A Fight That Can't Be Won. Afghanistan Mission.

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

Reverse the roles and think for a minute if we were a backward third world nation and we had Afghni invaders on our soil. Could or would these armed interlopers be victorious over us? Certainly not, we would be picking them off from the roof tops for a hundred years. We would be insulted that some other group came in and attempted to re-form our banking system - our government our judicary and create new social policies that they believe are superiour to our own.

Historically, no force has ever been successful with what amounts to a home invasion. No force can ever hope to be victorious when they are fighting on someone elses turf and having to endure the confusion of another culture and never fully understanding it. The rationale form our left in reguards to the conflict is still based in a type of intrusive vacariousness. Stop them from beating their woman - as if all of these males beat their wives? Or - that stupid presumption by comfortable western feminists and girly men.."so a little girl can go to school." As if they all long to be educated to our standards but just don't know they are longing for western enlightenment, so we must let them know.

Then there is our rightist rationale that simply parrots the American "war on terror" and the jealous curtailing of opium production, that can not be controled by profit seeking westerners. The continued enrichment of the American Military Complex and their shady share holders. Strangely, opium production has gone up and not down - so, so much for that ruse. The other perversity is contained within our aging and bored corporates who encourage this affair to prove that they have bigger balls than the primatives. Those that sat in office towers for 30 years in a sterile environ that has quietly demasculated them - for someone to die - gives them relevence..and it does not matter who or on what side.

We see more handsome young men carrying dead men in boxes and some how someone somewhere has got this notion that these images unite a nation - and give it needed pride...as they ship the corpses to the coroners office in Toronto at huge expense - where the autosphies are preformed on these boys as if they were lab rats..all in the hope of gathering information on war wounds and horrific bodily trama - that the curious and detactched study with glee...and the most insulting part is the lack of loyalty - Myself, I am from the Slavonic blood line born in England raised in Canada - I have a thankful loyalty to the Anglo tribe - and to see them foolishly destroy familiar lineage as if the potential children of these men were of little value - to them. This to me is similar to the issue of how abortion has depleted our extended family and how immigration has increased to fill the ranks of Canadian citizenry.

This is a small but significant holocausting of the decendents of our original founding Christians. All I can say - is stop wasting our human resourses - these are a limited and desloving clan. This is not the Canada of old where there was a never ending supply of white Christian meat to be disposed of by those delluded in self importance!

Canadian Blue · December 15, 2008

What?

ToadBrother · December 15, 2008

What?

I think he's against our troops being in Afghanistan... I think.

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

Your "what" is dismissive..why? Do you not take any interest in the waste of young men? Or are you one of these elitist types suffering from the great disconnect that is based in arrogance? Maybe you think that the the sons of the blue collar class are inferiour and sub-human and their deaths are just part of doing buisness - explain yourself...I would like to know what motivates you smirky "what"

Canadian Blue · December 15, 2008

I think he's against our troops being in Afghanistan... I think.

I was more shocked by the last couple of lines about the "white christian meat."

Your "what" is dismissive..why? Do you not take any interest in the waste of young men? Or are you one of these elitist types suffering from the great disconnect that is based in arrogance? Maybe you think that the the sons of the blue collar class are inferiour and sub-human and their deaths are just part of doing buisness - explain yourself...I would like to know what motivates you smirky "what"

I myself have never been to Afghanistan on tour, however I'm currently a member of the Canadian Forces in the reg force. Hardly an elitist type. Most members I've known have been extremely proud of what they're doing over in Afghanistan and believe the sacrifice is worth it. That being said their are a number of reasons we should stay in Afghanistan, which are for the benefit of ourselves and the Afghans. Leaving at this moment would essentially create anarchy in the country and we would once again see the country becoming a larger breeding ground for terrorist training camps. I also believe we are needed their to help those Afghan's who want to see their country become a successful liberal democracy. We shouldn't be there forever, but we should only leave once we're certain the Afghan's can take care of themselves and any internal threats they might face.

Edited December 15, 2008 by Canadian Blue

White Doors · December 15, 2008

I was more shocked by the last couple of lines about the "white christian meat."

Really? I am more shocked that people actually pay attention to this fellow.

The man is obviously mentally challenged.

Leave him alone.

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

I was more shocked by the last couple of lines about the "white christian meat."
I myself have never been to Afghanistan on tour, however I'm currently a member of the Canadian Forces in the reg force. That being said, most members I've known have been extremely proud of what they're doing over in Afghanistan and believe the sacrifice is worth it. That being said their are a number of reasons we should stay in Afghanistan, which are for the benefit of ourselves and the Afghans. Leaving at this moment would essentially create anarchy in the country and we would once again see the country becoming a larger breeding ground for terrorist training camps. I also believe we are needed their to help those Afghan's who want to see their country become a successful liberal democracy. We shouldn't be there forever, but we should only leave once we're certain the Afghan's can take care of themselves and any internal threats they might face.

