punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 I'm not saying he did anything illegal. For all intents and purposes he didn't I have no problem with the man getting a massage. The location is the problem especially after attacking bawdy houses and saying they objectify women. The optics are terrible. Unless this place was just a Massage parlor and the police acted on wrong information. Then it would be a straight up smear, like the Iggy smear sun news did not more then 3 days ago. That was also found to be a straight up lie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) Unless this place was just a Massage parlor and the police acted on wrong information. Then it would be a straight up smear, like the Iggy smear sun news did not more then 3 days ago. That was also found to be a straight up lie. This info is straight from a Police statement! Not a lie. Layton or Chow didn't deny it wither. Chow made a statement saying it was just a massage. Sun News reported that police witnessed an Asian hooker leaving the room with a soiled tissue, I don't know how reliable this part is, only reporting that they said it on TV. Edited April 30, 2011 by Mr.Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 Olivia just made a statement. Sixteen years ago, my husband went for a massage at a massage clinic that is registered with the City of Toronto. He exercises regularly; he was and remains in great shape; and he needed a massage. I knew about this appointment, as I always do. No one was more surprised than my husband when the police informed him of allegations of potential wrong doing at this establishment. He told me about the incident after it happened. Any insinuation of wrongdoing on the part of my husband is completely and utterly false, which is why after 16 years and 8 election campaigns that my husband has campaigned in, this has never been an issue. In the last hours of this election, this is nothing more than a smear campaign in an attempt to question my husband's character. This is another reason why politics in this country need to change and on Monday, Canadians will have their chance to do just that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) The sun article is up. Here are some excerpts. Layton was cautioned by police and released without being charged. In a letter from his lawyer, Layton recalls "being advised by police at the time that he did nothing wrong." The officer's notebook indicates he asked the suspected john: "Did you receive any sexual services?" He replied: "No sir, I was just getting a shiatsu." "I explained to him this was a bawdy house and then I asked him the silliest question, 'Are you any relation to the councillor, Jack Layton?' and ... he had that defeated look on his face and he said, 'We are one in the same,'" the ex-cop said. "To have arrested him and charged him would have served our egos a lot more. Layton was a thorn in the side of the police, siding with the anti-poverty movement in '96 or '97 ... Jack was anti-police," the ex-cop said. The woman, who was from mainland China, denied masturbating the suspected john http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29/layton-found-in-toronto-bawdy-house-former-cop So there you go a cop with an ax to grind because Layton wasn't great to the Toronto police decided even though nothing happened he would try and smear Layton. Awesome Job Mr. C. Be careful what you imply because I expect Jack will make some money off the Libel suits coming peoples way. Edited April 30, 2011 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 The sun article is up. Here are some excerpts. Awesome Job Mr. C. Exactly as I've been saying. Thanks for the complement! The optics of it don't look good here. Come on punked. If this was Harper you'd be all over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Derek L Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29/layton-found-in-toronto-bawdy-house-former-cop Douglas must be spinning in his grave.....not your father's NDP...... The officer's notebook indicates he asked the suspected john: "Did you receive any sexual services?"He replied: "No sir, I was just getting a shiatsu." The cop: "Why did you have all your clothes off?" The suspected john: No answer. The cop: "Are you aware that there were sex acts being done here?" The suspected john: "No sir." Gutter politics at it's finest, wonder if this will hurt Jack? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/29/layton-found-in-toronto-bawdy-house-former-cop Douglas must be spinning in his grave.....not your father's NDP...... Gutter politics at it's finest, wonder if this will hurt Jack? I love t his style of politics it's what makes it exciting. I wish the whole campaign was like this. This is the real stuff cause it isn't scripted like everyones stump speeches they make ad-nauseam We get to see the leaders in an awkward real moment that could happen to any of us really. It makes them appear human after all. The very thing any political leader tries to avoid. Edited April 30, 2011 by Mr.Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) I smell a Lawsuit coming for sure. From Jacks Lawyer The facts are that Mr. Layton had obtained a massage from a massage therapist, but had no knowledge whatsoever that the therapist’s location may have been used for illicit purposes. He does recall being advised by the police at the time that he did nothing wrong, but that the location was questionable, and to be stayed away from. Mr. Layton gave the officer his name and address, and nothing further happened. Any statement or inference that Mr. Layton’s actions or behaviour was other than the facts stated above would be without any factual basis, would clearly made with malice, and ought not to be published. In fact, it would be irresponsible in the extreme for any such story to be printed. Damages, as you will appreciate, would be very significant.” They know they have a case. This cop better have a good Lawyer because the rest of his pension could be going to the NDP. Edited April 30, 2011 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 I smell a Lawsuit coming for sure. It would be interesting to witness the reaction if Layton's name in this story was replaced with Harper's. Whaddyathink punked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 I smell a Lawsuit coming for sure. This is a true story who is Layton going to sue and for what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy MacNab Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 It would be interesting to witness the reaction if Layton's name in this story was replaced with Harper's. Whaddyathink punked? C'mon punked, be honest. You know darned well the NDP and Liberals would be shrieking themselves hoarse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 Meh, the moment has passed for me. My wife didn't think it was a big deal either. I was running through the house proclaiming this big news about Layton. She said I was carrying on like he had died or something...lol. Maybe it's overblown a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Derek L Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 I love t his style of politics it's what makes it exciting. I wish the whole campaign was like this. This is the real stuff cause it isn't scripted like everyones stump speeches they make ad-nauseam Honestly, I think it's a disgusting character assassination, and I hope Layton has good lawyers, that being said, if it was Harper or Iggy, the press would be jumping up and down just the same. Will this hurt Layton among his base? Doubt it. Will this hurt Layton with the undecided and/or swing voters? Who knows. I wonder which party the cop votes