DrGreenthumb Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 It seems the Conservatives just can't help trying to legislate laws over our bodies. Rod Bruinooge has introduced a private member's bill that would make it a criminal offence to try to convince someone to have an abortion. So now discussing abortion as an option will be a crime? Better practice abstinance all you teenage boys, or at least be ready for a lifetime of child support payments, and don't even suggest the morning after pill or other "options", or the Conservative party will make sure you are paying your child support from a jail cell. Don't worry you can earn slave wages in the new Conservative private prisons. Apparently they are using prison slave labour in BC to build some new jails. Quote
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 (edited) It seems the Conservatives just can't help trying to legislate laws over our bodies. Rod Bruinooge has introduced a private member's bill that would make it a criminal offence to try to convince someone to have an abortion. So now discussing abortion as an option will be a crime? Better practice abstinance all you teenage boys, or at least be ready for a lifetime of child support payments, and don't even suggest the morning after pill or other "options", or the Conservative party will make sure you are paying your child support from a jail cell. Don't worry you can earn slave wages in the new Conservative private prisons. Apparently they are using prison slave labour in BC to build some new jails. The bill calls for making it a crime to intimidate OR coerce a woman into having an abortion. A far cry from trying to simply convince or discuss it with someone. Edited April 15, 2010 by Born Free Quote
Molly Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Ha! Not only do they not want to talk about it, they don't want anyone else to talk about it either! Are we soon to see dictionaries redacted, a smeary black blot left where that word used to be? Quote "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" — L. Frank Baum "For Conservatives, ministerial responsibility seems to be a temporary and constantly shifting phenomenon," -- Goodale
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Ha! Not only do they not want to talk about it, they don't want anyone else to talk about it either! Are we soon to see dictionaries redacted, a smeary black blot left where that word used to be? Thats not what the bill is about. Quote
DrGreenthumb Posted April 15, 2010 Author Report Posted April 15, 2010 The bill calls for making it a crime to intimidate OR coerce a woman into having an abortion. A far cry from trying to simply convince or discuss it with someone. One person's discussion is another's intimidation. There are already laws against uttering threats, so this law would obviously be aimed at something considerably less than that. Couldn't talking about all the hardships of being a teenage single mother be considered intimidation? Could a boyfriend threatening to leave the girl if she has the baby be considered coercion? This is Tories pandering to their religious -nut base. Bruinooge is constantly fear mongering about abortions. He is always complaining that late term abortions are legal in Canada even though he can not give one example of one occurring. Quote
Molly Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 (edited) Thats not what the bill is about. No. It's just more anti-choice claptrap. Must there be a special law wrt every possible goal of coercion/intimidation? That depends on whether you are trying to discourage coercion/intimidation, or just some specific goals of that intimidation. Edited April 15, 2010 by Molly Quote "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" — L. Frank Baum "For Conservatives, ministerial responsibility seems to be a temporary and constantly shifting phenomenon," -- Goodale
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 (edited) One person's discussion is another's intimidation. There are already laws against uttering threats, so this law would obviously be aimed at something considerably less than that. Couldn't talking about all the hardships of being a teenage single mother be considered intimidation? Could a boyfriend threatening to leave the girl if she has the baby be considered coercion? This is Tories pandering to their religious -nut base. Bruinooge is constantly fear mongering about abortions. He is always complaining that late term abortions are legal in Canada even though he can not give one example of one occurring. I didnt say the bill was a good idea. I was merely correcting your version of its stated purpose. Coersion doesnt always mean physical threat. It could also include economic threat. Edited April 15, 2010 by Born Free Quote
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 No. It's just more anti-choice claptrap. Must there be a special law wrt every possible goal of coercion/intimidation? That depends on whether you are trying to discourage coercion/intimidation, or just some specific goals of that intimidation. I am a pro-choice supporter. However, I disagree with you on what this bill is about. Quote
Molly Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 I am a pro-choice supporter. However, I disagree with you on what this bill is about. Consider the source, and cut through the weenie, self-righteous, mendacious bafflegab. Bruinooges goal is to recriminalize abortion, and there's precious little that comes out of him that isn't focussed on that goal. This is just one more piece of the same nickel and dime campaign, aimed at that endpoint. If he can't get abortion criminalized.... he can try for criminalizing some aspects of talking about abortion. Quote "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" — L. Frank Baum "For Conservatives, ministerial responsibility seems to be a temporary and constantly shifting phenomenon," -- Goodale
Machjo Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 The bill calls for making it a crime to intimidate OR coerce a woman into having an abortion. A far cry from trying to simply convince or discuss it with someone. You mean we shouldn't be allowed to intimidate and coerce a woman into having an abortion? How evil Quote With friends like Zionists, what Jew needs enemies? With friends like Islamists, what Muslim needs enemies?