I understand that - it's known to all that a noble mind motivates our troops. As the Americans finally leave Iraq - murdering percieved "traitors" will become a common past time for the nest ten years. As you know you simply can not kill them all..nor can you stop the influx of sympathizer that will continue to flow into the region - are we to match the influx of these people with more of our own? It will be never ending. Some in the American administration are considering bringing in the draft...if this conflict expands and grows larger to the point where we are pressured by the Americans to supply more boots on the ground ---------------I fear that they may come for my son and drag him off to be more road kill - My parents both suffered during war and the tail end of a revolution - my father served - and I learned one thing - there are no good guys. My point was - If Canada with all it's multi-culturalism being pushed and advanced - It seems that only "white Christian meat" is being sacraficed - where are the sons and daughters of our immigrants - should they not be sacraficed also?

ToadBrother · December 15, 2008

I was more shocked by the last couple of lines about the "white christian meat."
I myself have never been to Afghanistan on tour, however I'm currently a member of the Canadian Forces in the reg force. Hardly an elitist type. Most members I've known have been extremely proud of what they're doing over in Afghanistan and believe the sacrifice is worth it. That being said their are a number of reasons we should stay in Afghanistan, which are for the benefit of ourselves and the Afghans. Leaving at this moment would essentially create anarchy in the country and we would once again see the country becoming a larger breeding ground for terrorist training camps. I also believe we are needed their to help those Afghan's who want to see their country become a successful liberal democracy. We shouldn't be there forever, but we should only leave once we're certain the Afghan's can take care of themselves and any internal threats they might face.

I agree completely. I think victory in Afghanistan is a very long-term goal, and I'm not sure that it's possible as we see it. The alternative, which is to see the Taliban, which very much acted as simply a local branch of Al Qaeda prior to 9-11, taking back control of the country would be an absolute disaster. As hard as it is to see or fighting men and women going to Afghanistan and suffering the casualties they have (while some of our NATO partners seem far less willing to put their own in harm's way), it's a worthwhile struggle, and forcing timelines on such an operation is ludicrous.

It is in the West's best interests that Afghanistan be, if not brought into the fraternity of civilized nations, at least contained.

ToadBrother · December 15, 2008

I understand that - it's known to all that a noble mind motivates our troops. As the Americans finally leave Iraq - murdering percieved "traitors" will become a common past time for the nest ten years. As you know you simply can not kill them all..nor can you stop the influx of sympathizer that will continue to flow into the region - are we to match the influx of these people with more of our own? It will be never ending. Some in the American administration are considering bringing in the draft...if this conflict expands and grows larger to the point where we are pressured by the Americans to supply more boots on the ground ---------------I fear that they may come for my son and drag him off to be more road kill - My parents both suffered during war and the tail end of a revolution - my father served - and I learned one thing - there are no good guys. My point was - If Canada with all it's multi-culturalism being pushed and advanced - It seems that only "white Christian meat" is being sacraficed - where are the sons and daughters of our immigrants - should they not be sacraficed also?

Not only does this sound racist, but it's pretty damned bizarre. The draft was never seriously considered in the US. It would be political suicide for whatever party put it forward. It's certainly not being considered here.

Canadian Blue · December 15, 2008

Our military is made up of volunteers, not conscripts. I would never support the draft as that would be a complete disgrace to the basic ideal of individual liberty which we should be upholding.

As well minorities have died in Afghanistan while serving with the CF. It's not just "white Christian meat."

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

Not only does this sound racist, but it's pretty damned bizarre. The draft was never seriously considered in the US. It would be political suicide for whatever party put it forward. It's certainly not being considered here.

In a crisis of biblical proportion political survival would be put aside and a draft is a possiblity. Anything is possible these days. Pulling the race card out is kind of a weak retort to my statements. Of course if loyal to familiar race (family) is a bad thing then I see your point - but it is not bad. Maybe our happy new and prospering immigrants are loyal to their families and insist that they do NOT enlist...perhaps they know that putting their children that they love out there to die for some half baked ideolgy is foolish...maybe they consider their "race" precious and we do not. As for the bizarre - look around - You have the thankful Iraqis tossing their shoes at the most powerful officer on earth...I would say that situation is more bizarre than any premise I come up with ---------will they in time toss a shoe at Harper? That's possible.

Canadian Blue · December 15, 2008

Loyalty to race is bad, simply because it assumes that one shares a fatuous bond based on the weakest of physical traits.