for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 This is a true story who is Layton going to sue and for what? Because we live in Canada and not the US. Libel law is very strict here and to report allegations with out making it perfectly clear there was not wrong doing is just as bad as lying At common law, defamation covers any communication that tends to lower the esteem of the subject in the minds of ordinary members of the public. The perspective measuring the esteem is highly contextual, and depends on the view of the potential audience of the communication and their degree of background knowledge. Probably true statements are not excluded, nor are political opinions. Intent is always presumed, and it is not necessary to prove that the defendant intended to defame. True statements ARE NOT EXCULDED from Canadian defamation laws. This cop might get lucky because Jack is a nice guy but I would sue the pants off him and the sun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) C'mon punked, be honest. You know darned well the NDP and Liberals would be shrieking themselves hoarse. Not with a story like this, this is a slam dunk Libel case. I think this is going to die tomorrow after Jacks Lawyer gets through with all the letters he is going to need to send out. Edited April 30, 2011 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) Not with a story like this, this is a slam dunk Libel case. Bernier and Jaffer get wrung through the ringer with their sex type cases but Layton should get a pass on his? The place was known to police and police said it didn't look like a regular massage parlor as it was dimly lit they said. I dunno what to believe here... on one hand it seems overblown but then on the other it may speak to the character of the man who could become PM. Edited April 30, 2011 by Mr.Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 Bernier and Jaffer get wrung through the ringer with their sex type cases but Layton should get a pass on his? What? Bernier's case wasn't even remotely similar, nor was Jaffer's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 Bernier and Jaffer get wrung through the ringer with their sex type cases but Layton should get a pass on his? The problem isn't that this is reported it is how it is reported. I man who went to a Licenced masseuse got caught by the police getting a massage 16 years ago. Sure go a head run that story. Once you start implying something else was going on with no proof that is libel and the courts going to rule Jacks way 9 times out of 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 Because we live in Canada and not the US. Libel law is very strict here and to report allegations with out making it perfectly clear there was not wrong doing is just as bad as lying True statements ARE NOT EXCULDED from Canadian defamation laws. This cop might get lucky because Jack is a nice guy but I would sue the pants off him and the sun. Why wasn't Ignatioeff or Dion suing then? Surely they suffered at the hands of the Tories. Why didn't Harper sue Martin for all his attack ads against him? Your libel thing isn't holding water I'm afraid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) The problem isn't that this is reported it is how it is reported. I man who went to a Licenced masseuse got caught by the police getting a massage 16 years ago. Sure go a head run that story. Once you start implying something else was going on with no proof that is libel and the courts going to rule Jacks way 9 times out of 10. I don't think anyone was implying anything, just reporting the facts and talking about them. It was already known to police that other things did happen there. Perhaps not in Laytons case but the place was raided by police punked, come on. Apparently they have a red and green light system. When a police officer walked in the light was red meaning only legal actions would take place and when the coast was clear the light was switched to green meaning the girls could do whatever they wanted. The doors had little windows so the owner or whomeevr could keep an eye on his girls. This was said on Sun News TV. Edited April 30, 2011 by Mr.Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 What? Bernier's case wasn't even remotely similar, nor was Jaffer's. You and punked joined at the hips? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 Why wasn't Ignatioeff or Dion suing then? Surely they suffered at the hands of the Tories. Why didn't Harper sue Martin for all his attack ads against him? Your libel thing isn't holding water I'm afraid. I have no idea what you are talking about. I just wrote you the definition of Libel. This is Libel. See with Iggy and Dion they would use statements that those two people said then predict the future. "Iggy said he wouldn't take a GST hike off the table" if he is elected he might raise the GST. There is no way to prove Iggy would or wouldn't. Here you are implying a man did a wrong act and defaming his character with not proof what so ever. The facts are Layton went to for a massage at a place that was given a licence by the province of Ontario (which means no one up to that point was ever caught doing a wrong act there) with a of age lady who said she didn't do anything to him. Those are the facts. Then we have a police man who admits in the article he has it out for Layton, telling a news organization that he found no wrong doing BUT you never know wink wink. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Canada Posted April 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) Then we have a police man who admits in the article he has it out for Layton, telling a news organization that he found no wrong doing BUT you never know wink wink. I see what you're saying. I wasn't implying anything I was posting on the facts as well. I doubt any lawsuits will be filed though. Layton wants this is be buried not stay in the news forever. Layton just issued a statement and said it was a smear campaign. It probably is but that doesn't mean it isn't true. Edited April 30, 2011 by Mr.Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 Layton just issued a statement and said it was a smear campaign. It probably is but that doesn't mean it isn't true. It doesn't mean anyone will care either. I don't like Layton, but I don't care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted April 30, 2011 Report Share Posted April 30, 2011 I don't think anyone was implying anything, just reporting the facts and talking about them. It was already known to police that other things did happen there. Perhaps not in Laytons case but the place was raided by police punked, come on. Apparently they have a red and green light system. When a police officer walked in the light was red meaning only legal actions would take place and when the coast was clear the light was switched to green meaning the girls could do whatever they wanted. The doors had little windows so the owner or whomeevr could keep an eye on his girls. This was said on Sun News TV. Wait Mr. Canada again you are treading on thin Ice. If the police knew other things happened there then why at until that point did never catch anyone doing any "other things". If you catch people in these acts you revoke the licence of establishment. No it was suspected, so how was Mr. Layton to know the police "suspected" this place? Again our legal system doesn't work what you imply. Again the police officer already stated in the article he has it out for Layton so why should I trust him? This story is 16 years old and the police officer just decided that the world should know? I hope he has deep pockets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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