Rank the Republican contenders by order of craziness.

[Michael Hardner]

That is what I wonder - and why wouldn't I?

You can actually witness this happening on this forum.

There's kind of a double-twist at play: religious conservatives have to find a reason to differentiate their fundamental views from those of Muslims, and liberals have to find a reason to welcome those who hold conservative religious views.

You can call this dance the Canadian twist...

[Guest American Woman]

You can actually witness this happening on this forum.

There's kind of a double-twist at play: religious conservatives have to find a reason to differentiate their fundamental views from those of Muslims, and liberals have to find a reason to welcome those who hold conservative religious views.

You can call this dance the Canadian twist...

The Canadian Twist. I like it. A dance requiring fancy footwork ......

[BubberMiley]

The Canadians who are oh-so-proud of Canada's lack of interest in religion make no bones about their smug superiority over those who hold religious beliefs, so it seems to me that same attitude would extend to Muslims - yet some have oh-so-tolerantly said they would be fine with Muslims someday being the majority in Canada, so how would that affect their pride regarding the un-importance that they believe religion plays in Canada?

You will have to identify who you're talking about, I guess. Personally, I'm smugly superior to everybody, no matter what stupid sky-god they subscribe to.

I realize you're still bitter about the NYC mosque thread and how your true feelings were exposed, but I think you're just making things up now to try and get over it.

Edited November 20, 2011 by BubberMiley

[bush_cheney2004]

...I wonder what Canadians who are oh-so-proud of Canada's lack of interest in religion think of all those religious Muslims moving into their oh-so-enlightened non-religious country?

Now this is a very interesting observation, fundamentally challenging their espoused multicultural and liberal ideology (pun intended). Is it just the normal !American identity crisis we see in threads about "crazy Americans" (as Republicans are Americans), or does it have a much broader, international scope for religious bigotry? Fortunately, there are millions of Canadians who also have a belief system based on a major religion or "values", but perhaps they are marginalized by those who do feel smug and superior. But come election time payback is a bitch, and we see the result in Canada.

[Guest American Woman]

Now this is a very interesting observation, fundamentally challenging their espoused multicultural and liberal ideology (pun intended). Is it just the normal !American identity crisis we see in threads about "crazy Americans" (as Republicans are Americans), or does it have a much broader, international scope for religious bigotry?

Definitely bigotry. Or more likely a combination of both. But what I find interesting is that they seem to feel that they can say whatever they want about religious people, claim their superiority, say that every religious person is extreme to an extent - as they call others bigots - as they claim to be -oh-so-tolerant themselves.

Fortunately, there are millions of Canadians who also have a belief system based on a major religion or "values", but perhaps they are marginalized by those who do feel smug and superior. But come election time payback is a bitch, and we see the result in Canada.

Oh, definitely. Most Canadians, just as most Americans, don't fit in with the 'extremist,''my beliefs are the True Beliefs' line of thought.

[bush_cheney2004]

Definitely bigotry. Or more likely a combination of both.

Definitely the combo platter....we can see this when these bigots recoil at the sound of PM Harper saying "God Bless Canada". It's a two-fer....religion + the much dreaded "Americanism".

But what I find interesting is that they seem to feel that they can say whatever they want about religious people, claim their superiority, say that every religious person is extreme to an extent - as they call others bigots - as they claim to be -oh-so-tolerant themselves.

Well certainly they can say such things as is their right, but ironically would seek to limit the religious and speech rights of others in a political setting, in a foreign country no less. Amazing!

Oh, definitely. Most Canadians, just as most Americans, don't fit in with the 'extremist,''my beliefs are the True Beliefs' line of thought.

There are Americans who also declare their secular superiority, but they still understand that the political process is for all citizens, not just atheists.

[Argus]

The Vatican, I'm sure, strives to be as religious as Americans, but evidently religion just doesn't mean as much to them there.

I understand the Republican contenders just had another debate in Iowa, where the conversation was all about their love of God, their tearful testimonials about their personal experiences with God, what God means to them, and how God gives them insight into what American needs and the morality needed to reform society.

I don't see that that sort of thing happening in any other western nation. Actually, I don't see that sort of thing happening anywhere on the planet - other than the Vatican. There aren't any real Muslim democracies so no reason for candidates to debate which of them is more influenced by Him.

I wonder what Canadians who are oh-so-proud of Canada's lack of interest in religion think of all those religious Muslims moving into their oh-so-enlightened non-religious country?

I'm not happy about religious fanatics of any stripe, be it theirs or yours.

Edited November 21, 2011 by Argus

[Argus]

Definitely bigotry.

It'd called judgement. Perhaps a term with which you are not entirely familiar.

[bush_cheney2004]

....I don't see that that sort of thing happening in any other western nation. Actually, I don't see that sort of thing happening anywhere on the planet

Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Took me 20 seconds to find this example from Mexico:

http://www.trincoll.edu/depts/csrpl/RINVol3No3/mexican_election.htm

I'm not happy about religious fanatics of any stripe, be it theirs or yours.

Then start with your own Constitution Act before worrying about "ours".

[blueblood]

Given what's gone on with the super committee recently, the GOP needs a sweep in 2012 to get their agenda through. If they don't get the senate and or lose the house, it's more of the same.