As for the bizarre - look around - You have the thankful Iraqis tossing their shoes at the most powerful officer on earth...I would say that situation is more bizarre than any premise I come up with ---------will they in time toss a shoe at Harper? That's possible.

No, I'm pretty sure most of us realized that not every Arab loves Bush.

M.Dancer · December 15, 2008

Really? I am more shocked that people actually pay attention to this fellow.
The man is obviously mentally challenged.

Leave him alone.

I find him a thread killer...I only see his post when other quote them and even then I can't be bothered to read them.

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

No matter what - who is ever the most dominant once it's over will prevail domestically in Afghanistan and in Iraq. The ones we fight or the most strong and motivated and the shrewest. We could install a government there but in 2 years they would all be pushed aside. Survival of the strongest will be the natural process there - and it looks so far that the so-called Taliban - what ever the hell they really are will prevail - because they are the dominant coalition of tribes - Just like here - those that rule our system will always rule it. Its a lost cause - and all the idealogy and theory and goodwill along with good intentions will not change human nature - we are just the gang from across the ocean that has come over to over throw their gang on their turf - for God's sake we can not even oust the gangs at Jane and Finch.

bush_cheney2004 · December 15, 2008

Some in the American administration are considering bringing in the draft...if this conflict expands and grows larger to the point where we are pressured by the Americans to supply more boots on the ground ---------------I fear that they may come for my son and drag him off to be more road kill

Is your son an American? Maybe he will volunteer anyway, despite your selfish fears.

- My parents both suffered during war and the tail end of a revolution - my father served - and I learned one thing - there are no good guys. My point was - If Canada with all it's multi-culturalism being pushed and advanced - It seems that only "white Christian meat" is being sacraficed - where are the sons and daughters of our immigrants - should they not be sacraficed also?

They are....I already told you about Corporal Gooden.

blueblood · December 15, 2008

I find him a thread killer...I only see his post when other quote them and even then I can't be bothered to read them.

Welcome to small town life, every town has their well known kook. This character is our's.

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

Is your son an American? Maybe he will volunteer anyway, despite your selfish fears.
They are....I already told you about Corporal Gooden.

You know and I know that intelligent independent people do not "volunteer" for anything unless forced to volunteer. I brought my kids up right...and I mean they watched me a man who did what ever he pleased all his life without being swallowed up by the herd to be used by the herder. "Is your son an American?" - Ha - again you know and I know that these weak and feeble "Canadians" are a push over - One phone call threatening monitary sanctions from you guys and Harper did the dance. I know you are teasing me...and having some fun...IF - America wanted more Canadian human bodies to throw into the grinding machine - you would get them...but not mine or my sons - think of me as a Bush type - my kids belong to me...and are not fodder - they know it and I know it and you know it....I am not of that class.

ToadBrother · December 15, 2008

In a crisis of biblical proportion political survival would be put aside and a draft is a possiblity. Anything is possible these days. Pulling the race card out is kind of a weak retort to my statements.

I didn't pull the race card, you did.

Of course if loyal to familiar race (family) is a bad thing then I see your point - but it is not bad.

This is just getting too weird for me. Just because I may share your skin tone is meaningless. I'll feel loyal to you if we share basic philosophical and ideological tenets. Your skin color is utterly irrelevant, and is such a ludicrous way of dividng "us from them". Your views might have made sense in the 19th century, when ignorance of the nature of human populations was widespread, but come on, we've got molecular biology now, and race, biologically speaking, is meaningless, or at least the notion of race that divides the world into "whites", "blacks", "yellows" and so forth.

Maybe our happy new and prospering immigrants are loyal to their families and insist that they do NOT enlist...perhaps they know that putting their children that they love out there to die for some half baked ideolgy is foolish...maybe they consider their "race" precious and we do not. As for the bizarre - look around - You have the thankful Iraqis tossing their shoes at the most powerful officer on earth...

Because he toppled their terrible government, but still hasn't been able to fully restore what they even had under that government. At any rate, this has nothing to do with race, it is political.

I would say that situation is more bizarre than any premise I come up with ---------will they in time toss a shoe at Harper? That's possible.

You're mouthing racist crapola and then you think someone else is being more bizarre.

The 19th century called and they want their racial theories back.

bush_cheney2004 · December 15, 2008

You know and I know that intelligent independent people do not "volunteer" for anything unless forced to volunteer. I brought my kids up right...and I mean they watched me a man who did what ever he pleased all his life without being swallowed up by the herd to be used by the herder.

And by raising your son, he may have seen the folly in your thinking. The right motivation that speaks to him, not you, will have more influence.

"Is your son an American?" - Ha - again you know and I know that these weak and feeble "Canadians" are a push over - One phone call threatening monitary sanctions from you guys and Harper did the dance. I know you are teasing me...and having some fun

I always tease with an underlying purpose...in this case....to decompose your selfish fears. Canada better own all that it does, regardless of the damn Americans.

