Harper to prorogue parliament AGAIN?

[Alta4ever]

Lets also not forget to mention the purchase of the C-17s, that the other side of the commons was so against. Turned out to be a good investment, since our DART team wasn't stranded in Canada waiting on the government begging other countries to borrow heavy lift transport to get our dart team in. (like what happened after the tsunami hit the south pacific.)

[nicky10013]

Your right you are clueless.

Here is just one thing, but they have signed 9 free trade agreements since taking office. It like NAFTA has will improve trade reduce barriers and benefit our economy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Harper

The accountability Act

Agent Orange Compensation Package

GIS allowing hirer earnings

Armed Boarder Guards

Community Development Trust

Income Splitting for Seniors

THE TFSA

The lobbying Act

The Child Sports credit

Had the Manley report Approved by The HOC

The Softwood lumber agreement

No more Taxation on student scholarships

A bill of rights for Taxpayers

Among many others that have bettered Canadians.

I'm sorry but pretty much all of these things are red herrings. Name what ANY of these things have actually effected any change. How could you even have the gall to post the accountability act after he shut down parliament. It's mind boggling. It really is. The one thing that comes to mind that could help is tax free scholarships, however, if you count it as income, most Canadian students including scholarship make below the lowest amount of income taxable anyways. Something that sounds great but does nothing, like pretty much everything on that list.

As for C-17s, the government bought them but didn't have the foresight to actually build hangars for them. They've been sitting on the tarmac for 2 Canadian winters in the ice and snow which is probably seriously degrading the operational lifespan of the aircraft. But, again, it goes to everything Harper has ever done. Who cares about actually maintaining anything, as long as we have the visual of the plane in Canada, that's all that matters.

[capricorn]

BECAUSE HE'S THE LEADER OF THE COUNTRY! HE SHOULD BE ON TOP OF THIS!

No need to shout.

I understand you want the government to do everything for you, and that includes thinking. Would you also want some assistance writing out that cheque? Perhaps the PM could help you? Most people don't need the PM to tell them how to donate and which fund they should donate to. The fact is most of the people who will donate have done so in the past and already have a clue how to go about it. First time donors have plenty of resources available to guide them. They don't need the PM to take them by the hand because they know he has other tasks to attend to, or as you would call it, basic stuff.

[Alta4ever]

I'm sorry but pretty much all of these things are red herrings. Name what ANY of these things have actually effected any change. How could you even have the gall to post the accountability act after he shut down parliament. It's mind boggling. It really is. The one thing that comes to mind that could help is tax free scholarships, however, if you count it as income, most Canadian students including scholarship make below the lowest amount of income taxable anyways. Something that sounds great but does nothing, like pretty much everything on that list.

As for C-17s, the government bought them but didn't have the foresight to actually build hangars for them. They've been sitting on the tarmac for 2 Canadian winters in the ice and snow which is probably seriously degrading the operational lifespan of the aircraft. But, again, it goes to everything Harper has ever done. Who cares about actually maintaining anything, as long as we have the visual of the plane in Canada, that's all that matters.

Just because you choose to not take benefit from these does mean that they haven't benefited Canadians.

If you had any brains you would understand just how valuable the TFSA is, if you understand compound interest, plan for retirement and have the foresight to see just how much of your savings is eaten away in tax when you pull it out of a RRSP you just might understand.

As for the C-17's what is missing is a maintenance hanger, which I believe is under construction. Even the Hercules sit out in the weather. But Again you can't see past your Harper hating agenda, you just spew bile.

[Smallc]

I don't see anything bad about the PM being seen given back.

[Wilber]

As for C-17s, the government bought them but didn't have the foresight to actually build hangars for them. They've been sitting on the tarmac for 2 Canadian winters in the ice and snow which is probably seriously degrading the operational lifespan of the aircraft. But, again, it goes to everything Harper has ever done. Who cares about actually maintaining anything, as long as we have the visual of the plane in Canada, that's all that matters.

Actually, aircraft spend almost their whole lives outside. The only time they see the inside of a hanger is for maintenance. It is a bit of bitch for a human trying to maintain an aircraft outside during a Canadian winter but the aircraft could realy care less. A maintenance hanger for the C-17 will cost about half as much as one aircraft so it is a relatively minor detail. Until they get it built I am sure there are other facilities they could use for any work that must be done in doors. Among others, Air Canada has several hangers that can handle the C-17.

