Colvin being punished by Conservatives says lawyer for whistleblowing

[William Ashley]

I find it hard to see why the legal fees stopped being paid after his testimony in the house. I don't think this is coincidence, and I think with high prospect the conservative government violates the whistleblowing legislation put into effect to protect civil servants from doing just this type of thing.

Should witnesses before committees be given legal counsel, especially if their are legal concerns to the specific reason for a committee hearing? Also in the instance of whistleblowing - this is problematic to have government lawyers from the attorney generals office act as counsel.

re:

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=2482380

What exactly about Colvin's testimony would jepordize national security? Should someone be able to be stopped from testifying against the government if they, the government, are conducting themselves illegally for so said national security reasons, especially in a war half way around the world. Specifically for instance violate the geneva convention on war. What would the government even know about these, if they havn't read any of his reports. Do Canadians expect their government to follow the geneva convention, unlike Americans who don't care about the convention. Is this even a real war, or a real threat, if so perhaps this is why the Conservatives are able to get away with rigging elections, due to the ability to suspend democratic election during times of war.

Isn't punishing whistleblowers the one thing that tried to be stopped after the last change of government. The Conservatives of yesteryear have lost all virtue. If only the opposition ran government, as that tends to be the only place they stick to their word.

Edited January 25, 2010 by William Ashley

[Oleg Bach]

I was a whistle blower. Dragged a governmental agency though the courts for five years - embarrassed they fully. Mentioning this to a wise old man - He said - "You will not go unpunished" - well I am being punished for letting the cat out of the bag and being the proverbial man that knows to much. In the end you can not keep a good person down ...I suggest that Colvin sit tight and realize that those that attempt to enslave and dominate their fellows always in time become the servant..It is the just servant that takes over the masters house if the master is corrupt for to long - it is evolution.

[Topaz]

I would think most Canadians don't mind having their tax dollars going to a whistle-blower if they actual do on something solid on the government that is wrong and is covering it up. We pay for the PM to take other people to court, or parties, so why not whistleblowers and I think they should come forward and have the protection from financial ruins.

[Oleg Bach]

I would think most Canadians don't mind having their tax dollars going to a whistle-blower if they actual do on something solid on the government that is wrong and is covering it up. We pay for the PM to take other people to court, or parties, so why not whistleblowers and I think they should come forward and have the protection from financial ruins.

There is a standard way to get rid of rebels and whistleblowers..drag it out in court - maim them emotionally - destroy them finacially with legal bills - wear them out physically with stress and useless effort that is all for not. Try it sometime..sue your offenders or those harming others..if you don't have a team of legalist warriors who collectively have endurance to follow though with such an enterprise..you are pretty much finished...You will never beat them no matter how correct right and just your cause be. It's not a game for the common person without contacts and unlimited resourses.

[Argus]

I would think most Canadians don't mind having their tax dollars going to a whistle-blower if they actual do on something solid on the government that is wrong and is covering it up. We pay for the PM to take other people to court, or parties, so why not whistleblowers and I think they should come forward and have the protection from financial ruins.

Colvin is not a whistle blower. Whistle blowers inform higher authority, or the public, of important incidents of wrongdoing so that they can be addressed. It seems clear that Colvin's reports during the time were typical bland ass covering with no specific information regarding possible abuse of "canadian" prisoners by Afghans. Only after it became a big deal and everyone knew about it did he jump on the band wagon and start pumping out reports. But that seems basically more ass covering. The media spin has put him as this guy warning well in advance that things were happening but there is NO actual evidence of that. None.

beyond that, he seems to have gone out of his way to antagonize and embarrass the government. His career is toast. He will never be trusted again by the senior public service, no matter who is in power in Ottawa. Once this matter has dropped off the press's fickle limeliight he'll be shuffled off to progressively more unpleasant positions until he gets a clue and quits.

As to his demand for tens of thousands of dollars to cover lawwyers HE CHOSE TO HIRE why on earth should we be responsible for that? He didn't hire them to protect himself since he's not charged with anything. He didn't want the justice department lawyer who was going to advise him regarding his testimony and got his own. Fine. He can pay for it.

Edited January 26, 2010 by Argus

[EyesWideOpen]

He didn't want the justice department lawyer who was going to advise him regarding his testimony and got his own. Fine. He can pay for it.

seriously?!?!?

no conflict of interest there, eh?

So if you were in Colvin's place, you'd have no problem using a lawyer from a federal

department...a lawyer who will read all the documentation and get a very firm sense of

which side his bread is buttered on???

seriously?!?!??!

[Argus]

seriously?!?!?

no conflict of interest there, eh?

