Real Atrocities - Up to 2,000 dead in Kyrgyz clashes

[dre]

Answer this question - are all cultures, communities, religions, societies, etc equal?

The topic is: Real Atrocities - Up to 2,000 dead in Kyrgyz clashes

[sharkman]

Answer this question - are all cultures, communities, religions, societies, etc equal?

Good question, but I wouldn't expect a truthful answer, have you read some of their posts?

[Guest TrueMetis]

Answer this question - are all cultures, communities, religions, societies, etc equal?

That wasn't actually the question but I'll humour you. Are all the things you listed the equal, no. Are all people the same, yes. Israel is overall a better society than most mid eastern one, congrats that's like beating up a four year old.

Edited June 18, 2010 by TrueMetis

[Bob]

That wasn't actually the question but I'll humour you. Are all the things you listed the equal, no. Are all people that same, yes. Israel is overall a better society than most mid eastern one, congrats that's like beating up a four year old.

So cultures aren't equal but people are. Where does the culture end and the person begin? Where the person end and the culture begin? So Nazism isn't equal to the Liberal Party of Canada, but is Hitler equal to Ignatieff as a person? Hitler and Ignatieff are the same because, in your own idiotic words, "all people are the same"? What in the world are you talking about?

Give me a straight answer and we can then proceed. Keep waffling and you only make yourself look like more of an idiot.

Edited June 18, 2010 by Bob

[Guest TrueMetis]

So cultures aren't equal but people are. Where does the culture end and the person begin? Where the person end and the culture begin? So Nazism isn't equal to the Liberal Party of Canada, but is Hitler equal to Ignatieff as a person? Hitler and Ignatieff are the same because, in your own idiotic words, "all people are the same"? What in the world are you talking about?

Give me a straight answer and we can then proceed. Keep waffling and you only make yourself look like more of an idiot.

Equal and the same as in rights and freedoms you ignorant fool. Hitler was bat shit crazy but incredibly charasmatic, Ignatieff is sane but has the charisma of a dead frog. They both deserve equal rights within reasonable limits.

Edited June 18, 2010 by TrueMetis

[Bob]

Equal and the same as in rights and freedoms you ignorant fool. Hitler was bat shit crazy but incredibly charasmatic, Ignatieff is sane but has the charisma of a dead grog. They both deserve equal withing reasonable limits.

They both deserve equal what? Within what limits? What in the world are you talking about?

Most importantly, why am I even trying to talk to someone who can't even maintain coherence...?

Edited June 18, 2010 by Bob

[GostHacked]

This could have been a great thread on an interesting subject that is of real concern.

It's too bad.

[dre]

They both deserve equal what? Within what limits? What in the world are you talking about?

Most importantly, why am I even trying to talk to someone who can't even maintain coherence...?

Even MORE importantly... why are you talking about the equality of different people and cultures in a thread about Kyrgyz clashes?

[dre]

It's possible, but does not seem that likely in this particular case because Kyrgyzstan has repeatedly asked Russia to send in its soldiers to intervene in the conflict. If Russia was interested in asserting greater influence in this area, I would think they would have jumped at such an invitation. It is rare that a foreign country specifically asks you to send your troops into it. However, Russian president Medvedev turned down the request, saying he did not think it was appropriate for Russia to intervene and that this was an internal Kyrgyz matter.

Sorry your reply got lost in the off topic spam.

Yeah... Im reading conflicting reports. I read some reports that the Russians were going to send Helicopters and other things, then I read reports that they werent, then I read reports that the request by the interim government was retracted.

the http://topics.cnn.com/topics/kyrgyzstan?hpt=htopic

Heres links to a whole pile of stories on the topic.

[Bob]

Even MORE importantly... why are you talking about the equality of different people and cultures in a thread about Kyrgyz clashes?

Follow the thread and you'll see how we arrived here. Let's not pretend that this thread is a vacuum within which none of us are still engaged in other overlapping talks connected to other threads.

[jbg]

For as long as I have been a poster here jbg has always posted topics to use in an over-arching meta-debate on that topic.

I'm not a "Mr. Canada" type figure and will not start a thread on myself, but I'm interested in a further explanation of this analysis.

[jbg]

One more point, this story most certainly WILL NOT dominate any headlines for even a day. It certainly will not get even a tiny fraction of the airtime and attention within the media of the fauxtilla controversy.

If you're a journalist would you rather be posted to Tel Aviv or to Uzbekistan?

[jbg]

The hilarious Irony here is that this thread although being about a very serious and relevant topic....

Quite true.

... was posted for the purpose of taking a shot at people who post here....

No, I sincerely wanted their views. Still waiting.

....and at the UN for ignoring events such as this and focusing on Israel and Middle east.

Abso-f***ng-lutely.

And then the first thing you guys do is derail the thread into a rant about you guessed it: The UN, and Israel.

Its fuckin surreal!

