maple_leafs182 Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 (edited) For the record, that's 3 videos you've had me watch now. It was 1/2 of a news panel discussion about Sarah Palin, and 1/2 of a stand-up comedian. Again, the emotive passion is good but doesn't make for good policy. Yes there is stupidity, junk food and bad information everywhere. Lament, lament, but what to do ? (That was Bill Hicks) I don't think you truly get it, the system is the problem not the solution, just like the economy, debt is the problem not the solution. Policy won't fix this problem when the system is the problem. Did you listen to Ron Paul's speech? It is very good, it deals with policy. ..and that's one reason why he lost his presidential bid. "Pure and True" means hopelessly naive, especially when it comes from somebody worshipping a very flawed Congressman Ron Paul, from another nation for chrisakes.So just sit back and wait for whatever the hell the USA decides to do next, because that's all you seem to care about. Christ's sake*** What was so flawed about him? He was the only candidate who would of ended the wars. He uses logic, reasoning and rationality, he was not just another puppet like the other candidates. As for waiting, it is all I can do right now. Edited January 6, 2010 by maple_leafs182 Quote │ _______ [███STOP███]▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ :::::::--------------Conservatives beleive ▄▅█FUNDING THIS█▅▄▃▂- - - - - --- -- -- -- -------- Liberals lie I██████████████████] ...◥⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙'(='.'=)' ⊙ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 (That was Bill Hicks) I don't think you truly get it, the system is the problem not the solution, just like the economy, debt is the problem not the solution. Policy won't fix this problem when the system is the problem. Yes, I'm familiar with Mr. Hicks' material. Ok, well, then you are like John Lennon. I heartily recommend you visit a festival called BurningMan (I go every year) where they create a money-free city of 50,000 people for one week. So here's the answer: The model to replace the existing political-economic-social structure is to build another structure within it, and wait for the external structure to die off. Did you listen to Ron Paul's speech? It is very good, it deals with policy. I've listened to enough of Ron Paul since the Republican primaries. Christ's sake*** What was so flawed about him? He was the only candidate who would of ended the wars. He uses logic, reasoning and rationality, he was not just another puppet like the other candidates. As for waiting, it is all I can do right now. You already said that policy change won't do it, and the "lone wolf" type of politician hero that you like more often turns out to be incompetent, a psychopath, or a clown. They're often elected on a wave of anger, which is a negative emotion. I urge you to continue throwing spitballs at the current system, but stay out of the realm of the real and stay in the realm of the poetic. And, the best way to promote a better world is to speak positively about the good things that are out there, and there are many of these. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Christ's sake*** What was so flawed about him? He was the only candidate who would of ended the wars. He uses logic, reasoning and rationality, he was not just another puppet like the other candidates. Ron Paul never had a chance at the presidency because of earlier associations with racist views in several newsletters and extreme positions for domestic and foreign policy. As for waiting, it is all I can do right now. OK...that BIG BIG Depression is coming any day now....just wait and see. Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maple_leafs182 Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Ok, well, then you are like John Lennon. I heartily recommend you visit a festival called BurningMan (I go every year) where they create a money-free city of 50,000 people for one week. sound cool, I'll look into it, ty. So here's the answer: The model to replace the existing political-economic-social structure is to build another structure within it, and wait for the external structure to die off. I understand what you are saying and it sounds reasonable, but we must ensure a quick painless death to the monster we created. We are headed for who knows how many years of pain and suffering if we don't do something now, the longer we wait the worse it will get. I've listened to enough of Ron Paul since the Republican primaries. Ya okay, but this is a really good speech, by far one of his best. You don't even have to watch the video, just listen to it in the background. You already said that policy change won't do it, and the "lone wolf" type of politician hero that you like more often turns out to be incompetent, a psychopath, or a clown. They're often elected on a wave of anger, which is a negative emotion. who Ron Paul? Anyways I don't think politicians are going to solve this problem, the people need to solve it. I urge you to continue throwing spitballs at the current system, but stay out of the realm of the real and stay in the realm of the poetic. And, the best way to promote a better world is to speak positively about the good things that are out there, and there are many of these. I feel what I am speaking of is as real as it gets. Cells work together to make organs, organs work together to create organisms, organisms(human) must work together to create humanity. It is our evolution. We must stop fighting amongst ourselves and start working together, loving each other, it is the only way. Quote │ _______ [███STOP███]▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ :::::::--------------Conservatives beleive ▄▅█FUNDING THIS█▅▄▃▂- - - - - --- -- -- -- -------- Liberals lie I██████████████████] ...◥⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙'(='.'=)' ⊙ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Cells work together to make organs, organs work together to create organisms, organisms(human) must work together to create humanity. Cells can also be organisms unto themselves....that's our evolution...as in individual liberty and choice. Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maple_leafs182 Posted January 7, 2010 Report Share Posted January 7, 2010 I'll agree, but that is only part of our evolution. And as for Individual liberty and choice, why can't I smoke marijuana legally? Governments should not tell us what we can do with our bodies, this is not the reason they were established. Quote │ _______ [███STOP███]▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ :::::::--------------Conservatives beleive ▄▅█FUNDING THIS█▅▄▃▂- - - - - --- -- -- -- -------- Liberals lie I██████████████████] ...◥⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙'(='.'=)' ⊙ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 7, 2010 Report Share Posted January 7, 2010 I'll agree, but that is only part of our evolution. And as for Individual liberty and choice, why can't I smoke marijuana legally? Because you live in Canada. We get to smoke all the dope we want! Governments should not tell us what we can do with our bodies, this is not the reason they were established. You can do whatever you want with your body, just stay away from the contraband or risk arrest and conviction. Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted January 7, 2010 Report Share Posted January 7, 2010 Cells can also be organisms unto themselves....that's our evolution...as in individual liberty and choice. We all have sleeper cells that are ready to terrorise the body and bring on imminent death to the organism..I belive it's called cancer..Rule number one..do not stimulate those cells..and rule number two...don't believe in anything fully enough to have it manifest it's way into reality. Fear is the great killer of individuals and of whole societies. I just wish that America would realize that this great faithlessness and cowardice will destroy them in time..Being brash and bold and sending in more aircraft carries to destroy others is not a show of faith or courage...fear .....Now that I am on the topic let me tell you a story. As I plodded and bounced my way though our legal system in protection of the younger stupider brother..and in the honour and memory of my father and mother....I was fearful...I have been fearful all my life and crippled by that disease...THEN once I understood things and understood the mechanizm of evil...I stopped being afraid and you should have seen those in positions of power disolve like a witch under water..."young man you are strong for you have mastered evil (stupidity) - once you master and understand evil...it flees. I suggest that we all master what is nasty and move forward in grace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maple_leafs182 Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 (edited) We all have sleeper cells that are ready to terrorise the body and bring on imminent death to the organism..I belive it's called cancer..Rule number one..do not stimulate those cells..and rule number two...don't believe in anything fully enough to have it manifest it's way into reality. Fear is the great killer of individuals and of whole societies. I just wish that America would realize that this great faithlessness and cowardice will destroy them in time..Being brash and bold and sending in more aircraft carries to destroy others is not a show of faith or courage...fear .....Now that I am on the topic let me tell you a story. Cancer can be cured and cancer is also preventable. I don't understand how the Iraq war is still going on. Wasn't the reason of the war because they had "weapons of mass destruction". They didn't have any. shouldn't people be mad that the government lied, why is the war still going on? The world is to proud to admit its mistakes, every country in the world needs an ego suicide. I know many Americans who don't want the wars to go on, but they are ignored. There is no democracy only the illusion of democracy. We do as we're told, We're just worker bees. Because you live in Canada. We get to smoke all the dope we want! That's not the point, life shouldn't have rules yet we are enslaved by a system of rules. From not being allowed to smoke pot to having to pay taxes. This reality or whatever you wanna call it, it is just an elaborate dream. It is just a ride, we should be enjoying it, what we are doing now isn't living, it's surviving. Can you tell heaven from hell? All I know is we can be living in heaven if we wanted to. I suppose a lot of people want to, but we get caught up in these lies and these endless compromises. Governments are only governments when the people give consent to be governed. Micheal you want policy, lets end every war. All of them, the war on drugs, the war on terrorism, the war in Afghanistan and any other wars, the are senseless, counter productive and only profit the few at the top. Edited January 8, 2010 by maple_leafs182 Quote │ _______ [███STOP███]▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ :::::::--------------Conservatives beleive ▄▅█FUNDING THIS█▅▄▃▂- - - - - --- -- -- -- -------- Liberals lie I██████████████████] ...◥⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙'(='.'=)' ⊙ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I don't understand how the Iraq war is still going on. Wasn't the reason of the war because they had "weapons of mass destruction". They didn't have any. So what? The US / UK have been kicking Iraq's ass since 1991. shouldn't people be mad that the government lied, why is the war still going on? The world is to proud to admit its mistakes, every country in the world needs an ego suicide. I know many Americans who don't want the wars to go on, but they are ignored. There is no democracy only the illusion of democracy. The US is not a democracy...it is a constitutional republic. Elected representatives voted for war....again. We do as we're told, We're just worker bees. Bzzzzzzzz...Bzzzzzzzzz! That's not the point, life shouldn't have rules yet we are enslaved by a system of rules. From not being allowed to smoke pot to having to pay taxes. Oh great...it always comes back to smoking dope...need more of that like a hole in head. This reality or whatever you wanna call it, it is just an elaborate dream. It is just a ride, we should be enjoying it, Many of us are enjoying it. Quote Economics trumps Virtue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted January 9, 2010 Report Share Posted January 9, 2010 The left are just bitter hearted materialists who deliever the mail in Rosedale and Forest Hill. Blue collar guys