So if you were in Colvin's place, you'd have no problem using a lawyer from a federal

department...a lawyer who will read all the documentation and get a very firm sense of

which side his bread is buttered on???

seriously?!?!??!

If I were a public servant simply acting in my capacity as a public servant, and testifying for committee, the only reason I would need a lawyer would be to ensure I didn't mistakenly give out information which would violate my oaths of confidentiality and secrecy. I therefore see no conflict. No one has even suggested Colvin broke the law and is guilty of any kind of indictable offense, so why does he need high priced legal talent?

[EyesWideOpen]

If I were a public servant simply acting in my capacity as a public servant, and testifying for committee, the only reason I would need a lawyer would be to ensure I didn't mistakenly give out information which would violate my oaths of confidentiality and secrecy. I therefore see no conflict. No one has even suggested Colvin broke the law and is guilty of any kind of indictable offense, so why does he need high priced legal talent?

You can't play both sides of the field here, bud....

just a few short posts ago, you said: His career is toast. He will never be trusted again by the senior public service, no matter who is in power in Ottawa

He's fighting for his career and reputation here, and has every reason to expect everything and anything will be done to discredit him... and no reason to believe anyone but an outside lawyer can actually represent him fairly.

[DrGreenthumb]

You can't play both sides of the field here, bud....

just a few short posts ago, you said: His career is toast. He will never be trusted again by the senior public service, no matter who is in power in Ottawa

He's fighting for his career and reputation here, and has every reason to expect everything and anything will be done to discredit him... and no reason to believe anyone but an outside lawyer can actually represent him fairly.

How much did the government pay for Mulroney's legal bills? I read somewhere it was well over a million. That's ok though eh Argus?, I mean after all Mulroney is a Conservative right?

[EyesWideOpen]

How much did the government pay for Mulroney's legal bills? I read somewhere it was well over a million. That's ok though eh Argus?, I mean after all Mulroney is a Conservative right?

hhmmm...which time??

Airbus?

Schreiber?

[Argus]

You can't play both sides of the field here, bud....

just a few short posts ago, you said: His career is toast. He will never be trusted again by the senior public service, no matter who is in power in Ottawa

He's fighting for his career and reputation here, and has every reason to expect everything and anything will be done to discredit him... and no reason to believe anyone but an outside lawyer can actually represent him fairly.

The government is under no obligation to pay for his legal representation with regard to protecting his job or interests against the government. The only purpose in reimbursing council is with regard to normal testimony before committee.

[Argus]

How much did the government pay for Mulroney's legal bills? I read somewhere it was well over a million. That's ok though eh Argus?, I mean after all Mulroney is a Conservative right?

Paying for lawyers on behalf of someone the committee is investigating for possible criminal wrongdoing is a rather different thing than paying for lawyers on behalf of a person where no wrongdoing is suspected or suggested.

Does Colvin have something to hide about his actions, some reason to fear prosecution?

[YEGmann]

Guys,

Sorry, but as I undestood from the CBC (!) website (oh, yes, it's Kady O'Malley )

http://www.cbc.ca/politics/insidepolitics/2010/01/hey-remember-richard-colvin.html

this fella is asking for ADDITIONAL money! He has been paid.

"The Department of Foreign Affairs continues to cooperate with Mr. Colvin. An initial amount of $20,000 in legal support was approved by the department in November 2009. Two invoices submitted by his previous counsel amounting to just over $21,000 have been paid in full.

A third invoice has since been received which exceeds the amount approved in November. The department is reviewing this invoice and will make a decision about payment in the near future. Since changing counsel, Mr. Colvin has not submitted an application for more funding. "

Now his second lawyer demands more money.

What is going on?!

[CANADIEN]

You got ONE thing right for once, Argus. As Colvin does not stand accused of wrongdoings or criminal act, there is no need for the public to pay for any legal reprsentation beyond that provided already (btw, folks, the lawyer has a legal and ethical responsibility not to reveal with Colvin said to him).

As for Colvin's motivations in reporting what he saw and the Government's reaction to it... He did exactly the right thing. What he reported, if true, could amount to serious moral failure by our Government. Torture is morally reprehensible, inefficient, and we are justified in expecting our Afghan ally to live by a higher standard that does not involve it - instead of turning a blind eye if they don't.

[William Ashley]

Guys,

Sorry, but as I undestood from the CBC (!) website (oh, yes, it's Kady O'Malley )

http://www.cbc.ca/politics/insidepolitics/2010/01/hey-remember-richard-colvin.html

this fella is asking for ADDITIONAL money! He has been paid.

