Europe is an economic basket case

[Smallc]

The Euro and the Euro Economic Zone is essentially a national fiscal policy on steroids.

Monetary, not fiscal. In Canada, there is a central federal government to verse some things, and the provinces take care of other things. It is somewhat similar here though, because a province could spend too much money....although I'm sure there would be a mechanism to fix it.

[blueblood]

Nope, see Portugal, Greece, and Italy's debt are held largely by foreign banks mostly German, Ireland when it started its default the government took on all those foreign loans and made them the governments problem. Which means if they default Europe will hurt but their country get hit harder much much harder. In those other countries it is the other way around making it a much different situation.

Which shows that Ireland was much better off than those other countries. GDP according to the article was estimated at .5-1% so that part is on track.

The Irish gov't cut to the bone and has positive GDP growth over 2 quarters. That's far more sustainable growth than gov't spending.

This is going to be an interesting experiment because we are going to see a private sector recovery vs. Govt. Spending recovery. The Irish gov't is not spending a dime and we have recovery. Hmm.

[Smallc]

how many canadians live in america? i know from the irs articles that theres 1 million americans living in canada who have dual citizenship

id love to see your numbers though

He is right, but the numbers have been starting to reverse over the last decade. More Canadian still move to the US, but it isn't as if we have a population growth problem.

[olp1fan]

He is right, but the numbers have been starting to reverse over the last decade. More Canadian still move to the US, but it isn't as if we have a population growth problem.

I'd like to see the numbers. That is the only way to prove any of your assertions

[wyly]

This is going to be an interesting experiment because we are going to see a private sector recovery vs. Govt. Spending recovery. The Irish gov't is not spending a dime and we have recovery. Hmm.

when they've already hit bottom there isn't anywhere else to go but up...

[bush_cheney2004]

how many canadians live in america? i know from the irs articles that theres 1 million americans living in canada who have dual citizenship

id love to see your numbers though

We've already been over this...bottom line is that more Canadians emigrate to the US than Americans emigrate to Canada. And the US has 10 times the population. Think about that.

They do it for the same reasons as other nationals....opportunity....jobs...family...education...etc.

[Smallc]

I'd like to see the numbers. That is the only way to prove any of your assertions

http://www.migrationinformation.org/usfocus/display.cfm?ID=244

http://www.shelteroffshore.com/index.php/living/more/americans_living_abroad

These numbers are several years apart though, and are actually closer than I expected.

[punked]

Which shows that Ireland was much better off than those other countries. GDP according to the article was estimated at .5-1% so that part is on track.

The Irish gov't cut to the bone and has positive GDP growth over 2 quarters. That's far more sustainable growth than gov't spending.

This is going to be an interesting experiment because we are going to see a private sector recovery vs. Govt. Spending recovery. The Irish gov't is not spending a dime and we have recovery. Hmm.

Nope the Irish had a growth forecast of 1% at the start of the year they had to estimate it downward October BEFORE the Italy thing hit to .5% now who knows where it will be. That is not mentioning the government is missing all their targets for revenue which somewhere between 2-3% off from estimates and big cuts will have to come or another bail out with those numbers.

There is no recovery you are fooling yourself using those numbers. Guess who else grew over the same Quarters? Italy in fact they grew the pat three quarters. Now you going to tell me all about their recovery to?

Wait till the end of the year you are going to see no growth out of Ireland no matter how much you cross your fingers and hope beyond hope.

[wyly]

Nope the Irish had a growth forecast of 1% at the start of the year they had to estimate it downward October BEFORE the Italy thing hit to .5% now who knows where it will be. That is not mentioning the government is missing all their targets for revenue which somewhere between 2-3% off from estimates and big cuts will have to come or another bail out with those numbers.

There is no recovery you are fooling yourself using those numbers. Guess who else grew over the same Quarters? Italy in fact they grew the pat three quarters. Now you going to tell me all about their recovery to?

Wait till the end of the year you are going to see no growth out of Ireland no matter how much you cross your fingers and hope beyond hope.

and unemployment has risen to 14.4

[punked]

and unemployment has risen to 14.4

Don't worry though BlueBlood has gone out to guy their bonds. No wait he doesn't believe what he is saying.