that lust to be white collar guys and gals. Give a lefty a million bucks and he quickly becomes super right wing. Much like aging feminists who have had successful carreers in buisness or poitics...once they get to become the fat old males that they hate they soon betray their younger sisters in need. It's a lot like a guy being released out of the town jail who promises to contact some cell mates mother to post bail on his behalf - Once that person crosses the line into freedom - all those in the jail house become their least concern. I don't know if it's true or not but I assume because a lot of lefties don't like God or are full blown atheists...are really not benevolent Jesus like saints..IF as it happened in old Russia - and you promise the peasants riches IF they assist you in killing all the rich people..The peasant lefties will agree to murder for profit..under the guise of creating some far fetched utopian state of equality. It goes against the grain of base human nature to bring about equality and freedom - The lefty just like the bed bug is only interested in nutrion and survival of itself and not the collective. Give Jack Layton ten million dollars and he will take up with Harper no questions asked - the left are rats waiting for a crumb to fall from the masters table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maple_leafs182 Posted January 9, 2010 Report Share Posted January 9, 2010 Its because we have become a left brain society The left brain is responsible for rules, fear, logic, structure and law The right brain is responsible for faith, love, creativity, beliefs, and intuition. Many of us are mainly using the left side of their brain, we must use both sides of the brain equally. Quote │ _______ [███STOP███]▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ :::::::--------------Conservatives beleive ▄▅█FUNDING THIS█▅▄▃▂- - - - - --- -- -- -- -------- Liberals lie I██████████████████] ...◥⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙'(='.'=)' ⊙ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pliny Posted January 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 Its because we have become a left brain society The left brain is responsible for rules, fear, logic, structure and law The right brain is responsible for faith, love, creativity, beliefs, and intuition. Many of us are mainly using the left side of their brain, we must use both sides of the brain equally. Micheal Hardner chooses to use only the middle portion. Quote I want to be in the class that ensures the classless society remains classless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugs Posted January 12, 2010 Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 In this article Move your moneyfrom the Huffington Post the left has finally come full circle. Or has it really? I find myself to be in agreement with the general drift of the article and in doing so find myself on the left wing. Who would have thought I would start the year off like that! I think it's a good idea. Don't underestimate Huffington. She's an intelligent woman. In the US, one of the worst aspects of this mess is that a lot of good, local banks -- still of good size -- could go out of business, even though they loaned money prudently. By moving money to smaller, more local banks, Americans can help them to survive. All the populism aside, the system requires that the risk-takers take the burn. The too-big-to-fail banks are the ones. Fannie and Freddie are the ones. That's what gives the system its integrity ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 12, 2010 Report Share Posted January 12, 2010 Micheal Hardner chooses to use only the middle portion. That depends. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pliny Posted January 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 I think it's a good idea. Don't underestimate Huffington. She's an intelligent woman. She thinks so as well. I think she has lost sight of the big picture and is myopically involved in political gamesmanship. This is the first instance where I could find any agreement with her. But I don't believe she has given much thought passed the first chess move on this issue. It isn't in keeping with her big government planned economy. I don't see how she can reconcile this idea with her ideological perspective. In the US, one of the worst aspects of this mess is that a lot of good, local banks -- still of good size -- could go out of business, even though they loaned money prudently. By moving money to smaller, more local banks, Americans can help them to survive. Of course, this is what she is saying. but I think her reasons are misguided. I think she sees it more of a strike against corporatism than the saving of small banks. Motivation, to me, is key to understanding reasoning. This move of hers to support small banks is not the prime motivation. It is the well-intentioned motivation but underneath that is her target which she has no trouble identifying as her target. The prime motive is to destroy but that is masked by the good intention of saving small banks. Of course some will see the destruction of big banks as positive as well. SO it makes it very difficult to sort through honest motivation to improve. Summing it up, I think she believes things need to be as she sees them and if they aren't whatever appears to be a block to that needs to be destroyed. There is no doubt she is very successful at portraying left-wing liberalism and galvanizing it's proponents. She is a progressive, thus she is for change in the direction of big government which is never historically what America has been about. It has adopted progressive policies and programs in the past and the supporters and beneficiaries of those policies and programs drive the progression further. Huffington is one of those supporters. All the populism aside, the system requires that the risk-takers take the burn. The too-big-to-fail banks are the ones. Fannie and Freddie are the ones. That's what gives the system its integrity ... I agree. Huffington isn't about allowing them to be responsible for their risks, she is about actively taking them out. She so much as says this herself but it seems completely out of character for her to suggest a move away from a centralization of power, supporting small banks with the intent of destroying large ones