[Smallc]

Honestly, those (the C-17s) were the best purchases the Conservatives made. If they could get the JSS project (or whatever it is now) up and running, it would be in many ways more useful for things like this. I can only guess that they didn't send the east coast supply ship because it's either deployed (not that I'm aware of) or out of service right now.

Edited January 15, 2010 by Smallc

[DrGreenthumb]

Let's try to keep this thread on the topic of Harper and his undemocratic move to prorogue parliament rather than hand over the documents that parliament had ordered handed over.

I don't want to seem insensitive, but I'm pretty sure there will be an earthquake thread or two going on elsewhere in these forums. We can discuss military spending in the military threads.

I'd appreciate it if we don't let this important thread about Harper's disrespectful treatment of our democracy to drift. Harper is hoping that many things will happen to distract Canadians from what he has done, in the long prorogation. I wouldn't doubt that the thought crossed his mind that the earthquake might at least make Canadians forget his dirty deeds for a while. I don't want to let talk of other disasters sideline this thread and distract us from the disaster that is our Prime Minister. Over 10 thousand views, not to bad. Seems people DO care about Harper's attack on our democracy.

[g_bambino]

Seeing a leader make a personal donation might sway some to open their wallets to help. Throwing a sandbag, not so much.

There is something a bit showy about it; do we need to know the time and place Harper will make (now made) the donation? The Queen just issues a notice that she made a donation, after the fact.

[Smallc]

I don't really fault him in any way for it. He's responded quickly to the whole thing....much quicker than ever before. I think he can show off a bit.

[g_bambino]

I don't really fault him in any way for it. He's responded quickly to the whole thing....much quicker than ever before. I think he can show off a bit.

Well, not to belabour this point, but there's a difference between government response and personal response. Showing us the former demonstrates that he's doing his job, which is good to know; making a show of the latter is trying to tell us... what? That he's a nice, caring man? I don't know; it could've been done with a little more tact.

[Smallc]

According to Greg Weston, the response was all because of Harper. I can't really say anything bad about him right now...although this has highlighted another broken promise - the failure to double the size of dart. It also highlight the fact (it seems) that the HMCS Preserver is out of commission sooner than scheduled.

http://www.torontosun.com/news/columnists/greg_weston/2010/01/13/12455386-qmi.html

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5g3X__rCSUEtRAO_3CtgXhvHD15ZA

[DrGreenthumb]

[

Check this out a nice compilation of Harper's attacks on our democracy to date.

http://drivingtheporcelainbus.blogspot.com/2010/01/harper-attack-on-canadian-democracy.html

When Harper wants to spin his way out of a tight spot he can just call on his neocon army to try and swing public opinion

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080325.wtorytalk0325/BNStory/National/home

Anybody listen to AM talk radio? The cons are desperately trying to excuse Harper's undemocratic actions.

[Argus]

Bahahahahahahahaahahahaha. Hilarious. No, if he did that I'd vote for him. However, I haven't see ONE thing in this country that Harper has made better.

God people are clueless.

Nah, he's right. Harper, by all account, has done an excellent job with this one, and all the venomous lefties can do is wail and make shrill accusations. Not that you ever had any credibilty, but it makes you sound even more like a spiteful little boy.

[Argus]

There is something a bit showy about it; do we need to know the time and place Harper will make (now made) the donation? The Queen just issues a notice that she made a donation, after the fact.

If you want to encourage people to do something, you give the media a visual of you doing it, much as we see the image of them voting on election day.

[DrGreenthumb]

If you want to encourage people to do something, you give the media a visual of you doing it, much as we see the image of them voting on election day.

Translation: OH Goody! Something happened to distract people from Harper's undemocratic behavior, and his attempt to cover-up and hide things from the Canadian people. He should fly right down to Haiti and get a picture taken pulling a body from the rubble, that'd boost his poll numbers i bet.

Check out this list of Harper attacks on our democracy, on openness and accountability. Its a really good list of reasons why Harper should be thrown out immediately and never put in charge of anything bigger than a lemonade stand EVER again.

http://drivingtheporcelainbus.blogspot.com/2010/01/harper-attack-on-canadian-democracy.html

[ToadBrother]

If you want to encourage people to do something, you give the media a visual of you doing it, much as we see the image of them voting on election day.

I don't think anyone in our current batch of leaders qualifies in the "cultural hero" category. I suspect you'd get more people donating money if William Shatner or Alex Trebeck were shown donating money.

[Argus]

Translation: OH Goody! Something happened to distract people from Harper's undemocratic behavior, and his attempt to cover-up and hide things from the Canadian people.

