Ross Rebagliatti- Liberal Hopeful, Space Cadet

[ToadBrother]

True, but interesting they would pander to those voters on one hand, and offer nothing with the other...

First of all, it isn't official Liberal policy. If a potential Liberal MP wants to spout off about his republican streak, so what? It's not as if Rebagliatti would ever be anything more than a Minister of State for Flush Toilets at best if he got elected and the Liberals formed a government.

If there is anybody deluded or dumb enough in this country to actually believe there is a politician out there with any ambition to reach Cabinet who is going to relight the powder keg of constitutional change, they deserve to be duped.

Edited February 19, 2010 by ToadBrother

[Smallc]

True, but interesting they would pander to those voters on one hand, and offer nothing with the other...

It's rather like the Conservative elected Senate.

[M.Dancer]

Touche

[g_bambino]

If there is anybody deluded or dumb enough in this country to actually believe there is a politician out there with any ambition to reach Cabinet who is going to relight the powder keg of constitutional change, they deserve to be duped.

Hence, since Trudeau - perhaps even Pearson - the ambition has not been outright constitutional change, but republicanism by stealth, instead; that's what Donolo advocates to his monarchy hating comrades in the video I posted. Hence, we've seen over the time of successive Liberal governments the removal of the 'royal' designation here, the disappearance of the Queen's name there, the elevation of prime ministers into presidents somewhere else, and everywhere a vacuum of education on the subject of the Crown so nobody cares when the aforementioned takes place, at best, or so an institution is perceived out of igorance to be a useless colonial relic waste of tax dollars, at worst (Rebagliatti being a prime case in point).

These efforts have taken place under Liberal watch (though some In the party, like Shiela Copps, were decent to the monarchy) and there's still noting to say a future Liberal regime wouldn't continue the pattern to further drum up, using our own tax funds, popular support for ditching the monarchy.

Edited February 19, 2010 by g_bambino

[ToadBrother]

Hence, since Trudeau - perhaps even Pearson - the ambition has moot been outright constitutional change, but republicanism by stealth, instead; that's what Donolo advocates to his monarchy hating comrades in the video I posted. Hence, we've seen over the time of successive Liberal governments the removal of the 'royal' designation here, the disappearance of the Queen's name there, the elevation of prime ministers into presidents somewhere else, and everywhere a vacuum of education on the subject of the Crown so nobody cares when the aforementioned takes place, at best, or so an institution is perceived out of igorance to be a useless colonial relic waste of tax dollars, at worst.

These efforts have taken place under Liberal watch (though some In the party, like Shiela Copps, were decent to the monarchy) and there's still noting to say a future Liberal regime wouldn't continue the pattern to further drum up popular support for ditching the monarchy using our own tax funds.

At the end of the day, despite all of that, the actual task of removing the Monarchy would be an insanely difficult one. And I'm not so sure that Chretien, for instance, was even an anti-monarchist. Clearly, Quebec politics required him, to some degree, to keep whatever feelings he had quiet, but since leaving office, he has come out pretty profoundly on the Queen's side, and she has clearly demonstrated her own affection for him.

Besides, the Monarchy has its new secret weapon. Prince William has proven himself a very potential savior of the monarchy. Even the Aussies seem quite taken in by him. If there has been a forty year campaign to wipe out the monarchy in Canada, believe me, it will be knocked back at least that far the first time William and his new bride make an official visit.

Monarchists in Britain were worried much as you are. First he Diana debacle, then the Labour government was moving stealthily towards a republic by undermining or eliminating traditions and institutions wherever they could. And then a million people showed up at the Mall to celebrate her Golden Jubilee and six or seven years of republicans believing the tide had finally turned and the Windsors would be shown the door was wiped out in an instant. Since then, the British public has even approved of Charles' remarrying and now view with great affection and hope the rise of Prince William and Prince Harry, showing that whatever Diana's flaws, she managed to produce the best hope for the Monarchy's future.

In Canada sentiments are obviously no longer that strong, but still, it's far too difficult to remove the Crown, and more importantly far too dangerous.

[Smallc]

and there's still noting to say a future Liberal regime wouldn't continue the pattern to further drum up, using our own tax funds, popular support for ditching the monarchy.

What I find frustrating on this issue as well is the media. Rarely, unless it has something to do with the Canadian Forces of the Order of Canada do we hear what the Governor General is doing. We don't hear about her state, official, and working visits to most other countries, we don't hear about the visits of most heads of state and government that come to Rideau Hall, and we don't hear...well...much of anything that she does.

[waldo]

.. that's what Donolo advocates to his monarchy hating comrades in the video I posted.

you seem fixated on the symbolism - would it make any difference if the monarch's image didn't appear on our money? When you pass your next 20, will you stop and reflect upon the image prior to handing it over? When you see a Canadian flag, are you shamed that you don't see the Union Jack... do you favour we should revert back to the Union Jack? Was our government weakened when the Maple Leaf was brought in?