[blueblood]

Nope the Irish had a growth forecast of 1% at the start of the year they had to estimate it downward October BEFORE the Italy thing hit to .5% now who knows where it will be. That is not mentioning the government is missing all their targets for revenue which somewhere between 2-3% off from estimates and big cuts will have to come or another bail out with those numbers.

There is no recovery you are fooling yourself using those numbers. Guess who else grew over the same Quarters? Italy in fact they grew the pat three quarters. Now you going to tell me all about their recovery to?

Wait till the end of the year you are going to see no growth out of Ireland no matter how much you cross your fingers and hope beyond hope.

That's what they said last year about Ireland being in the tank, yet they manage to slog it thru. There's a reason you don't hear about Ireland being associated with Greece, Portugal and Italy these days.

My link

My link

[punked]

That's what they said last year about Ireland being in the tank, yet they manage to slog it thru. There's a reason you don't hear about Ireland being associated with Greece, Portugal and Italy these days.

My link

My link

You hear about Ireland being associated with all those countries all the time. I have no clue what you are talking about. Posting articles which cite facts which have since been retracted you know because their GDP number have been re adjusted and their revenues have fallen doesn't help. I am sorry fact is their GDP is not what they thought it was going to be and the government just announced a plan to cut 4 Billion MORE before the end of the year to reach targets.

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Financial-Times-hails-impressive-Irish-economic-recovery-129181678.html

That cut alone should drag that .5% growth for the year down below growth. Their GDP is only 200 billion a year to take 4 billion out is a tough pill to swallow. You are living in a Pre-Italy crisis world and I am not. A lot has happened in the last 5 weeks.

[blueblood]

You hear about Ireland being associated with all those countries all the time. I have no clue what you are talking about. Posting articles which cite facts which have since been retracted you know because their GDP number have been re adjusted and their revenues have fallen doesn't help. I am sorry fact is their GDP is not what they thought it was going to be and the government just announced a plan to cut 4 Billion MORE before the end of the year to reach targets.

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Financial-Times-hails-impressive-Irish-economic-recovery-129181678.html

That cut alone should drag that .5% growth for the year down below growth. Their GDP is only 200 billion a year to take 4 billion out is a tough pill to swallow. You are living in a Pre-Italy crisis world and I am not. A lot has happened in the last 5 weeks.

The fact is that Ireland cut it's spending to the bone in 2010 and yet managed to have growth in 2011. Unfortunately the situation in Italy will slow that down. Unfortunately you are living in a tax and spend is the way out of recession works and I'm not. Ireland's recovery is proof of that.

It's been months since I heard Ireland being mentioned with Italy Greece and portugal when talking about the eurozone crisis. Why, Ireland drank their buckleys. Greece did not.

Edited November 10, 2011 by blueblood

[wyly]

You hear about Ireland being associated with all those countries all the time. I have no clue what you are talking about.

greece, portugal, ireland are the countries continually associated with the issue, then italy and spain...

a joke from germany...

a portugese, an irishman and a greek go into a pub and order beers, who pays the tab?.................the german

[Smallc]

,

Edited November 10, 2011 by Smallc

[punked]

The fact is that Ireland cut it's spending to the bone in 2010 and yet managed to have growth in 2011. Unfortunately the situation in Italy will slow that down. Unfortunately you are living in a tax and spend is the way out of recession works and I'm not. Ireland's recovery is proof of that.

You don't know that. 2011 isn't out and I would not bet on Ireland's debt and GDP numbers just yet. Irish bonds have risen 100 biases points in the last month alone meaning their budget numbers are going to be way off. The market right now is betting against them, in fact I think you are the only in the last month who doesn't know what is going on with Ireland. Seriously I point out Italy has grown in the same months as Ireland has yet you don't point them out as a success story. You can't cherry pick data like that.

[blueblood]

You don't know that. 2011 isn't out and I would not bet on Ireland's debt and GDP numbers just yet. Irish bonds have risen 100 biases points in the last month alone meaning their budget numbers are going to be way off. The market right now is betting against them, in fact I think you are the only in the last month who doesn't know what is going on with Ireland. Seriously I point out Italy has grown in the same months as Ireland has yet you don't point them out as a success story. You can't cherry pick data like that.

