Canada and Russia

[eyeball]

Canadians had better wake up quickly. Russia is seeking control of the Arctic, not for mere political reasons but for the economic reality of the resources that are KNOWN to exist there. Russia is cash starved, so the development of those resources means a great deal to them.

This nation of sheep needs to realize just exactly what is at stake in this matter. There are trillions of dollars at stake in the development of the Arctic. We could well find ourselves divested of control of vast amounts of mineral wealth should we fail to consider the realities at hand.

If Russia is as cash starved as you say they'll no more be able to afford to conquor the Arctic than we can. Besides which, have you seen where our old bosum buddy allies the US want to put the line that runs north from the Yukon Alaska border? Russia's claim seems perfectly reasonable in contrast.

[Topaz]

I think Russia is alot better off cash wise than the US, of course how many countries have a 15 trillion $$ debt???

[eyeball]

I think Russia is alot better off cash wise than the US, of course how many countries have a 15 trillion $$ debt???

I don't know, in some minds a big debt like that is probably something to brag about.

[bush_cheney2004]

I think Russia is alot better off cash wise than the US, of course how many countries have a 15 trillion $$ debt???

None.

[Argus]

If Russia is as cash starved as you say they'll no more be able to afford to conquor the Arctic than we can. Besides which, have you seen where our old bosum buddy allies the US want to put the line that runs north from the Yukon Alaska border? Russia's claim seems perfectly reasonable in contrast.

Russia is hardly starved for cash, quite the contrary.

And the difference here is not that the Russians are making claims, but that the Russians are set to draw borders, and then defend them.

[eyeball]

Russia is hardly starved for cash, quite the contrary.

And the difference here is not that the Russians are making claims, but that the Russians are set to draw borders, and then defend them.

Like I said have you seen where the US drew our border for us?

[Wild Bill]

Like I said have you seen where the US drew our border for us?

Who cares? Are you suggesting that because you don't like Uncle Sam that we have no need to worry about Russia taking de facto possession of the Arctic?

Are you saying that it would never happen and even if it did, we have enough resources to do anything about it?

[AngusThermopyle]

Like I said have you seen where the US drew our border for us?

No I haven't. Do you have a link or something, I'm curious and would like to see what they propose.

[Smallc]

No I haven't. Do you have a link or something, I'm curious and would like to see what they propose.

http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Beaufort_Sea

[jbg]

I think Russia is alot better off cash wise than the US, of course how many countries have a 15 trillion $$ debt???

Russia would not hesitate to repudiate its debt if that were in its interest.

[kengs333]

The last thing Canada needs is a larger military. Canada simply can't be defended given the current state of warfare and so the only logical use for a larger military would be for other misguided foreign adventures. I think the only positive role that the military plays in our society that it provides an avenue for people with bloodlust and aggression problems to channel these energies and discipline themselves to a certain extent so that they don't do as much harm to society as they could.

[Argus]

Like I said have you seen where the US drew our border for us?

The US is not about to send soldiers to enforce those borders. The Russians very well might.

[Argus]

The last thing Canada needs is a larger military. Canada simply can't be defended given the current state of warfare and so the only logical use for a larger military would be for other misguided foreign adventures. I think the only positive role that the military plays in our society that it provides an avenue for people with bloodlust and aggression problems to channel these energies and discipline themselves to a certain extent so that they don't do as much harm to society as they could.

During WW2 Canada had over a million people in uniform. Our population is now three times greater, so, theoretically, we could have 3 million people in uniform. I think that would defend quite a bit.

[Smallc]

During WW2 Canada had over a million people in uniform. Our population is now three times greater, so, theoretically, we could have 3 million people in uniform. I think that would defend quite a bit.

And how are we supposed to pay for that?

[PoliticalCitizen]

The last thing Canada needs is a larger military. Canada simply can't be defended given the current state of warfare and so the only logical use for a larger military would be for other misguided foreign adventures. I think the only positive role that the military plays in our society that it provides an avenue for people with bloodlust and aggression problems to channel these energies and discipline themselves to a certain extent so that they don't do as much harm to society as they could.

I totally agree with you.

A country like Canada that fully depends on US for protection could do with no military whatsoever

[Smallc]

I totally agree with you.

