Topaz Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 Are Canadians getting tired over the way the politicians are playing the game of politics? Are we getting a negative view towards the way the PMO runs this country? Please read the following and especially the comments that other Canadians have made. http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/654249 Quote
Borg Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 (edited) Are Canadians getting tired over the way the politicians are playing the game of politics? Are we getting a negative view towards the way the PMO runs this country? Please read the following and especially the comments that other Canadians have made. http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/654249 Canadians have been apathetic for almost a generation. They have consistently tuned out and voter turn out has always been low I believe it has a lot to do witht the fact life has been fairly good and cetainly easy for the vast majority. Heck the common "outside kebec" joke is that even a separatist and regional group sits in a national parliament, the Green party and the NDP are the laughing stock of serious working folks that recognize their policies would bancrupt the country. Human rights commissions have unlimited power and can break a man / woman financially should they actually attempt to defend themselves, legal help is so expensive people cannot receive "justice" in the legal system, the news is the same on almost all the same stations - the three stooges attempted to take over a government - all of it makes us a laughing stock - nationally and internationally - folks just want to be left alone and get on with their lives. If and when this country actually gets busy and starts caring - or there is a terrorist attack that succeeds - there will be a turn around - until then it will be status quo Borg Edited June 21, 2009 by Borg Quote
eyeball Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 WHILE OTTAWA is seen as ground zero, the roots of the problem are found across the country among everyday citizens.In short, look in the mirror. Marleau complains Canadians know too little about the institutions that govern them. He points to last fall's parliamentary showdown as proof when the notion of the Liberal-NDP coalition was dismissed as "unconstitutional." The coalition may have been politically unpalatable. But it was perfectly legal under Canada's parliamentary system. And yet complaints about the coalition as a "coup" found a ready audience among Canadians, something Marleau finds worrisome. "We do not do a good job in Canada about teaching and learning about our basic institutions." Worrisome? Its pathetic actually. The ready audience Marleau speaks of is the very same gang that also poos all over any idea of electoral reforms, PR, mandatory voting...change in other words. This is what truly defines a real conservative in my view. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Smallc Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 (edited) ummmm...I probably know more about our government system than most people here even...and I don't like all the reform movements. Nice theory I suppose though. I knew that what happened wasn't an attempted coup.....but I don't support all of the 'great' change that is proposed. Edited June 21, 2009 by Smallc Quote
eyeball Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 I suppose any proposed change in the face of immovable stagnancy must appear great. Too great to even bear thinking about apparently. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Smallc Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 as has already been discussed in other threads, there is no evidence that changes that may in fact make the country less stable would result in higher turnout. Quote
eyeball Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 I could probably forgo voting reforms if the most substantial cause of voter apathy could be addressed - the lack of transparency in government. That's a fairly hopeless notion too it seems. It should be no surprise, but it often sadly is, that the anti electoral reform crowd is just as likely to poo on any idea that actually leads to more transparency. Too bad we're all stuck with the type of government they deserve. In the meantime why anyone else should have any respect for the government or the political processes in this country is beyond me. If Ottawa disappeared off the face of the world tomorrow I'd be dancing in the streets. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Smallc Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 I could probably forgo voting reforms if the most substantial cause of voter apathy could be addressed - the lack of transparency in government. Aside from some of the backwards step that this government has taken, government over all has become far more transparent through access to information and mandatory reporting. How much more are they supposed to do? Government officials still have a right to privacy after all. Quote
Borg Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 Government officials still have a right to privacy after all. In their personal lives I agree - but they are MY servant - they spend MY tax dollar and I demand MY servant show me how that is done. Whimpy canadians love their government - the best government is one that fears its master - the tax payer. I think they all need to get a swift kick in the ass and show me exactly how they spend MY money So - privacy? Personal life only - otherwise they can stand up and be counted for what they truly are - SERVANTS. And SERVANTS do as they are told. Borg Quote
Smallc Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 You can see exactly how your money is spent. Freedom of information allows you to find out anything that isn't secret. Any problem with expenses in Ottawa is in your mind for the most part. Quote
Riverwind Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 The ready audience Marleau speaks of is the very same gang that also poos all over any idea of electoral reforms, PR, mandatory voting...change in other words.Change for the sake of change accomplishes nothing. The real problem is the people - not the system. Motivated and engaged people can work with the system. Disengaged people will be disengaged no matter what the system. Quote To fly a plane, you need both a left wing and a right wing.