"The Department of Foreign Affairs continues to cooperate with Mr. Colvin. An initial amount of $20,000 in legal support was approved by the department in November 2009. Two invoices submitted by his previous counsel amounting to just over $21,000 have been paid in full.

A third invoice has since been received which exceeds the amount approved in November. The department is reviewing this invoice and will make a decision about payment in the near future. Since changing counsel, Mr. Colvin has not submitted an application for more funding. "

Now his second lawyer demands more money.

What is going on?!

Hi profile case involving national security.

[cybercoma]

I was a whistle blower. Dragged a governmental agency though the courts for five years - embarrassed they fully. Mentioning this to a wise old man - He said - "You will not go unpunished" - well I am being punished for letting the cat out of the bag and being the proverbial man that knows to much. In the end you can not keep a good person down ...I suggest that Colvin sit tight and realize that those that attempt to enslave and dominate their fellows always in time become the servant..It is the just servant that takes over the masters house if the master is corrupt for to long - it is evolution.

...and now we're being punished.

[William Ashley]

They paid

http://www.canada.com/news/Federal+government+agrees+Richard+Colvin+legal+fees/2491159/story.html

[ironstone]

While we're on the subject of whistleblowers,does the name Allan Cutler ring a bell?

Allan S. Cutler is a former Canadian public servant notable for his role as the whistleblower who reported anomalies in a Canadian sponsorship program designed to raise awareness in Quebec of the Government of Canada's contributions to Quebec industries and culture. This program was undertaken to counter Quebec separatism. The ensuing scandal implicated high-ranking bureaucrats and politicians in the Liberal Party of Canada and contributed to the setback of the Liberal Party in the 2004 Federal election and its defeat in the 2006 Federal election. [1]

Cutler, who reported to Charles Guité at the Ministry of Public Works and Government Services, was responsible for negotiating the terms and prices of government advertising contracts. He objected to procurement practices that failed to follow proper procedures or ensure value for money. After expressing his concerns to Chuck Guite, he was effectively demoted. A subsequent labour dispute was resolved by his being re-assigned to a different section. [2]

He testified at the Gomery Commission, providing evidence that commissions were paid for no apparent service and improper advances were made to agencies with connections to the Liberal Party. Gomery concluded that Cutler was penalized for his whistle-blowing efforts and that Mario Parent, and probably others, adopted a complacent behaviour to the mismanagement of the sponsorship program due in part to apprehensions about suffering similar repercussions as Cutler

Guess your Liberals don't much like whistleblowers either huh?

[ironstone]

Gosh,how come there are no replies when I bring up Allan Cutler's story?

[Keepitsimple]

As is the case with much of the mud that's thrown at the Conservatives, there's nothing to this "story". Keep in mind that it was Colvin's lawyers who feared they would not be paid......and of course, we know that lawyers love their money. From the original story:

Foreign affairs spokeswoman Katherine Heath-Eves said the government has already paid $21,000 to Colvin's lawyers and that it will decide "in the near future" on whether to provide more funding.

And now, as reported by the Star:

An official with the Foreign Affairs Department says two invoices from Colvin's former lawyer totalling $20,000 have been paid and payment for a third invoice submitted in December has been approved. The federal government has also set aside additional funds to a maximum of $50,000 to pay further legal expenses.

Link: http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/afghanmission/article/756920--ottawa-to-pay-afghan-whistle-blower-s-legal-tab

Edited January 29, 2010 by Keepitsimple

[capricorn]

I'm pleased to see bureaucrats at Foreign Affairs exercising due diligence before paying invoices submitted for legal services. Anyone having had any dealings with lawyers knows that it's not always easy to decipher their statements requesting remittance.

[William Ashley]

---------

Edited January 29, 2010 by William Ashley

[William Ashley]

Guess your Liberals don't much like whistleblowers either huh?

"If this is a reply to my post "your liberals" isn't an applicable reply. I'm not a liberal, I've never voted liberal, and have no plans to any time soon.

I'm more of a "I know what I don't like" person, less so than a "eh, better than that one" person.

Edited January 29, 2010 by William Ashley

[William Ashley]

Gosh,how come there are no replies when I bring up Allan Cutler's story?

Old news, non relevant, and doesn't do any justice to parallel the sponsership scanadal to conservative mangling of colvin catastrophe.

[William Ashley]

As is the case with much of the mud that's thrown at the Conservatives, there's nothing to this "story". Keep in mind that it was Colvin's lawyers who feared they would not be paid......and of course, we know that lawyers love their money. From the original story:

And now, as reported by the Star:

Link: http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/afghanmission/article/756920--ottawa-to-pay-afghan-whistle-blower-s-legal-tab

My gosh, you'd poke a hole right through your cheek with the sheer audacity of that claim.