bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 I have a soft spot for Russia in some ways, all of my family are Russian immigrants. There are good some reputable educational and research institutions in Russia, and have been for many decades.... Hey....I agree with you...and even miss the Soviets sometimes compared to the rank amateurs faced today (e.g. Somali pirates). Those were the good 'ole days.....playing cat and mouse games with Ivan. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 No..no...Russians are the best in the world. They are so good, they even managed to sink themselves (Kursk) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_submarine_Kursk_explosion The Russian philosophy has always been simplicity and quantity over quality. They tend to also rely on the old 'if it's not broken why fix it?' which really can put a brake on development. Their space program is a good example of this. The R-7 has been in use since its Sapwood ICBM/Sputnik launcher days (1957-58) while the Soyuz has been going strong since 1967. So what's new on the horizon? Nuthin'?? Answer: Nuthin' Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 (edited) even the US military admits the Russians are ten yrs ahead in cruise missile technology Kursk-just as the US managed to sink themselves, USS Thresher and USS Scorpion The US military always says that....see "Missile Gap". Thresher and Scorpion were not lost like Kursk....in only 100 meters of water. Edited November 26, 2009 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Guest TrueMetis Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 The Russian philosophy has always been simplicity and quantity over quality. They tend to also rely on the old 'if it's not broken why fix it?' which really can put a brake on development. Their space program is a good example of this. The R-7 has been in use since its Sapwood ICBM/Sputnik launcher days (1957-58) while the Soyuz has been going strong since 1967. So what's new on the horizon? Nuthin'?? Answer: Nuthin' Don't knock the Russian space program, the Soyuz is better than the NASA shuttle. No one has died in a Soyuz since 1971. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Don't knock the Russian space program, the Soyuz is better than the NASA shuttle. No one has died in a Soyuz since 1971. Better for what? Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Don't knock the Russian space program, the Soyuz is better than the NASA shuttle. No one has died in a Soyuz since 1971. I'm not knocking the Soyuz at all. It just fits the Russian philosophy as described which can be a problem for developers of new tecnology. Russia has no Ares Moon rocket waiting on the pad. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Guest TrueMetis Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Better for what? Not getting the people inside killed. These things can do everything the NASA shuttles can. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Not getting the people inside killed. These things can do everything the NASA shuttles can. That's so "Canadian"....this is for you: http://salul.wordpress.com/2008/09/25/soyuz-vs-shuttle/ Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 (edited) Not getting the people inside killed. These things can do everything the NASA shuttles can. Not everything. The Soyuz is basically a ferry with zero cargo capacity. That's where the Progress comes in but it still can't carry a Hubble. Edited November 26, 2009 by DogOnPorch Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 ....the Chinese already have ships designed around this system which are nuclear tipped... Blah...blah...blah. Which blue water Navy has actually been kicking ass and taking names since WW2? Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Not everything. The Soyuz is basically a ferry with zero cargo capacity. That's where the Progress comes in but it still can't carry a Hubble. Correct.....plus it's pretty hard to kill people in an unmanned Soyuz milk run. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Correct.....plus it's pretty hard to kill people in an unmanned Soyuz milk run. Indeed...though one did ram the Mir space station if I recall...lol. No bets are ever off re: space flight. The Russians really like their automated stuff, though. But they don't seem to have the coggles to do a Voyager or a Cassini...odd. You'd think they'd be more interested in the deep space stuff. I suppose their lack luster Mars programs turned them off a bit. Venus is still a deserved feather in their collective caps. Nobody else had put a probe on that particular surface. Yet, at least. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 It is. It's also cheaper to conduct R and D when your allies help to foot the bill. Yep...we'll add Canada's HUGE JSF Tier 3 contribution of $160 million to the "pile".....thanks! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 .... Venus is still a deserved feather in their collective caps. Nobody else had put a probe on that particular surface. Yet, at least. Roooskies can have Venus....we'll take Mars. The United States owns Mars. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
wyly Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Blah...blah...blah. Which blue water Navy has actually been kicking ass and taking names since WW2? childish and historically ignorant post, when has the US navy fought any country of consequence??? never...oh wait they took on the Iraqi fishing fleet and had a ship nearly cut in two... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 childish and historically ignorant post, when has the US navy fought any country of consequence??? never...oh wait they took on the Iraqi fishing fleet and had a ship nearly cut in two... Ummmm...Japan? Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 childish and historically ignorant post, when has the US navy fought any country of consequence??? never...oh wait they took on the Iraqi fishing fleet and had a ship nearly cut in two... See "Cold War"..... Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Roooskies can have Venus....we'll take Mars. The United States owns Mars. Venus should be renamed 'Al Gore'. Re: Mars...A valid claim at this point in time. Nearly everything we know about Mars comes from the minds over @ JPL, etc. But you know what kind of Canadian I am. Jim Chamberlin was both of ours. Brothers in arms. Pals 'til the end. Us against 'them'. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Chamberlin Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 See "Cold War"..... True 'nuff about the Commies. But the IJN proved to be a very worthy opponent....t'was like Klingons vs Star Fleet. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Re: Mars...A valid claim at this point in time. Nearly everything we know about Mars comes from the minds over @ JPL, etc. But you know what kind of Canadian I am. Jim Chamberlin was both of ours. Brothers in arms. Pals 'til the end. Us against 'them'. No problem...I have been careful to point out Canuck engineering / imaging on several rover missions. But that just makes some of these blokes angrier. http://resources.yesican-science.ca/red_rover/canada.html Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
wyly Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 The Russian philosophy has always been simplicity and quantity over quality. They tend to also rely on the old 'if it's not broken why fix it?' which really can put a brake on development. Their space program is a good example of this. The R-7 has been in use since its Sapwood ICBM/Sputnik launcher days (1957-58) while the Soyuz has been going strong since 1967. So what's new on the horizon? Nuthin'?? Answer: Nuthin' they're practical, as seen in ww2 they make do with very simple inexpensive solutions...they canceled they shuttle fleet far too expensive...Soyuz is just to reliable and rocket technology can be adjusted for larger payloads and there was no need for a shuttle... So what's new on the horizon?new rocket is already being built for their own manned moon mission, planned test launch is in 2011... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
wyly Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 Ummmm...Japan? lol that's too funny...give it up... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 ...new rocket is already being built for their own manned moon mission, planned test launch is in 2011... Neil and Buzz say Hi! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 True 'nuff about the Commies. But the IJN proved to be a very worthy opponent....t'was like Klingons vs Star Fleet. And to the victor went the spoils....blue water power projection around the world. Obama say, "Where are the carriers". Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted November 26, 2009 Report Posted November 26, 2009 they're practical, as seen in ww2 they make do with very simple inexpensive solutions...they canceled they shuttle fleet far too expensive...Soyuz is just to reliable and rocket technology can be adjusted for larger payloads and there was no need for a shuttle... The Energia while impressive proved too unpractical thus no Buran. The Soyuz carries only what the R-7 can lift. new rocket is already being built for their own manned moon mission, planned test launch is in 2011... Can we all see a pic for reference? Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
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