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 You mean we shouldn't be allowed to intimidate and coerce a woman into having an abortion? How evil Yep. Thats what the bill is about. Quote
Shady Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Consider the source, and cut through the weenie, self-righteous, mendacious bafflegab. Bruinooges goal is to recriminalize abortion, and there's precious little that comes out of him that isn't focussed on that goal. This is just one more piece of the same nickel and dime campaign, aimed at that endpoint. If he can't get abortion criminalized.... he can try for criminalizing some aspects of talking about abortion. This is the problem with most of the pro-abortion zealots in this country. They're not much different than the gun nuts in America. But instead of screaming "They'r taking away our guns!!!", they scream "they're taking away our abortions!!!", when that's not the case at all. You lose any credibility when you act in such a juvenile manner. Quote
Dave_ON Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Is anyone able to provide a link to what the Bill actually contains? I sincerely doubt this bill will make it past second reading. Given the current situation with Guergis etc. I don't think the CPC really wants another $h1t storm on their hands. Especially not one the likes of another abortion debate would generate. Quote Follow the man who seeks the truth; run from the man who has found it. -Vaclav Haval-
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 (edited) Consider the source, and cut through the weenie, self-righteous, mendacious bafflegab. Bruinooges goal is to recriminalize abortion, and there's precious little that comes out of him that isn't focussed on that goal. This is just one more piece of the same nickel and dime campaign, aimed at that endpoint. If he can't get abortion criminalized.... he can try for criminalizing some aspects of talking about abortion. I understand your concern. However, this specific bill isnt about the recriminalization of abortion its about intimidation or coersion. Edited April 15, 2010 by Born Free Quote
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Is anyone able to provide a link to what the Bill actually contains? I sincerely doubt this bill will make it past second reading. Given the current situation with Guergis etc. I don't think the CPC really wants another $h1t storm on their hands. Especially not one the likes of another abortion debate would generate. I agree. Quote
Molly Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 I understand your concern. However, this specific bill isnt about the recriminalization of abortion its about intimidation or coersion. If his interview rhetoric is to be trusted, then it's about 'intimidation and coercion to have an abortion', definitely NOT about 'intimidation and coercion to forgo an abortion'--- and not just about intimidation and coercion wrt abortion in general. One would have to be hopelessly naive to suppose for a second that a 'butt the Hell out of the decision' bill would fly with Mr. Bruinooge, or that this bill would resemble such a thing. It will become available for review soon. I look forward to saying "I told you so." Quote "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" — L. Frank Baum "For Conservatives, ministerial responsibility seems to be a temporary and constantly shifting phenomenon," -- Goodale
Wild Bill Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 (edited) I agree. Of course! It's a private members Bill, for Pete's Sake! It didn't come from the CPC! How many private members Bills ever get enacted? One zealot puts out a private members Bill to please the folks in his home riding. Everyone knows it will never go anywhere. Meanwhile, all the anti-Tory partisans are trying to make out like this is CPC party policy and an attempt to make it the law of the land. If this is an example of how so many fellow citizens think (or actually, DON'T think!) then it's no wonder we get the politicians we deserve... Edited April 15, 2010 by Wild Bill Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 If his interview rhetoric is to be trusted, then it's about 'intimidation and coercion to have an abortion', definitely NOT about 'intimidation and coercion to forgo an abortion'--- and not just about intimidation and coercion wrt abortion in general. One would have to be hopelessly naive to suppose for a second that a 'butt the Hell out of the decision' bill would fly with Mr. Bruinooge, or that this bill would resemble such a thing. It will become available for review soon. I look forward to saying "I told you so." Now yer being silly about it. The bill is essentially to prevent a bullying husband from beating the crap outta his wife to get an abortion that is against her will. In effect..her choice is being removed. It aint likely gonna pass and it aint about recriminalizing abortion. Quote
Molly Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Now yer being silly about it. The bill is essentially to prevent a bullying husband from beating the crap outta his wife to get an abortion that is against her will. In effect..her choice is being removed. It aint likely gonna pass and it aint about recriminalizing abortion. Really! When it becomes available, you can show me the clauses that would prevent a bullying husband from beating the crap out of his wife to stop her from seeking an abortion. Of course it's not going to pass-- but if you think it's intended to protect choice rather than to restrict it, you are sillier than I am. Quote "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" — L. Frank Baum "For Conservatives, ministerial responsibility seems to be a temporary and constantly shifting phenomenon," -- Goodale
wyly Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Is anyone able to provide a link to what the Bill actually contains? I sincerely doubt this bill will make it past second reading. Given the current situation with Guergis etc. I don't think the CPC really wants another $h1t storm on their hands. Especially not one the likes of another abortion debate would generate. the opposition will love it...any hint of restricting a womans right to choose will be percieved as the slippery slope backwards... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 (edited) Really! When it becomes available, you can show me the clauses that would prevent a bullying husband from beating the crap out of his wife to stop her from seeking an abortion. Of course it's not going to pass-- but if you think it's intended to protect choice rather than to restrict it, you are sillier than I am. If you have any information suggesting it contains anything other than has been stated in the news.. by all means let us know... Edited April 15, 2010 by Born Free Quote
M.Dancer Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 the opposition will love it...any hint of restricting a womans right to choose will be percieved as the slippery slope backwards... As Born Free said, intimating, coercing and such, is the antithesis of "the right to chose" Now if you believe that someone should be able to say, threaten... I wonder if say a person offers a women financial considerations to have an abortion she doesn't want....would that be coercion? Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Born Free Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 the opposition will love it...any hint of restricting a womans right to choose will be percieved as the slippery slope backwards... Its not about that. Its about women having their right to choose being taking away by a bullying partner or any other person. Quote
M.Dancer Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 Its not about that. Its about women having their right to choose being taking away by a bullying partner or any other person. It seems that for some, the right to chose means the right to chose to have an abortion, not the right to chose not to... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
ToadBrother Posted April 15, 2010 Report Posted April 15, 2010 It seems the Conservatives just can't help trying to legislate laws over our bodies. Rod Bruinooge has introduced a private member's bill that would make it a criminal offence to try to convince someone to have an abortion. So now discussing abortion as an option will be a crime? Better practice abstinance all you teenage boys, or at least be ready for a lifetime of child support payments, and don't even suggest the morning after pill or other "options", or the Conservative party will make sure you are paying your child support from a jail cell. Don't worry you can earn slave wages in the new Conservative private prisons. Apparently they are using prison slave labour in BC to build some new jails. It's a private members bill. Wake me up when Cabinet tables it. Quote
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