[Argus]

Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Took me 20 seconds to find this example from Mexico:

http://www.trincoll.edu/depts/csrpl/RINVol3No3/mexican_election.htm

Individual politicians have often made a show of piety, whether false or not. I never claimed that didn't happen. But to see the whole crew of presidential contenders gathered around praying and crying and talking about how Jesus Christ is their savior and how He influences everything they do... where do you find that sort of thing but in America?

[Argus]

Given what's gone on with the super committee recently, the GOP needs a sweep in 2012 to get their agenda through. If they don't get the senate and or lose the house, it's more of the same.

Probably. Maybe a full on Republican congress and White House can finally open the eyes of the sheeple who still have this incredible belief the Republicans give a damn about anyone who isn't a millionaire. Maybe when poverty and homelessness triple and children are dying in the streets of starvation while the rich are laughing and partying in their thirty million dollar mansions the power of all those spin doctors and all that slick advertising will finally lose their effect.

[bush_cheney2004]

Individual politicians have often made a show of piety, whether false or not. I never claimed that didn't happen. But to see the whole crew of presidential contenders gathered around praying and crying and talking about how Jesus Christ is their savior and how He influences everything they do... where do you find that sort of thing but in America?

Was Ron Paul praying with them too, or doesn't he count? Evangelicals are popular in other parts of the world, notably Africa. If you watched African election cycles the way you watch the Americans, you would find some God fearin' rhetoric too.

Edited November 21, 2011 by bush_cheney2004

[blueblood]

Probably. Maybe a full on Republican congress and White House can finally open the eyes of the sheeple who still have this incredible belief the Republicans give a damn about anyone who isn't a millionaire. Maybe when poverty and homelessness triple and children are dying in the streets of starvation while the rich are laughing and partying in their thirty million dollar mansions the power of all those spin doctors and all that slick advertising will finally lose their effect.

Since when has low taxes on rich people caused poverty? If anything low taxes on rich people reduces poverty and debt.

Sure better than this big gov't nonsense that you champion that's been going on since the depression.

[guyser]

Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Took me 20 seconds to find this example from Mexico:

http://www.trincoll.edu/depts/csrpl/RINVol3No3/mexican_election.htm

Methinks you should have read your link.

I quote ...

It was an historic moment when Vicente Fox took the banner of the Virgin of Guadalupe,....For the first time in Mexican history, a presidential candidate explicitly formulated a religion policy

For its part, the Church had never before been so visible during a presidential campaign

For decades, the strict exclusion of religion from the public schools, the restrictions on the Church’s political activities, and the ban on Church-owned media have been considered a treasured legacy of 19th-century liberalism by the Mexican political, intellectual, and media elite. Among this elite, it is a widely shared view that the Church must limit itself to the "spiritual sphere"—that it should not even express public views on social issues, much less political ones.

It doesnt make your argument, it hurts it.

[bush_cheney2004]

...It doesnt make your argument, it hurts it.

Quite the opposite...as Presidente Fox did his devout Catholic act in the face of the longstanding taboo in Mexico. So not only did it happen in a place besides the USA, it happened in outright defiance of expectations. It also happens in other places, like parts of Africa, where evangelicals enjoy a lot of support.

Sorry Canadians...other countries can/do mix religion and politics, just like your Constitution Act!

Edited November 22, 2011 by bush_cheney2004

[guyser]

Quite the opposite...as Presidente Fox did his devout Catholic act in the face of the longstanding taboo in Mexico.

I believe the word is disingenous .

[bush_cheney2004]

I believe the word is disingenous .

No, that word would be disingenuous. No matter...it is not just the Americans who pander to such religious interests.

[guyser]

No, that word would be disingenuous. No matter...it is not just the Americans who pander to such religious interests.

What other western nation does it the same ?

Thanks for the spelling correction.

[Argus]

The funny part is why would anyone make such a claim. It's not like there are no nutjobs in all Canadian political parties. All parties have "nutjobs".

Sure do. It's just that ALL the Republican contenders appear to be nutjobs.

[guyser]

Sure do. It's just that ALL the Republican contenders appear to be nutjobs.

All ?

Come on Argus, not all.

Some may not be suitable for the job, but they are not nutjobs.

Cain , Romney , Gingrich to name three aren't. They may have failings (who doesnt), they may not be suitable for the job based on past experiences, but none of them are nutjobs.

Cain couldnt have risent o his level in business by being nuts.Romney might be a bit pious and Gingrich's compass went screwy for a while, but that is not nutjob material

[Argus]

Has a current republican president proposed increased government spending???

So we have to wait until they actually get elected to point out how goofy they are?

[Argus]

How are a lot of them the very fabric of society. America got along just fine before social programs ever existed. Hell it prospered.

And when most Americans died in their fifties that was okay, I suppose. Most Americans don't die in their fifties any more. You nostalgic for that, too?

Lifespans have gone up by a decade this generation. Do you like the idea of lots of old people eating dog food and freezing to death in unheated homes?

And don't tell me about history. The world is changed and so has America. Those old people don't have seven married children to look after them any more.

[bush_cheney2004]

What other western nation does it the same ?

It doesn't have to be the exact same thing to qualify as votes for God. Presidente Fox put his own spin on the exact same idea, so I don't know why it doesn't count. For instance, religion plays a big role in the politics of India, Philippines, Ireland, and several other nations if one just looks for it.

Edited November 22, 2011 by bush_cheney2004

[Argus]

Since when has low taxes on rich people caused poverty? If anything low taxes on rich people reduces poverty and debt.

Preposterous nonsense.