...IF - America wanted more Canadian human bodies to throw into the grinding machine - you would get them...but not mine or my sons - think of me as a Bush type - my kids belong to me...and are not fodder - they know it and I know it and you know it....I am not of that class.

Surely you are mad....the Bush Sr. was shot down during WW2. So can we have your grandpappy?

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

Skin tones? You are young and fully programmed - maybe the UN can use your services...they are all for getting rid of all skin tones. Look at the historic and genetic disloyalty that you profess. You are more than skin..you are the product of a culture that is a thousand years old - and now you look back as if you were born yesterday and belong to no one and no one belongs to you. Your core can not be changed - you are the product of a certain tribe...but of course you really don't care about your grandfather or great grand mother and so on who brought you into being in this present form...what's wrong with propogation of your own? Whats so "racist" about you having children of your own - so you as a family - _race - can continue - do I smell the hint of liberal eugenics here?

ToadBrother · December 15, 2008

Skin tones? You are young and fully programmed - maybe the UN can use your services...they are all for getting rid of all skin tones. Look at the historic and genetic disloyalty that you profess. You are more than skin..you are the product of a culture that is a thousand years old - and now you look back as if you were born yesterday and belong to no one and no one belongs to you. Your core can not be changed - you are the product of a certain tribe...but of course you really don't care about your grandfather or great grand mother and so on who brought you into being in this present form...what's wrong with propogation of your own? Whats so "racist" about you having children of your own - so you as a family - _race - can continue - do I smell the hint of liberal eugenics here?

You're a racist, and probably insane. At any rate, I won't give into the worst aspects of my species' tribalism.

bush_cheney2004 · December 15, 2008

... Whats so "racist" about you having children of your own - so you as a family - _race - can continue - do I smell the hint of liberal eugenics here?

Hey...there is hope for you after all...if only the Airborne Regiment was still around.

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

And by raising your son, he may have seen the folly in your thinking. The right motivation that speaks to him, not you, will have more influence.
I always tease with an underlying purpose...in this case....to decompose your selfish fears. Canada better own all that it does, regardless of the damn Americans.

Surely you are mad....the Bush Sr. was shot down during WW2. So can we have your grandpappy?

Bush seniour is NOT Bush junior. Genetics some times play a cruel joke on the elite that think they clone themselves though their sons. Sometimes nature puts you on the sad side of a cruel joke and that son has all the characteristics of crazy old aunt Martha the valium gobbling drunken cat lady. Not saying that prince George is a total write off - but rarely are sons like their fathers - mine for instance attempts to rule me because in most ways he is better and imporved - that is what successful fatherhood is about - not to fill your shoes - but for him to fill better shoes. As for the right motivations speaking to him - sorry - he does not hear voices - unlike George. :lol:

bush_cheney2004 · December 15, 2008

Bush seniour is NOT Bush junior. Genetics some times play a cruel joke on the elite that think they clone themselves though their sons. Sometimes nature puts you on the sad side of a cruel joke and that son has all the characteristics of crazy old aunt Martha the valium gobbling drunken cat lady.

...but you said....nevermind

Not saying that prince George is a total write off - but rarely are sons like their fathers - mine for instance attempts to rule me because in most ways he is better and imporved - that is what successful fatherhood is about - not to fill your shoes - but for him to fill better shoes. As for the right motivations speaking to him - sorry - he does not hear voices - unlike George.

Doesn't really matter...sons (and daughters) will continue to go....because they want to. Can't live your father's dreams, or fear your fathers nightmares.

Oleg Bach · December 15, 2008

...but you said....nevermind
Doesn't really matter...sons (and daughters) will continue to go....because they want to. Can't live your father's dreams, or fear your fathers nightmares.

You are a secularist company man...cute...Let me explain to you...did you have a good look at your parents bodies and what life did to them? I am sure they had a very comfortable and safe existance and educated you well as I can see...well the bodies of my parents were pock marked from gun shot wounds - my dads left pupil was eccentric from a grenade that he managed to toss back. He was a sneaky little traitor who survived....I will be blunt with you - only STUPID people "continue to go" - and also - it's not about fear in me - my offspring is my private property - and you look at the young as your property - state property - sorry - it's a non-starter...by the way - My son saw the products of my dreams and he decieded on his own to continue in the family buisness of persuing a creative life - not a destructive one....Funny how the people who rise to the top and like waging war are not the most cultured or talented or creative. The merchant class rises and in envy of the gifted ones - in a talentless way - attempt to be creative - but the best they do is to dupe and kill the duped...I suppose being an artist is being the ultmate liar...still - they are not very good at it - money....is not power.