Mackay busted in a lie about the helicopter of doom

cybercoma · December 9, 2011

more like versus the conjecture conjured up by the leaked emails that suggest otherwise.

December 9, 2011

more like versus the conjecture conjured up by the leaked emails that suggest otherwise.

How do said emails, suggest otherwise, in your opinion? Are you suggesting the flight crew is lying?

WWWTT · December 9, 2011

How deep are the NDP’s pockets?

Finaly!

Of everything you have written I have found one sentence that actually makes sence ringing truth.

The NDP does not have inexhaustable tax payer revenue at their disposal-like the conservatives do!

And thats what this all boils down too isn't it!

The conservatives wouldn't lose one minutes sleep wasting tax payers dollars till the ends of time!

This isn't over.

If the NDP can wrap up this case airtight it will only be a matter of timing.

Do you really believe the NDP would give the most precious political comodity away for free?-Time

Who do you think the NDP are?The liberals!

But hey if not then no problem,the conservatives(as predicted) will provide ample opportunity

WWWTT

WWWTT · December 9, 2011

As for “luck”…..don’t need it…….I’ve been one of the few posters here defending MacKay’s (And the CDS) reputation since the story first broke a few months ago…….I’m quite prepared to continue to do so ad nauseam.

Oh yes sorry your right you don't need luck.

You need a prayer!

WWWTT

December 9, 2011

Finaly!

Of everything you have written I have found one sentence that actually makes sence ringing truth.

The NDP does not have inexhaustable tax payer revenue at their disposal-like the conservatives do!

And thats what this all boils down too isn't it!

The conservatives wouldn't lose one minutes sleep wasting tax payers dollars till the ends of time!

This isn't over.

If the NDP can wrap up this case airtight it will only be a matter of timing.

Do you really believe the NDP would give the most precious political comodity away for free?-Time

Who do you think the NDP are?The liberals!

But hey if not then no problem,the conservatives(as predicted) will provide ample opportunity

WWWTT

Are you suggesting, a half hour flight, that has been sponsored/endorsed by the involved flight crew and military, and the NDP has no contrary evidence proving the MND and/or flight crew lied etc, and could very well find themselves being sued, is going to become an election issue in four years?

I’ll ask again, are you, or anyone else, suggesting the entire flight crew are lying?

You’re right, the NDP certainly aren’t the Liberals…..The NDP is clearly bush league and clearly lacking in political savvy and experience…….

mentalfloss · December 15, 2011

Peter MacKay and staff spent over $5,500 on European hotels during 2010 trip Edited December 15, 2011 by mentalfloss

Cameron · December 15, 2011

Peter MacKay and staff spent over $5,500 on European hotels during 2010 trip

That's not a scandal, that's government business. 5K total for six nights isn't that bad. Pretty good for Munich from what I remember.

waldo · December 15, 2011

That's not a scandal, that's government business. 5K total for six nights isn't that bad. Pretty good for Munich from what I remember.

nope; his staffers stayed in the same hotels at nightly rates of $239/$276... keeping with his ministerial prowess, McKay stayed in rooms with nightly rates of $1452/$770... membership has its privileges, don't ya know... just like commandeering helicopters for personal use.

Cameron · December 16, 2011

In tomorrows news, Tony Clement spends $1.50 on a pack of gum from a vending machine when he could have gotten three for two dollars on the Hasty.

The Toronto Star will round this to $6,000. Then the Globe and Mail will misprint it as Euros. Then by the time Peter Mansbridge puts on his suit pants tonight it will be $12,000, and Bob Rae will be screaming at the Queen to overthrow the government. :lol:

Edited December 16, 2011 by Cameron

YEGmann · December 16, 2011

I’ll ask again, are you, or anyone else, suggesting the entire flight crew are lying?

Nobody's lying in this story. There is no contradiction in any statement. Just media trying to create a scandal where the events are routine.

YEGmann · December 16, 2011

nope; his staffers stayed in the same hotels at nightly rates of $239/$276... keeping with his ministerial prowess, McKay stayed in rooms with nightly rates of $1452/$770... membership has its privileges, don't ya know... just like commandeering helicopters for personal use.

My modest company sent my collegue and me to the Hague for some negotiation. We stayed in a very modest hotel just across the Canadian Embassy. They were two rooms $475 each per night. When I booked my vacation in Europe last summer, expedia.ca suggested many hotels with over $1000 rate per night.

I see nothing extraordinary for our Minister of Defense staying in a $1450 room.

Wilber · December 16, 2011

It would be interesting to know where the ministers from other countries stayed. Seems like an obvious question to me, why aren't these crack journalists asking it?

msj · December 16, 2011

It would be interesting to know where the ministers from other countries stayed. Seems like an obvious question to me, why aren't these crack journalists asking it?

Is this some kind of cultural relativism?

It's okay for Mackay because others rip off their countries taxpayers too?

Cameron · December 16, 2011

We are so cheap in Canada

Wilber · December 16, 2011

Is this some kind of cultural relativism?