A country like Canada that fully depends on US for protection could do with no military whatsoever

We totally depend on the US....that's why the HMCS St. John's is off the coast of Haiti helping with their disaster, because we have absolutely no capacity or ability.

[Wild Bill]

We totally depend on the US....that's why the HMCS St. John's is off the coast of Haiti helping with their disaster, because we have absolutely no capacity or ability.

Yep, that's us! We can't defend against guns, planes or bombs but if there's a disaster somewhere we can show up with blankets.

Of course, if there's TWO disasters going on at the same time we're kinda euchred...

[wulf42]

The last thing Canada needs is a larger military. Canada simply can't be defended given the current state of warfare and so the only logical use for a larger military would be for other misguided foreign adventures. I think the only positive role that the military plays in our society that it provides an avenue for people with bloodlust and aggression problems to channel these energies and discipline themselves to a certain extent so that they don't do as much harm to society as they could.

This has to be the most rediculous comment i have ever heard...............of course Canada can be defended it just needs the weapons to do so....which is why Liberals can never ever be at the Helm again.......they work for the Russians and Al-Qaeda not Canada! I see alot of people on here saying threat what threat....give your head a shake Russia and China is and will always be a threat....but as i said before we are in NATO!!! that means we are to pull our own wait Militarily right now we are considered a joke by most of the world....i mean for god sake India and Pakistan could kick our ass ! I swear the to God Canadians have become so passive and benign we are just like those seals waiting to be slaughtered up north!

[Argus]

And how are we supposed to pay for that?

We paid for it then.

[whowhere]

This has to be the most rediculous comment i have ever heard...............of course Canada can be defended it just needs the weapons to do so....which is why Liberals can never ever be at the Helm again.......they work for the Russians and Al-Qaeda not Canada! I see alot of people on here saying threat what threat....give your head a shake Russia and China is and will always be a threat....but as i said before we are in NATO!!! that means we are to pull our own wait Militarily right now we are considered a joke by most of the world....i mean for god sake India and Pakistan could kick our ass ! I swear the to God Canadians have become so passive and benign we are just like those seals waiting to be slaughtered up north!

Are you on Crack??

Until Canada can tie its own shoelaces Canada will always be a joke. To be a power is take raw resources and convert it into a tank, a helicopter, aircrafts of sorts, and the list goes on. Once you are in the game your end product will always be compared with what is coming out of other countries. The fact is Canada can't even design and build cars which is or was supposedly the engine of Ontario. If Ontario is about cars, where's the brand?? Britain has the mini cooper and the range rover. What does Canada have? For as long we have stupid politicians, Canada will always be a joke. The liberals are a lot of things but the conservatives have done more to wreck Canada than any political party in history.

For starters, if Canada is serious about becoming a "power" Canada could at least start assembling, building, and maintaining its own military equipment instead of donating Canada's resource welfare money to the US for their equipment. Any jackass can take money, go into another country and buy a tank, a jet fighter, and any other military equipment that is out there. Doing this is not power. All it demonstrates you are inept and to stupid to construct this equipment yourself. Not really, Canadians fault we have short sited stupid politicians that are to eager to give Canada's money to the US and other countries.

[wulf42]

Are you on Crack??

Until Canada can tie its own shoelaces Canada will always be a joke. To be a power is take raw resources and convert it into a tank, a helicopter, aircrafts of sorts, and the list goes on. Once you are in the game your end product will always be compared with what is coming out of other countries. The fact is Canada can't even design and build cars which is or was supposedly the engine of Ontario. If Ontario is about cars, where's the brand?? Britain has the mini cooper and the range rover. What does Canada have? For as long we have stupid politicians, Canada will always be a joke. The liberals are a lot of things but the conservatives have done more to wreck Canada than any political party in history.

For starters, if Canada is serious about becoming a "power" Canada could at least start assembling, building, and maintaining its own military equipment instead of donating Canada's resource welfare money to the US for their equipment. Any jackass can take money, go into another country and buy a tank, a jet fighter, and any other military equipment that is out there. Doing this is not power. All it demonstrates you are inept and to stupid to construct this equipment yourself. Not really, Canadians fault we have short sited stupid politicians that are to eager to give Canada's money to the US and other countries.