Italy's growth is from their govt spending helping out. Ireland's isn't.

Irish bonds fell from 14 to 9 percent. The patient is on the road to recovery and Italy's about to go through the emergency room.

My link

My link

Doesn't seem like investors are betting against it to me...

[punked]

Italy's growth is from their govt spending helping out. Ireland's isn't.

Irish bonds fell from 14 to 9 percent. The patient is on the road to recovery and Italy's about to go through the emergency room.

My link

My link

Doesn't seem like investors are betting against it to me...

Ireland's Bonds have risen the last month from 7%-9%. I want to point out when Greece and Italy got to 6% they were in big trouble Ireland is no different. Fact is they have a larger hole to climb out of in investor minds then both Italy and Greece right now. Those are the numbers and markets talking not the pundits. Stop listening to the pundits and start looking at the numbers.

You are not going to see GDP growth this year in Ireland you can keep pretending but it just aint happening.

Edited November 10, 2011 by punked

[blueblood]

Ireland's Bonds have risen the last month from 7%-9%. I want to point out when Greece and Italy got to 6% they were in big trouble Ireland is no different. Fact is they have a larger hole to climb out of in investor minds then both Italy and Greece right now. Those are the numbers and markets talking not the pundits. Stop listening to the pundits and start looking at the numbers.

You are not going to see GDP growth this year in Ireland you can keep pretending but it just aint happening.

Greeces bonds are at 19%, they have the biggest hole to get out of. THe trend is your friend, Ireland's have trended downwards. that's a good thing.

The pundits said that there was no chance for growth in 2011, the numbers said otherwise.

And you have no way of knowing that there will be no GDP growth as well, we'll just have to wait until Q4 is published.

[punked]

Greeces bonds are at 19%, they have the biggest hole to get out of. THe trend is your friend, Ireland's have trended downwards. that's a good thing.

The pundits said that there was no chance for growth in 2011, the numbers said otherwise.

And you have no way of knowing that there will be no GDP growth as well, we'll just have to wait until Q4 is published.

Greece's 10 year benchmark is at 28% right now, however their problems started when they hit 6% just like Italy fact is Irelands bonds are on a upward trend right now so the markets must know something you don't and they are betting against.

It a raise of 100-200 biases points in a month are a downward trend then you could say Greece is on a downward trend to.

[bush_cheney2004]

...It a raise of 100-200 biases points in a month are a downward trend then you could say Greece is on a downward trend to.

It called "basis" points...not "biases" points...just sayin'.

[Shady]

Punked, you really need to stay out of the conomic prediction game. I still remember when you told me that Gold had peaked, about a year and a half ago, several hundred dollars per once ago!

How'd the peak end up going?

[olp1fan]

http://www.migrationinformation.org/usfocus/display.cfm?ID=244

http://www.shelteroffshore.com/index.php/living/more/americans_living_abroad

These numbers are several years apart though, and are actually closer than I expected.

There are over 820,000 foreign born from Canada in the United States.

so 800,000 canadians in america and 1 million U.S born in Canada

that doesn't prove you or bush cheneys point

it proves more americans move to canada than canadians moving to america

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20110917/canada-us-tax-dispute-110917/

While Williams is paying up for fear of arrest if he goes to the U.S., many of the estimated 1 million dual citizens who pay taxes in Canada had no idea they also had to file in the U.S.

Edited November 10, 2011 by olp1fan

[wyly]

There are over 820,000 foreign born from Canada in the United States.

so 800,000 canadians in america and 1 million U.S born in Canada

that doesn't prove you or bush cheneys point

it proves more americans move to canada than canadians moving to america

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20110917/canada-us-tax-dispute-110917/

While Williams is paying up for fear of arrest if he goes to the U.S., many of the estimated 1 million dual citizens who pay taxes in Canada had no idea they also had to file in the U.S.

relative to population size more canadians move to the US than the reverse...not that it matters...

[olp1fan]

relative to population size more canadians move to the US than the reverse...not that it matters...

oh now we're changing the rules to go by per capita?

Thats what losers do

Edited November 10, 2011 by olp1fan