If I run for parliament I'll get $2 a vote.Voter gets $0

[WWWTT]

What really kills me is that many people claim that our system needs this subsidy to make our political system more fair.

What about having at least 66% voter turnout to legitamize our democracy?

Elections Canada spends lots of money to promote voter turnout,not one single penny actually goes to any voter however.

I have also heard the argument that if our political system wants to attract talented people then they need excellent wages and pension plans.

In my opinion if we want a system thats fair-pay the voter,having to listen these politicians non stop has got to be worth something at least.

WWWTT

[William Ashley]

To the OP,

Yeah I'm totally against public financing of Political Parties also, the system is rigged for partisan gains.

The money should go towards public enfranchisement - by creating public mediums for exchange and spread of ideas, one without external controls aside from legal restrictions for illegal content.

It is up to the public to use BBS type systems, public broadcast channels, another free communications.

The system is geared toward for profit corporate control of communication - that is ultimately controlled by corporatist leaning governments. Its not for the public it is for an oppressive system.

Its not going to change with people supporting the system but atleast the thought is there.

All election financing rules should be eliminated. Insure everyone has a vote and has access to be on the ballot at 0 cost, and that it is fairly cast and counts.. that is all that should matter.

Insure people have access to injunction at 0 cost, and slander and libel proceedings at 0 cost, and insure a fair and unbiased judiciary. Insure the public has a recourse to public safety that isn't controlled by the government, but instead by the people. (Not saying all NKVD) but that is what it takes, Canada needs an open volunteer Militia available for enrollment by the whole of the public -- PUBLIC safety, not emergencies only. We need a public that can implement justice without the need for police - we need citizens to be empowered. Police are self serving and politically oriented to their profession, not to unbiased and honest performance. They are more interested in protecting businesses than people. Also the system requires payment for "status functions" that simply is a class barrier imposed by the upper classes on people less wealthy.

These disenfranchisements of the poor must end for a free society and an unbiased and free society to exist. Canadians deserve equal rights, and non monetary access to basic priveleges.

We deserve equal access to the courts and rights of redress and petition as individuals without censorship and bias - freely. Fashion and Finance should not be in place in the courts if social justice is ever to be delivered unbiased and fairly. We must end quashing on basis of delivery, only the overall fact and law should matter not ettiquette -- we must end diversion without consent of the parties a grievance, petition or redress... those are implements of a tyranically police state we need a justice system that provides justice. We also must insure that the innocent are allowed to be free- and that individuals are not jailed on non arbitrary heasay based grounds. These are all things Canada does not have, but a free democratic fair society requires.

CUT ALL TIES TO FINANCE OF ELECTIONS aside from what is needed to cast a ballot and count it leave the rest to a fair and free justice system. (Fair and Free justice system may need apply)

Edited April 5, 2011 by William Ashley

[kimmy]

Somebody who needs to be bribed to vote should just stay home.

There's three kinds of people who don't vote:

People who don't know.

People who don't care.

People who don't like any of the options.

Would our democracy be greatly enhanced by getting more of that sort of person out to the polls? I don't see it.

-k

[Oleg Bach]

We could have a more American system where money buys the brains of voters. In other words - who ever pumps the most money into propoganda wins. This whole idea destroys democracy. The status quo can easily trump all politicals because the average person has an empty head....and it takes money though media and technology to fill that head with the idea that will serve you best.

[William Ashley]

Somebody who needs to be bribed to vote should just stay home.

There's three kinds of people who don't vote:

People who don't know.

They tell you how to vote if you don't know- ex. take this select your box put in box.

People who don't care.

People are not robots, legislation effects all aspects of life. This is a defeatest mindset to say people should vote because they have no emotions for it.

People who don't like any of the options.

This is valid. BUT there is the option of voting for the option you dislike the least.

Example. I would you like to be racked, have your skin flayed, your eyes decocketed and put on a roller coaster, waterboarded, or shot in the groin and left to blead to death?

Would our democracy be greatly enhanced by getting more of that sort of person out to the polls? I don't see it.

-k

No voting is better than no voting 99% of the time.

The system used could matter.

Example people could have their vote collected door to door. Or they could register their vote at any time.

Unfortunately the problem is people are corrupt and vote rig. This however is possible on election day - yes scrutiners exist..

It is aligned to the major parties to get advantages.

In part this is why it is why getting an advisory council where each person has one vote - and can give that vote to a proxy who can hold multiple votes for votes the individual cannot vote for themself - and that the voting system should be verified by the "proxy representatives" where possible by confirming with the people that vote a certain way on an issue.