[Smallc]

When you see a Canadian flag, are you shamed that you don't see the Union Jack... do you favour we should revert back to the Union Jack?

I don't think you understand what you're saying here. The Canadian flag doesn't reduce anything about the Crown. The Crown in Canada has no connection to the flag of the United Kingdom.

[waldo]

I don't think you understand what you're saying here. The Canadian flag doesn't reduce anything about the Crown. The Crown in Canada has no connection to the flag of the United Kingdom.

concerns were raised about symbolic representation... the loss of that symbolic representation in regards images on Canadian money - hence the parallel to the Canadian flag; i.e. the 'loss' of the Union Jack in favour of the Maple Leaf. Per your reply, does adjusting the image on Canadian money...perhaps to something other than the reigning monarch... as you say, reduce anything about the Crown?

[Smallc]

IMO, the $20 bill should have the Queen replaced with another PM. Her silhouette should stay on Canadian coins. That would make it more uniform across all of our money.

[g_bambino]

In Canada sentiments are obviously no longer that strong, but still, it's far too difficult to remove the Crown, and more importantly far too dangerous.

Oh, I've no argument against that; when it comes down to the nuts and bolts, no emotional hatred for the Crown will ever itself provide a viable alternative, let alone a way to implement it with the required full agreement of all the provinces. However, on the other hand, it seems unacceptable to be coaxing the population, at their own expense, into hating something they can't get rid of.

[c/e]

Edited February 20, 2010 by g_bambino

[g_bambino]

What I find frustrating on this issue as well is the media. Rarely, unless it has something to do with the Canadian Forces of the Order of Canada do we hear what the Governor General is doing. We don't hear about her state, official, and working visits to most other countries, we don't hear about the visits of most heads of state and government that come to Rideau Hall, and we don't hear...well...much of anything that she does.

Of course. For the media, no controversy means no importance. So, when you've got a non-partisan institution you've obviously got a useless anachonsim subject to the double standard of only being interesting when an occupant stuffs up, thereby damaging the office.

[Oleg Bach]

Mr. Rebagliatti does not realize or maybe he does that todays artifically grown and genetically altered marijuana brings about a state of stupification, boardering on instantity - So if this dumb hopeful want to be a public offical then he is going to have to make sure that those he leads are more stupid than he - hence the legal pot..great plan!

[g_bambino]

you seem fixated on the symbolism - would it make any difference if the monarch's image didn't appear on our money? When you pass your next 20, will you stop and reflect upon the image prior to handing it over? When you see a Canadian flag, are you shamed that you don't see the Union Jack... do you favour we should revert back to the Union Jack? Was our government weakened when the Maple Leaf was brought in?

Fixated is a bit too strong of a word. Concerned is more apt. And I am so because symbols and images are vested with meaning and communicate it; they speak, teach, and remind as much as words can. If they weren't important in that way, monarchy haters would simply ignore them rather than making them their prime target; obviously, they're acutely aware of the consequence of denying the people the images and symbols of their Crown.

That in no way means the symbols need be static, though; only that everyone be aware of their meaning. I don't deny or bemoan that the significance of the Royal Union Flag changed in tandem with the evolution of nationalism and international relations. So, I'm not perturbed by its disappearance from the canton of our national flag long before I was born; especially when I consider that other monarchies - like the Netherlands and Belgium - have triband national flags without royal symbols and separate royal flags, like us.

[Oleg Bach]

Common wealth - is just that - and Prime Minister or first servant is just that also. Words and the revision of them is bothersome and misleading. The best book I ever owned way an old dictionary from the 1880s - It opened a whole new world to me on the origin of the language _ It came in handy when dealing with lawyers who had forgotten what the language meant. Words are very powerful if you find out what they really were meant to say - such as GRACE - "The undeserved mercy of God" _ You translate that and imagine why they called British nobles - YOUR GRACE - I suppose it was to show that a man of real class was not bias and he treated all of the underlings with mercy - good or bad - that was total civil tolerance.

[August1991]

It's an old tradition of (all) political parties to use sports celebrities as candidates. ISTM that the federal Liberals are more guilty of this than other parties. Ken Dryden, for example.

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With that said, the federal Liberals (at least since 1896) understand that politics is about attracting attention (buzz, in the modern vernacular). If Ross Rebagliatti is a Canadian citizen, then he's a legitimate MP, representative.

[i have no idea who this guy is. I haven't googled yet, and I probably won't. I gather he won some prize at the Olympics.]

[Oleg Bach]

Dryden was a hockey star - Harper wanted to be a hockey star..I guess they are all stars now/

[Alta4ever]

When you see a Canadian flag, are you shamed that you don't see the Union Jack... do you favour we should revert back to the Union Jack? ?

We flew the Red Ensign.

[Smallc]

We flew the Red Ensign.

I've read that the Union Jack was also used at times, as we didn't have an official flag.