I don't know how to break this to you, but his using rules of parliament to his benefit - the same as every other government in the history of Canada - does not constitute undemocratic behaviour. As for hiding things, maybe if there was less smoke in your apartment you wouldn't be seeing things which aren't there.

[ToadBrother]

I don't know how to break this to you, but his using rules of parliament to his benefit - the same as every other government in the history of Canada - does not constitute undemocratic behaviour. As for hiding things, maybe if there was less smoke in your apartment you wouldn't be seeing things which aren't there.

So I gather you can produce another example in the Commonwealth or British Empire of a Prime Minister using prorogation to evade a confidence motion. I keep asking and you guys just keep ignoring the question.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

He is not doing anything illegal. Then again he is not doing the right thing. The people seem to understand this in great numbers. Big enough numbers to cause a 33 seat slide if an election were held today. That still leaves him in power, but that is just pure speculation.

[DrGreenthumb]

He is not doing anything illegal. Then again he is not doing the right thing. The people seem to understand this in great numbers. Big enough numbers to cause a 33 seat slide if an election were held today. That still leaves him in power, but that is just pure speculation.

By springtime harper's numbers will have tanked so bad the opposition will vote non-confidence, and Canadians will show Harper how it felt to be Mulroney, when Cretien kicked his ass.

[Alta4ever]

By springtime harper's numbers will have tanked so bad the opposition will vote non-confidence, and Canadians will show Harper how it felt to be Mulroney, when Cretien kicked his ass.

The Parties base support level is around 30% without the creation of another reform party you can only dream.

[Smallc]

I'm not sure about that. The government's Haiti response is going to give them a big boost. This is the kind of work Canadians want to see their soldiers do. The quick response will only add to it.

Harper isn't my favourite person, but I can plainly see that he has put our military in much better shape than it had been (though Paul Martin started it). Never before could we have responded so fast with so much while at the same time managing our largest war time deployment in decades. It's pretty amazing.

Edit: It's also worth noting that we have a battle group training in California, and another preparing for the olympics...all at the same time as a war and the response to Haiti.

Edited January 16, 2010 by Smallc

[jbg]

Nah, he's right. Harper, by all account, has done an excellent job with this one, and all the venomous lefties can do is wail and make shrill accusations. Not that you ever had any credibilty, but it makes you sound even more like a spiteful little boy.

Even if Harper has not run an ideologically conservative government, he has certainly provided good, clean, honest and competent services.

So I gather you can produce another example in the Commonwealth or British Empire of a Prime Minister using prorogation to evade a confidence motion. I keep asking and you guys just keep ignoring the question.

Better yet, give me any recent examples, i.e. more recent than 1979, where a democracy in the Commonwealth or British Empire faced a minority government. The last such example(s) I can think of were a batch of such governments in Britain in the mid-1970's. Without minority governments you won't find your example.

Britain, Jamaica, and Australia, the major Commonwealth democracies (I plead ignorant on India) are effectively two-party countries. Yes there are a few parties grabbing a few ridings/constituencies/seats but no persistent overlay of minority governments. For Canada,let's see, we've had, during this period, the entire Pearson era (1964-8), part of Trudeau (1972-4), Joe (Who) Clark (1979-80), Paul Martin (2004-6), and Stephen Harper (2006-date). As has been pointed out, even majority governments including Chretien used prorogues to stifle debate or shut down or advantageously time inquiries.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

Its difficult to say where Harper will be rated in even the next couple of weeks, let alone spring time. I fully expect there to be other issues that come to light, where governing from the PMO becomes more problematic by the moment. From there he has no cover, nobody to blame or have take the blame for what happens. Its a tough position to be in when you think about it, its all on him.

I honestly think Harper needs to take two steps back and rethink what has worked in the past in terms of gaining public support. He can still cut taxes and bet on an improving economy. Provide tax relief to citizens will do wonders in gaining support. Joe Clark had a beauty, tax deductible mortgages, Trudeau kicked his ass before it could happen but it was a great idea. Mulroney dumped the manufacturers sales tax. You can work on either one side of the ledger or both, that is to say individual cuts or business cuts, just as long as the cuts stimulate the economy without borrowing money to do it. Revenues will return and the deficit will disappear, then the debt can be handled.

Harper is in the drivers seat. He can take his time to formulate some long term vision for us, and if he does he will likely remain the PM. Now should Harper not do this and the opposition does, then I think Harper may well lose his job as PM.