Direct democracy is the key... It is very sad that people are forced to have someone to represent themselves when people are often mobile enough. Parliament is a means of redress and petition -

We should expand democracy in Canada by offering a new lower - non paid house -- where every Canadian has a means to vote in it.. and that votes are able to be registered on any issue via phone in and that multiple checks should be implemented to secure the system.

I am very uninclined to vote but if I am able to arrange for a vote, I am very likely to vote either Liberal or Green because I can't vote for an American (NDP) and I can't vote conservative. If the NDP person wern't American I would likely vote for them. I don't like any of the policies but I would much rather give a vote to the Green Party over no vote at all, or to the Liberals as opposed to the conservatives (although - there was about a 3000 vote split between the NDP and Liberal in that Riding.) It was a very tight vote with the cons only 1000 votes behind the liberals and 4000 behind the NDP. The Greens likely will not win. But I am likely to protest vote (probably with the greens).

I really don't have a firm faith in any of them to represent me in Parliament - but I do know the NDP is an American Citizen - and didn't want to help with a community issue directly. This to me is not what I expect from a Representative, what is needed is someone who actively engages with community iniatives. NDP is usually the most proactive force that I can see for disadvantaged people, I like this - but I'm not particularly labour - but I do care about disadvantaged people.

I have the sense both the Conservatives and Liberals are corrupt (but it is difficult to see a controlling shift away from either). The Green is a total unknown. The major parties usually distance themselves from controversy even when there is a clear breach of morality in process. They arn't down to earth - and support an overly complicated - and "controlled" diversion influence to supress freedom.

But this is not certain it is completely dependent on how much I can substantiate funding the green party with my vote - basically do I want to give the guy $2? Is his message worth $2 of my money? Even at disdain of the the misguided policy of the greens - the message may be worth $2. I'm not totally convinced but I am getting there.

Edited April 5, 2011 by William Ashley

[kimmy]

I am very uninclined to vote but if I am able to arrange for a vote, I am very likely to vote either Liberal or Green because I can't vote for an American (NDP) and I can't vote conservative.

Jack Layton is an American? Or do you mean your local NDP candidate is an American?

-k

Edited April 5, 2011 by kimmy

[mikedavid00]

There's three kinds of people who don't vote:

People who don't know.

People who don't care.

People who don't like any of the options.

You forgot one of the main ones.

People who like me who live in a Liberal stronghold so there's no point in voting. It's just a waste of time for me to vote.

If you live in Toronto, Vancouver, or Montreal, it's simply pointless going out and voting. It's a waste of time.

[eyeball]

You forgot one of the main ones.

People who like me who live in a Liberal stronghold so there's no point in voting. It's just a waste of time for me to vote.

If you live in Toronto, Vancouver, or Montreal, it's simply pointless going out and voting. It's a waste of time.

What he said.

I live in a federal Conservative stronghold...that's also an NDP provincial stronghold.

I've never won for trying after 30 odd years. I suspect banging my head against a concrete wall would yield more satisfactory results.

[Handsome Rob]

You forgot one of the main ones.

People who like me who live in a Liberal stronghold so there's no point in voting. It's just a waste of time for me to vote.

If you live in Toronto, Vancouver, or Montreal, it's simply pointless going out and voting. It's a waste of time.

I live in one of these cities, the Conservative-Liberal margin was a bare 22 votes, that went to judicial recount. There are a lot of swing ridings in the GTA.

You can't have change without trying, and voting really isn't much trying.

[bloodyminded]

I live in one of these cities, the Conservative-Liberal margin was a bare 22 votes, that went to judicial recount. There are a lot of swing ridings in the GTA.

You can't have change without trying, and voting really isn't much trying.

Good point. Even if you really believe your attempt is fruitless (and which of us haven't felt this way more than once? Anyone here ever tried voting NDP in Fredericton, NB? )...it's not as if a Herculean effort is required.

Edited April 7, 2011 by bloodyminded

[mikedavid00]

There are a lot of swing ridings in the GTA.

No there aren't.

Please name them.

[Oleg Bach]

Jack Layton is an American? Or do you mean your local NDP candidate is an American?

-k

Harper is an American - don`t yah all know...when he`s done up here he`s going back to Harvard -or is that Iggy...oh well...maybe Layton really is a Russian...He does look like Vladimir Lenin....Hey Kimmy...what do you think...Is Canada really having an election.........no one seems to see any signs of one.

[mikedavid00]

Harper is an American - don`t yah all know...when he`s done up here he`s going back to Harvard -or is that Iggy...oh well...maybe Layton really is a Russian...He does look like Vladimir Lenin....Hey Kimmy...what do you think...Is Canada really having an election.........no one seems to see any signs of one.

