glenn beck

[Shady]

No but police were in violation of the Fifth Amendment and Sixth Amendment before that for not informing a person of their rights.

So what you're agreeing with is that Americans did not live in a police state prior to 1966. I'm glad to hear.

Check the court decision Shady.

I have. Many years ago.

[punked]

So what you're agreeing with is that Americans did not live in a police state prior to 1966. I'm glad to hear.

I have. Many years ago.

I never claimed it was a police state. It doesn't however change the fact that the supreme court ruled that anyone arrested and not informed of their 5th and 6th amendment rights had their constitutional rights violated. Then again the left wing are the only who really care about the Constitution anyway.

[Shady]

I never claimed it was a police state.

Good. Because that's the assertion I was responding to.

It doesn't however change the fact that the supreme court ruled that anyone arrested and not informed of their 5th and 6th amendment rights had their constitutional rights violated.

And again, it doesn't change the fact that Miranda rights aren't in the constitution. Which is the point I was responding to.

Then again the left wing are the only who really care about the Constitution anyway.

Yes, they certainly do!

Holder wants new look at Miranda rights

AP

Does anybody else hear that shredding sound?

[punked]

Does anybody else hear that shredding sound?

Yeah Him and the Republicans in the Senate are wrong.

[Shady]

Yeah Him and the Republicans in the Senate are wrong.

Yep. It's all the fault of those damn Republicans. Even though they hold absolutely no power in Washington.

[bloodyminded]

Really? So American's lived in a police state pre-1960's? As Canadians, do we currently live in a police state?

Anytime a person can be detained without the proper rights, it is called "kidnapping."

Your assertion is one of the more retarded comments I've ever read in this forum.

If so, that's quite an achievement.

But it does beg the question. Why do you so easily disparage Canada and America, while at the same time, contort yourself in a pretzel like fashion to defend the actions of pirates and Islamic terrorism.

When have I defended the actions of pirates or terrorists? By defending the principles of the law? I would think that's a conservative position, in the best sense of the word.

Edited May 16, 2010 by bloodyminded

[Shady]

Anytime a person can be detained without the proper rights, it is called "kidnapping."

You obviously don't know what you're talking about. The Miranda decision made it so law enforcement let people know of their ALREADY existing rights. All of your talk of police states and kidnapping only degrade the significance (if any) of your posts.

[bloodyminded]

You obviously don't know what you're talking about. The Miranda decision made it so law enforcement let people know of their ALREADY existing rights. All of your talk of police states and kidnapping only degrade the significance (if any) of your posts.

Then what's the problem with reading the rights (which some people arer unaware of, hence the need for reading them)? If the rights are already existing, why should you oppsoe having them read? To what possible end?

[punked]

Yep. It's all the fault of those damn Republicans. Even though they hold absolutely no power in Washington.

Ummmmmmmm You know that even Terror subjects have been read their Miranda rights up unto this point. It is the Republicans who are saying the president is being soft on terror for allowing that to happen right?

[Michael Hardner]

I'm not gonna say 10,000 but it will go up and the American dollar will collapse.

Yes, I think you said that on this thread - that the dollar and euro would go to ... zero ? When is that ?

[Michael Hardner]

none of his critics are actually refuting what he is saying.Is it because his critics can't refute his claims?

He contradicts himself on global warming, that's for sure. As for his other 'claims' I don't even know if you could refute them - he's called Obama a racist and a socialist and since Obama himself has never made those claims ... how could you refuse that ?

Just a media clown exploiting the penchant for outrage...

[bloodyminded]

He contradicts himself on global warming, that's for sure. As for his other 'claims' I don't even know if you could refute them - he's called Obama a racist and a socialist and since Obama himself has never made those claims ... how could you refuse that ?

Just a media clown exploiting the penchant for outrage...

Well said. The issue, for me, isn't whether or not Beck is a liar, anyway. It's that he's an anti-contemplative demagogue. That's his problem.