It's okay for Mackay because others rip off their countries taxpayers too?

No, but it makes sense to stay in the same place as those you are meeting, particularly if there are one on one side meetings taking place between ministers. On the other hand, if the other ministers were scattered around in different hotels, there was no pressing reason for him to stay there.

Such questions can be inconvenient to the partisanship of some because they can introduce a gray area into something they would prefer to be black and white.

Vendetta · December 16, 2011

How do said emails, suggest otherwise, in your opinion? Are you suggesting the flight crew is lying?

What do the words "under the guise" mean to you? He is obviously lying as is anyone that he has convinced to back up his lame story after the fact. They warned him it would look bad, and then emailed him back and told him they would pick him up "under the guise" of a search and rescue. I really don't care if he uses a helicopter, but why does every member of the "harper government" seem to be a pathological liar?

cybercoma · December 16, 2011

What do the words "under the guise" mean to you? He is obviously lying as is anyone that he has convinced to back up his lame story after the fact. They warned him it would look bad, and then emailed him back and told him they would pick him up "under the guise" of a search and rescue. I really don't care if he uses a helicopter, but why does every member of the "harper government" seem to be a pathological liar?

"Under the guise" to partisan ideologues means "pre-planned".

msj · December 16, 2011

No, but it makes sense to stay in the same place as those you are meeting, particularly if there are one on one side meetings taking place between ministers. On the other hand, if the other ministers were scattered around in different hotels, there was no pressing reason for him to stay there.

When I attend conferences I am always presented with a choice even if I am staying at the same hotel that the conference is being held at.

Often the choices vary between $200 to $3,000 per night depending on what I need.

Since I'm a business man who only gets tax savings of 13.5% on my expenditures it makes sense for me to book the $200 room.

If I wasn't paying for it like Mackay then I suppose I would go for a more expensive room since so few Canadians seem to mind.

Such choices are easier to make when one is paying it out of his own pocket rather than sucking at the taxpayer teat.

Such questions can be inconvenient to the partisanship of some because they can introduce a gray area into something they would prefer to be black and white.

Yes, indeed. :rolleyes:

Edited December 16, 2011 by msj

jbg · December 19, 2011

"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."-Sir John Dalberg-Acton

Was this rule suspended during the Chretien thug regime?

Bryan · December 19, 2011

When I attend conferences I am always presented with a choice even if I am staying at the same hotel that the conference is being held at.

Are you a minister of a federal government attending an international conference?

msj · December 19, 2011

Are you a minister of a federal government attending an international conference?

Clearly not. Perhaps check your reading comprehension since I have already clearly stated this.

Why a minister of a federal government deserves a $1,400 per night room for simply being a minister is the question that I ask.

And the answer is (obviously): because no one cares about our government officials wasting our tax dollars.

Shakeyhands · February 24, 2012

Oh this is just precious....

What is wrong with this Gov't?

The morning of Sept. 22, Royal Canadian Air Force staff — including an officer posted in MacKay’s office — were digging through flight logs to find instances where opposition party MPs took rides aboard military aircraft, according to emails obtained by the Toronto Star.

DEFLECT!!! DEFLECT!!!! ADSCAM!!!!! is the usual refrain, but this takes the cake.

My favourite part though is this... The lie, and the deflection....

The search fixated on Liberal MP Scott Simms (Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor), whose riding includes the 9 Wing Gander air force base and who was critical of MacKay in the initial CTV report.
By noon that day, the air force officials had found what appeared to be information that might take the edge of Simms’ criticisms.

“Found it. Jan. 17, 2011, he (Simms) flew with the Standby crew for almost the whole day,” wrote Maj. Byron Johnson in an email to Royal Canadian Air Force headquarters in Ottawa. “Fax is on the way.”

Only to be followed by this gem... Beautiful really.

It turned out that MacKay’s office had directed the search-and-rescue crews to take on Simms as their guest in response to concerns he had raised about response times to distress calls

These guys are turning into the Gang that can't shoot straight!

Bunch of liars. And in response to Derek L, yes... I'd say the Flight crew lied and was part of the cover up as well. This bears it out.

mentalfloss · February 24, 2012

Like I said in another thread - just watch question period. Everytime there is a perfectly rational criticism of policy, instead of owning up to it, the conservatives deflect to the failings of previous governments.

This is a common argumentative tactic, but there needs to be a widespread revelation by the media to condemn these kinds of logical fallacies. They're unproductive, deceptive and harmful for all of us.

g_bambino · February 24, 2012

Bunch of liars.

They're politicians and acting no differently to most politicians. That's not an excuse for any lying, but it does make one suspect how genuine is the outrage coming from the opposition (within parliament and without). Then again, that's all just part of the game, too.

Shakeyhands · February 24, 2012

They're politicians and acting no differently to most politicians. That's not an excuse for any lying, but it does make one suspect how genuine is the outrage coming from the opposition (within parliament and without). Then again, that's all just part of the game, too.

Yes, it's the genuineness of the Opposition that should be questioned here, that's exactly what I thought after reading the latest article...