is just such a move, in my view. Quote I want to be in the class that ensures the classless society remains classless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugs Posted January 20, 2010 Report Share Posted January 20, 2010 Pliny said, referring to Mme Huffington ... I think she has lost sight of the big picture and is myopically involved in political gamesmanship. This is the first instance where I could find any agreement with her. But I don't believe she has given much thought passed the first chess move on this issue. It isn't in keeping with her big government planned economy.I don't see how she can reconcile this idea with her ideological perspective. I think people have different virtues. She's intelligent, and articulate, but her special virtue is a sense of how ordinary people look at things. She used to be for the Contract for America, when that was popular. The good thing about her is that she noses out stories that justify peoples' feelings. ... I think her reasons are misguided. I think she sees it more of a strike against corporatism than the saving of small banks. Normally, I'd agree with you, but doesn't it seem to you that the big banks are looting America right now? I agree, traders needs a certain amount of latitude, but they should understand when they are abusing their position sometime before they stick the American public with God-knows-how-many-$trillions as the bill? When you consider that some of these people voting for a Republican in Mass ... aren't angrier than they are ... many of them have lost jobs, have lost a big bite of their retirement funds and are losing their homes! There is a growing movement out there that people should 'Starve the Beast' in preparation for a coming collapse. They mean to prepare yourself for a much diminished standard of living by, as much as possible, buy things from the smallest, most local businesses, and let the big corporate people take care of themselves. Huffington's comments fit into that kind of thinking, which is taken up by gold bugs and survivalists -- all the fringy pessimists and doomsayers' time is coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 The extreme left will take all your money and waste it on hopeful ideas that do not always pan out. The extreme right will simply steal all your money and blame it on the left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pliny Posted January 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2010 Pliny said, referring to Mme Huffington ... I think people have different virtues. She's intelligent, and articulate, but her special virtue is a sense of how ordinary people look at things. She used to be for the Contract for America, when that was popular. The good thing about her is that she noses out stories that justify peoples' feelings. Want my opinion of her? It isn't good. She doesn't nose out stories that justify people's feelings, she wrankles them - she is a poo-poo disturber. she knows what will get people going. Normally, I'd agree with you, but doesn't it seem to you that the big banks are looting America right now? I agree, traders needs a certain amount of latitude, but they should understand when they are abusing their position sometime before they stick the American public with God-knows-how-many-$trillions as the bill? When you consider that some of these people voting for a Republican in Mass ... aren't angrier than they are ... many of them have lost jobs, have lost a big bite of their retirement funds and are losing their homes! The "bill"? It isn't a bill. It's a loss. You have to be asking yourself why this "bill" is being paid by taxpayers. Why aren't these losers driven out of the market? There is a growing movement out there that people should 'Starve the Beast' in preparation for a coming collapse. They mean to prepare yourself for a much diminished standard of living by, as much as possible, buy things from the smallest, most local businesses, and let the big corporate people take care of themselves. Huffington's comments fit into that kind of thinking, which is taken up by gold bugs and survivalists -- all the fringy pessimists and doomsayers' time is coming. Yes. Huffington's comments fit into that kind of thinking. How unusual for her ideological position to be shifting to "gold bugs", survivalists, fringy pessimists and doomsayers", all of whom are associated with the political right. Huffington has shifted positions to become the latest Neo-con. I will try and be concise but here is how I see the economic situation in the States. The government is entirely responsible for the housing bubble and it's collapse. It claims to be able to create a healthy economy but can't seem to do so. Obama has owned the economy now he can no longer blame Bush. He said his policies have managed to stabilize the economy and he must now be responsible but like all governments when the economy turns sour it is always because of some capitalist factor like greed; you would think government would begin to account for that but they don't seem to see it coming. Saving Wall Street is only a small part of why government does what it does. It's main concern is about saving the revenues of government, the investments of politicians, and the public's perception of the administration. Wall street is tied in with government pretty heavily. The one thing government cannot do is cut spending or downsize and that is the one thing it needs to do. Instead it becomes bigger and borrows more. The left and the right are both guilty of that. Quote I want to be in the class that ensures the classless society remains classless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pliny Posted January 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2010 The extreme left will take all your money and waste it on hopeful ideas that do not always pan out. The extreme right will simply steal all your money and blame it on the left. You should have said the extreme left will "steal" all your money, as well. It seems that the left provides you with hopeful ideas you agree with which may not pan out and the right just spends it on themselves or ideas that you disagree with. Quote I want to be in the class that ensures the classless society remains classless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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