Smallc Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 (edited) +1. I couldn't agree more. If anything, we should be changing the people....by educating them. Edited June 21, 2009 by Smallc Quote
eyeball Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 +1. I couldn't agree more. If anything, we should be changing the people....by educating them. I suggest we start with the politicians and people who call it a coup when someone proposes to form a coalition in Canada's Parliament. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Smallc Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 Good idea...I wrote letters to my provincial education department regarding that very issue. They wrote back talking about the changes that they have made and are making to the curriculum, but I don't think it will be enough. Quote
Borg Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 You can see exactly how your money is spent. Freedom of information allows you to find out anything that isn't secret. Any problem with expenses in Ottawa is in your mind for the most part. Trust me - after having responded to A to I requests - those emails that people want to read are not always available - I know many who delete all at the end of the day. The good stuff often goes home to private files. MPs from all parties refused to disclose their expenses recently - if A to I is required to get anything then it is not free And no you cannot see how your money is spent - the libs put millions and possibly billions into private foundations not accountable to anyone. Five bucks gets you the minimum - more will cost you. So I have to buy that information. You really do believe the world is a friendly and warm place don't you. Someday you will lose that innocence. I hope it is not too traumatic for you Borg Quote
Smallc Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 You really do believe the world is a friendly and warm place don't you. The world? No. The Government of Canada? For the most part, yes. MP expenses are not a problem in this country because MPs in this country would never be able to claim the type of expenses that were able to be claimed in the UK. There are strict rules governing expenses. That said, people are stupid, and if I were an MP I wouldn't want the fickle public looking at something that they have no understanding of if I don't have to give it to them. People would be mad for the sake of being mad. Quote
lictor616 Posted June 21, 2009 Report Posted June 21, 2009 (edited) Are Canadians getting tired over the way the politicians are playing the game of politics? Are we getting a negative view towards the way the PMO runs this country? Please read the following and especially the comments that other Canadians have made. http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/654249 Well that's certainly encouraging, Canadians SHOULD be tuning out... The farcical state of "democracy" and politics in canada is indeed entering a rapidly degenerative stage. Canada's in a state of anomie or integral alienation... Already, liberal policies of the past 30- 40 years have totally devalued what it means to be canadian! Which today merely means the place you happen to be in at the moment... Instead of a nation we have simply a collection of individuals, and each of those individuals is thinking, at least at a subconscious level, "It's every man for himself." Today thanks to our political disaster we no longer have a common set of shared values. Canadians have a weaker sense of identity, a weaker sense of who they are and of what they belong to. They're much less likely to find positive role models among the real people around them: among their teachers and neighbors and community leaders. They're much less likely to have constructive goals or to lead purposeful and useful lives. we have only the media (first) and our political mess (second) to blame for this... this corresponds fairly well to where canadian "democracy" or rather "mediacracy" stands... Edited June 22, 2009 by lictor616 Quote -Magna Europa Est Patria Nostra-
Oleg Bach Posted June 22, 2009 Report Posted June 22, 2009 Count me in on that every man for himself...deal ---- we are so cornered and stress out and under attack that we are paniced. Quote
Remiel Posted June 22, 2009 Report Posted June 22, 2009 (edited) In their personal lives I agree - but they are MY servant - they spend MY tax dollar and I demand MY servant show me how that is done.Whimpy canadians love their government - the best government is one that fears its master - the tax payer. I think they all need to get a swift kick in the ass and show me exactly how they spend MY money So - privacy? Personal life only - otherwise they can stand up and be counted for what they truly are - SERVANTS. And SERVANTS do as they are told. Borg Public servants are not peons, Borg. If you want to treat them like that, you deserve to get stonewalled. And the master of the public servant is not the taxpayer, but the citizen. The distinction is important. Edited June 22, 2009 by Remiel Quote
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