Frankly, I'm baffled by the fact that so many people admire Beck...or Limbaugh. People who should know better. There are far superior right-wing voices, some of them no doubt bona fide thinkers. I might disagree with them, but at least they put up some decent arguments, and don't use idiocy as their fall-back position.

[Michael Hardner]

Well said. The issue, for me, isn't whether or not Beck is a liar, anyway. It's that he's an anti-contemplative demagogue. That's his problem.

Frankly, I'm baffled by the fact that so many people admire Beck...or Limbaugh. People who should know better. There are far superior right-wing voices, some of them no doubt bona fide thinkers. I might disagree with them, but at least they put up some decent arguments, and don't use idiocy as their fall-back position.

Beck speaks about power in ways that people understand. The institutions of government didn't keep up with the shrinking attention spans of the voters. So they need to understand, but they can't. The system doesn't reflect the people who live by it so you get Becks - people who can exploit that alienation for their own benefit.

I'm convinced, though, that the system has a *wholeness* that will readjust when out of balance. Reasonable people are starting to go to the internet to discuss and find the facts. Hopefully, that demographic will start to become more important to candidates.

[bloodyminded]

Beck speaks about power in ways that people understand. The institutions of government didn't keep up with the shrinking attention spans of the voters. So they need to understand, but they can't. The system doesn't reflect the people who live by it so you get Becks - people who can exploit that alienation for their own benefit.

I'm convinced, though, that the system has a *wholeness* that will readjust when out of balance. Reasonable people are starting to go to the internet to discuss and find the facts. Hopefully, that demographic will start to become more important to candidates.

Actually, I'm inclined to cautiously agree with this largely hopeful assessment; I will only add that I would not be too fundamentally astonished to have my tentative optimism crushed. I get a feeling that the religious Right, barring some catastrophe that would push the more radical tea-party types into the political mainstream, is on the political decline. (I use "tea-party" as an adjective of convenience here, not necessarily referring to them specifically and directly.) As for the more uncontemplative and authoritarian sectors of the Left...they're rarely of great concern in this type of society anyway, having so few allies with real power and wealth; so catastrophe is more likely from the far Right, in my view.

But, like you, I think the forces of moderation will probably prevail, and the status quo "balance," while quite unacceptable, is preferable to a proto-fascist or anarcho-capitalist nightmare. Any day of the week.

Edited May 16, 2010 by bloodyminded

[Michael Hardner]

Actually, I'm inclined to cautiously agree with this largely hopeful assessment; I will only add that I would not be too fundamentally astonished to have my tentative optimism crushed. I get a feeling that the religious Right, barring some catastrophe that would push the more radical tea-party types into the political mainstream, is on the political decline. (I use "tea-party" as an adjective of convenience here, not necessarily referring to them specifically and directly.) As for the more uncontemplative and authoritarian sectors of the Left...they're rarely of great concern in this type of society anyway, having so few allies with real power and wealth; so catastrophe is more likely from the far Right, in my view.

I would say that 'uncontemplative' sectors are a problem wherever they appear. In Canada, this could mean liberal middle-class types such as myself. From what I hear at parties, they're also susceptible to lazy thinking. Everyone is.

Whatever the pervasive bias happens to be, the nature of politics is for somebody to take advantage of it.

But, like you, I think the forces of moderation will probably prevail, and the status quo "balance," while quite unacceptable, is preferable to a proto-fascist or anarcho-capitalist nightmare. Any day of the week.

The ascent of new media, though, tends to destabilize and you will find somebody taking advantage of THAT. Hitler did it with radio, and Ron Paul is doing it with the web.

[Shady]

I get a feeling that the religious Right, barring some catastrophe that would push the more radical tea-party types into the political mainstream, is on the political decline.

Well, I know which religious right that isn't on the decline. The religious right of Islam. They're the only religious right that I'm concerned about.

The religious left and their social justice counterparts are somewhat of a nuisance. But seeing what's happened to Greece, and what's happening to Ireland, Spain, Portugal, Britian, and even America. Their influcence is decreasing by the day. Glenn Beck's been great at uncovering the problems their socialist policies have created around the world. And I'm glad there's at least a few voices in mainstream media that aren't cheerleaders and stenographers for this administration and its leftwing policies.