Ask Remiel about that on. He's the thread's resident anti-Jew of the moment.

[jbg]

That wasn't actually the question but I'll humour you.

Humor me instead. That's the right spelling.

[Guest TrueMetis]

Humor me instead. That's the right spelling.

Wanker.

[Remiel]

I'm not a "Mr. Canada" type figure and will not start a thread on myself, but I'm interested in a further explanation of this analysis.

Ask Remiel about that on. He's the thread's resident anti-Jew of the moment.

Perhaps I will respond to these in a PM, but for the time being, if you actually care about the Uzbeks being killed in Kyrgyzstan, why not offer us your analysis of that? That would be on topic, after all.

[Bob]

If you're a journalist would you rather be posted to Tel Aviv or to Uzbekistan?

I understand your point. I also agree with the main point of this thread, though, that the world (governments, NGOs, media) all have a disproportionate focus on Israel and the Palestinians, at the expense of real attention being paid elsewhere.

[GostHacked]

Humor me instead. That's the right spelling.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humour

[jbg]

Perhaps I will respond to these in a PM, but for the time being, if you actually care about the Uzbeks being killed in Kyrgyzstan, why not offer us your analysis of that? That would be on topic, after all.

I actually should research a bit and learn about it.

My point in the thread, though, is that the mantra of peace, brotherhood, understanding etc. should be universally espoused and not only directed at the West. Take this away from Israel. Remember Abu Ghraib? Remember the reams of press about that? How many people did the U.S. kill there? And there was almost no competing coverage about a suicide attacker who attacked a fish store full of children, or someone who blew himself up underneath a gasoline truck outside a religious school in Iraq.

I will continue to point out the hypocrisy. I should avoid referring to any poster as a Jew hater without much better proof and for that I publicly apologize.

Jim

[Borg]

Where is the weeping?

It is in the streets and in the homes of those affected.

Where is the UN?

LOL! Where they always are - worrying about the politics and trying to find a way to profit from others misery - a delightful, crooked, ineffective and sensitive organization that has passed its prime.

Suggestion.

Why not ask China, Saudi, Yemen, Libya, Iran, Syria and a few other model States to step in to help - some of them hold much power and influence in the UN - time for some of them to step up to the plate.

Otherwise I think this one might be a good one to sit out. If only because to go in and attempt to save the day will be another war for the west.

I for one am tired of us being called upon all the time while others sit back. And if the UN goes in it WILL be us that gets tossed the torch. Not interested anymore - home is far more important.

Borg

[Michael Hardner]

Is this thread about how long it is taking the UN to respond ? Seriously, after Rwanda were there any changes made ?

And we are always paying more attention to some places than others - see discussions on this board with regards to East Timor for more on that.

[jefferiah]

I find your crocodile tears to be rather disturbing, jbg. Why is it 2,000 people are killed in Kyrgyzstan and your first thought is to make it about Israel and Palestine? The nerve of your opportunism...

Is he shedding crocodile tears? I don't see anything in his original post showing his emotion one way or another. He seems to be referring to the hypocrisy of those who shed their crocodile tears selectively. Furthermore, I find it hard to believe you were genuinely "disturbed" by JBG at all.

Edited June 19, 2010 by jefferiah

[Moonlight Graham]

Any call for Security Counsel resolution?

Yes exactly. The ECOSOC and the Programmes and Funds of the UN along with specialized agencies operating with the UN do some admirable world in the overlooked corners of the world. Maybe the General Assembly will even have some kind of non-binding vote on this displaying its "moral leadership".

But UNSC doesn't give much of a poop. Well maybe neighbouring China has some interest in the stability there.

2000 dead, and its likely higher and there will will likely be more killing to come. This is basically 9/11 for the Uzbeks in terms of death. 1 life is equal to another, but not in the power structures of the international community unfortunately.

[naomiglover]

I don't think it's somebody's duty to criticize all countries evenly, just because they criticize one. However, there is something to suspect about somebody who continuously criticizes our middle-east ally, or for that matter countries that are predominantly associated with one group.

We don't support either of the parties involved in Kyrgyzstan and we don't turn our backs to international law. Unfortunately, we blatantly support one side in the middle east conflict, despite their numerous violations of human rights.

I'm not sure why jbg is complaining about people wanting everyone to follow human rights laws. I'm not sure why he wants people to stop criticizing Israel because there are other terrible things happening around the world. What a stupid argument.

[jefferiah]

We don't support either of the parties involved in Kyrgyzstan and we don't turn our backs to international law. Unfortunately, we blatantly support one side in the middle east conflict, despite their numerous violations of human rights.

Israel inspects those ships because, despite your naivete, it is crucial to Israel's survival to check and double-check. That is what survival entails for them. Their survival is a human right too. We here in the west have the convenience of being sideline critics, but believe it or not, for them, survival transcends Naomi Glover's concerns about how they do things.

Edited June 19, 2010 by jefferiah