wanted to wall off Alberta.

And again, it's funny how no one seems to have a problem with a cabinet minister, as part of Harper's inner-circle, is a dual-citizen.

The mere suggestion that having dual-citizenship makes you less Canadian is absurd. If you were born somewhere else, then got Canadian citizenship, would you tell those people they'll never really be Canadian? I imagine after doing the citizenship test they know way more about being Canadian than the vast majorities of native-born Canadians. Likewise, are you going to tell someone that was born in this country and fought for it to stay together through 2 Quebec referenda that he's less of a Canadian because he wants to have the same paperwork as his wife and kids when they travel?

Edited January 21, 2012 by cybercoma

g_bambino · January 21, 2012

The mere suggestion that having dual-citizenship makes you less Canadian is absurd.

I don't think "Canadian" is defined so narrowly as merely holding Canadian citizenship; while it's important and valuable, citizenship is still over-inflated, in my opinion; it's really just a legal classification, but people have bound it inextricably with nationality and identity. I don't see why a person who's lived here for years as a permanent resident can't also call him or herself Canadian. Hell, I was born in Canada and would absolutely call myself Canadian, but my parents are immigrants and I still sometimes refer to myself as someone from the "homeland". After the time I spent in Australia, and how immersed I became with the locals, I even feel a little bit Aussie.

Anyway, I return to my point: the issue here isn't citizenship, it's loyalty and focus; what country does a dual citizen Prime Minister of Canada put first? Well, as I said, if it isn't Canada, then he won't be prime minister for long.

[ed.: +]

Edited January 21, 2012 by g_bambino