Remember how Chretien (you know the guy who jumped the queue so his surgeon friend in Quebec could perform a triple bypass on him and they made up that golf story as a cover).

He would always call these elections to keep himself in power (cause that's they name of the Liberal game) and they would kind of float under the radar. The media would ever question the tax payer expense and he quite frankly didn't care what the public though of having an election or anything else for that matter. He ran the country as he saw fit.. like a mob boss out of his office.

Actually speaking of surgeries, remember how Mr 'I have confidence in our health-care system' ran off to Florida to get his heart repaired? Wow. What a show of confidence. It was truly sad how he played it. It's like. Why not just admit that our immigr... err.. healthcare system is a complete communist disaster and we need private care for Canadians. Nope. Instead he got his procedure, came back to Canada, and then perpetuated the 'big lie' in Canada.. well.. you know.. the big lie besides immigration. The Communist Health Care System in Canada..

[bloodyminded]

well.. you know.. the big lie besides immigration. The Communist Health Care System in Canada..

The health care system is not Communist.

[ToadBrother]

The health care system is not Communist.

To those who have brains lacking the nuance and subtlety centres, there is no difference.

[bloodyminded]

To those who have brains lacking the nuance and subtlety centres, there is no difference.

I think it'd be good if people understood that there are words--say, "Communist" and "Fascist" and "Coalition"--that have actual meanings, and which label actual concepts, which can be found out.

Edited April 7, 2011 by bloodyminded

[Oleg Bach]

The health care system is not Communist.

If it was communist or soviet style - the hospitals would be shabby and staffed by drunken doctors - I was over at St. Michael to visit someone in the cardiac wing...the place is beautiful....I asked a staffer why - and she said it was from all the PRIVATE donations.....that certainly is not communist.

[M.Dancer]

No there aren't.

Please name them.

Brampton West

Brampton Springgate

Brampton Gore Milton

York Centre

Oak ridges Markham

Eglinton Lawrence

Mississauga South

Missuaga Eirndale

To name a few

[Handsome Rob]

Brampton West LIB: 21746 CON: 21515 MARGIN: 231 Votes

Missuaga Eirndale LIB: 23556 CON: 23795 MARGIN: 239 Votes

Oak ridges Markham LIB: 31533 CON: 31963 MARGIN: 430 Votes

Brampton Springdale LIB: 18522 CON: 17804 MARGIN: 718 Votes

Mississauga South LIB: 20475 CON: 18476 MARGIN: 1999 Votes

York Centre LIB: 16185 CON: 14095 MARGIN: 2090 Votes

Eglinton Lawrence LIB: 19108 CON: 16848 MARGIN: 2260 Votes

A little farther away

Kitchner Waterloo LIB: 21813 CON: 21830 MARGIN: 17 Votes

Kitchner Centre LIB: 16141 CON: 16480 MARGIN: 339 Votes

Sault St Marie NDP: 16572 CON: 15431 MARGIN: 1141 Votes

Guelph LIB: 18977 CON: 17185 MARGIN: 1792 Votes

To name a few

To quantify, 2008 results. Ontario's traditional heavyweight election role is arguably heavier than it's ever been.

[mikedavid00]

Brampton West

Brampton Springgate

Brampton Gore Milton

York Centre

Oak ridges Markham

Eglinton Lawrence

Mississauga South

Missuaga Eirndale

To name a few

This quote just goes to demonstrate your dishonesty here on the forums. You guys are all the same. You will or do anything to the point of spreading false information. And many of those places are not the GTA..

[Bryan]

People who like me who live in a Liberal stronghold so there's no point in voting. It's just a waste of time for me to vote.

Get involved. You don't sit at home and hope to change a riding, you have to take it over.

[mikedavid00]

Get involved. You don't sit at home and hope to change a riding, you have to take it over.

Get involved?

Sorry I can't speak the foreign tongues of the aliens that live around me.

Call it a communication issue.

[bloodyminded]

This quote just goes to demonstrate your dishonesty here on the forums. You guys are all the same. You will or do anything to the point of spreading false information. And many of those places are not the GTA..

This isn't fair.

M. Dancer and I have never gotten along. I mean, not one little bit.

But I see no evidence that he's a liar, here or elsewhere.

[Shwa]

Get involved?

Sorry I can't speak the foreign tongues of the aliens that live around me.

Call it a communication issue.

At least make an effort. Here, let me help you out:

Learn Hindi

Learn Bengali

Learn Pakistani

Mandarin for Beginners

There, that should get you started. Good luck. And try the samosas - they're delicious!

[Jack Weber]

This quote just goes to demonstrate your dishonesty here on the forums. You guys are all the same. You will or do anything to the point of spreading false information. And many of those places are not the GTA..

Huh???