[maple_leafs182]

If jobs grow at the same rate over the next 8 months as the last 4 there will be more jobs created in 2010 then all of the Bush presidency. Spare me your sky is falling nonsense.

Do you know what a bubble economy is?

When you pump the economy with trillions of dollars, that creates a bubble economt. The economy is running off artificial spending. Once that money goes away, the bubble bursts and reality sinks in. Not only is there the stimulus bubble, having interest rates this low encourages people loan money and spend, more artificial spending because that can't last forever either, eventually people have to stop spending and start saving.

The problem with America is over consumption and too much debt, consuming more and going into more debt won't solve the problem, it will just delay the inevitable, a correction must occur.

America's government and its citizens are broke.

When America falls the global economy falls.

[Michael Hardner]

And I'm glad there's at least a few voices in mainstream media that aren't cheerleaders and stenographers for this administration and its leftwing policies.

When I felt that Michael Moore was more interested in self-promotion than truth, I lost interest in him.

That attribute doesn't seem to sway your interest in Beck - why is that ?

[punked]

Do you know what a bubble economy is?

When you pump the economy with trillions of dollars, that creates a bubble economt. The economy is running off artificial spending. Once that money goes away, the bubble bursts and reality sinks in. Not only is there the stimulus bubble, having interest rates this low encourages people loan money and spend, more artificial spending because that can't last forever either, eventually people have to stop spending and start saving.

The problem with America is over consumption and too much debt, consuming more and going into more debt won't solve the problem, it will just delay the inevitable, a correction must occur.

America's government and its citizens are broke.

When America falls the global economy falls.

You do know Economies have been based on bubble for 500 years right? Again spare me.

[bush_cheney2004]

The problem with America is over consumption and too much debt, consuming more and going into more debt won't solve the problem, it will just delay the inevitable, a correction must occur.

America's government and its citizens are broke.

Oh really? Did you know that Canadians are now first in household debt?

Canada has moved to the top of G 20 nations, but its not a category you want to be on top of. Canada ranks first of advanced G 20 nations when it comes to debt to income ratio. According to the study Canadians were not held back by the recession and continued to take on debt.

The Certified General Accountants Association has released a report that shows that the level of household income has soared to $40,000. The association was a bit surprised that Canada's households continued to take on debt even during the recession.

According to the report household income reached $1.4 trillion, which spread out evenly to each man, woman and child amounts to $41,740. As recently as the 1980s Canadian used to save 20% of their disposable income. This has now shrunk to less than 1%. Consumerism has taken a hold of Canada and those that have available credit, are using it.

It would appear that Canadians have not changed their spending habits despite the recession. Looking at recent events in Europe, at what point have we taken on too much debt? Countries get into trouble when they live beyond their means.

When America falls the global economy falls.

So again we have a Canadian hoping for America to save the world. Natch.....

[maple_leafs182]

You do know Economies have been based on bubble for 500 years right? Again spare me.

Did you know economies have collapsed in the past.

[punked]

Did you know economies have collapsed in the past.

Yes when they were linked to fluctuation gold prices.

Not that the US economy couldn't collapse but I think we need to see more then the most jobs created in the last 15 years in a month. Those aren't signs of collapse.

Edited May 16, 2010 by punked

[Shady]

but I think we need to see more then the most jobs created in the last 15 years in a month. Those aren't signs of collapse.

What in the world are you talking about?

[Michael Hardner]

Lewis Black on Beck's inane Hitler comparisons... set against Beck's outrage over comparisons between Arizona and Nazi Germany...

http://tinyurl.com/beckandhitler

The more we make fun of these things, the less influence these people will have upon the confused...

[Shady]

Lewis Black on Beck's inane Hitler comparisons... set against Beck's outrage over comparisons between Arizona and Nazi Germany...

http://tinyurl.com/beckandhitler

The more we make fun of these things, the less influence these people will have upon the confused...

You can make fun of Beck all you want. It doesn't change the fact that he's right.