I am all for it............build our own weapons who wouldn t support that?...oh right the Liberals!

[whowhere]

I am all for it............build our own weapons who wouldn t support that?...oh right the Liberals!

I am not defending the liberals because they really haven't done much to make Canada into a "power" so to speak either. The liberals have done just as much as the conservative in turning Canada into a resource welfare economy. What is Harper's claim to fame??

He bought some helicopters or something from the US for more than a billion dollars. All Canadians get out of it is some service/maintenance work. Where's the assembly/construction jobs, the real work!!?? So harper has just given away a Billion dollars for what and to whose benefit? At least Trudeau and Chretian had the right attitude towards the US: The one finger Salute. The US can go f'ck themselves. With the US credit Crisis, the likes of enron and worldcom, and how Canadians are being held hostage to high gas prices because of American Oil Refiners is not evidence enough the Americans are out to eff everyone around them; I am not sure what more the world needs to see. The smart people recognizes bush is the biggest jackass/turkey to be president in US history. He has single handely brought the US to the brink of an economic collapse.

We don't need a Harper led Conservative Government who sees bush as a hero and wants to give Canada's money to the US. We need politician's to tell the American to go eff themselves or deal with Canada on the level. That means a part in the design/engineering, assembly/Contruction, and service/maintenance of all military and space equipment. This is not happening. Until this is happening all Canadas military spending should be directed towards Research and Developement! Once the R&D is complete, Canada can move to the assembly/construction phase. In the interim Canada should return the military to Canada's traditional role of peace keeping, That's it. Canada's politician's need to get serious about Canada and safeguarding Canada's money.

[PoliticalCitizen]

We totally depend on the US....that's why the HMCS St. John's is off the coast of Haiti helping with their disaster, because we have absolutely no capacity or ability.

It is commendable that our military engages in helping countries in crysis, but let's not forget that any army is AN INSTRUMENT OF MASS MURDER. Soldiers are trained to kill and destroy and their job is killing and destroying (as well as invading, capturing, occupating, etc.)

Army is not something a modern society should be proud of.

As to the relations with Russia - with the Arctic de-freezing I would say Russia could become Canada's next biggest trading partner.

Let's build trade routes instead of picking fights.

[wulf42]

I am not defending the liberals because they really haven't done much to make Canada into a "power" so to speak either. The liberals have done just as much as the conservative in turning Canada into a resource welfare economy. What is Harper's claim to fame??

He bought some helicopters or something from the US for more than a billion dollars. All Canadians get out of it is some service/maintenance work. Where's the assembly/construction jobs, the real work!!?? So harper has just given away a Billion dollars for what and to whose benefit? At least Trudeau and Chretian had the right attitude towards the US: The one finger Salute. The US can go f'ck themselves. With the US credit Crisis, the likes of enron and worldcom, and how Canadians are being held hostage to high gas prices because of American Oil Refiners is not evidence enough the Americans are out to eff everyone around them; I am not sure what more the world needs to see. The smart people recognizes bush is the biggest jackass/turkey to be president in US history. He has single handely brought the US to the brink of an economic collapse.

We don't need a Harper led Conservative Government who sees bush as a hero and wants to give Canada's money to the US. We need politician's to tell the American to go eff themselves or deal with Canada on the level. That means a part in the design/engineering, assembly/Contruction, and service/maintenance of all military and space equipment. This is not happening. Until this is happening all Canadas military spending should be directed towards Research and Developement! Once the R&D is complete, Canada can move to the assembly/construction phase. In the interim Canada should return the military to Canada's traditional role of peace keeping, That's it. Canada's politician's need to get serious about Canada and safeguarding Canada's money.

On this we sort of agree...i would love to see Canada design and build our own weapons systems.......but we can t just tell the U.S. to go pound...unforunately like it or not they really do protect us from other countries and have for many years....i would love to see Canada build new weapons for defensive purposes only we would get more respect and we as Canadians would be proud knowing we don t have to kiss Americas ass so they go on protecting us! We built the Avro Arrow...it was the best aircraft in the sky at the time we can do it again!

Edited September 21, 2008 by wulf42

[Argus]

I am all for it............build our own weapons who wouldn t support that?...oh right the Liberals!

The Liberals? Building weapons? In our cities!? Not likely.