1 in 5 people in Canada are now immigrants

[mikedavid00]

So if this board is any indication of the larger group it is quite apparent that a majority of those who call themselves "conservative" do not like immigrants? I'm not sure yet but do conservatives dislike ALL immigrants or just the ones with non-white skin and a religion other than evangelical christion?

reminds me of the anti-chinese leaugue of the Emily Murphy days.

To me it's a matter of my tax dollars sponsoring people to be here and having my political system hijacked. I get half of my money taken away.

It's also undeniable that immigrants from certain countries are not benefitting Canada (ie: Samolia).

Look at my comments on the guy who got tasered. Hmm.. funny i wasn't called a racist then when I said he would not be a benefit to Canada and should NOT have been allowed entry into the country.

Maybe the racism is in YOU GUYS eyes and not me.

[kengs333]

So if this board is any indication of the larger group it is quite apparent that a majority of those who call themselves "conservative" do not like immigrants? I'm not sure yet but do conservatives dislike ALL immigrants or just the ones with non-white skin and a religion other than evangelical christion?

reminds me of the anti-chinese leaugue of the Emily Murphy days.

The times have really changed, and the situation is somewhat more complex.

Here's a thought:

Let's say Spain became a facist dictatorship again, but this time decided to wage war against Britain, France, and the rest of Europe; surprisingly, within the course of several months they are victorious and occupy much of Europe and begin turning it into a fascist Empire. Throughout the Spanish-speaking world there is a new found pride in their heritage and widespread sympathy for Spain and fascism. Canada decides to join the effort to free Europe once again from the evils of facism. For whatever reason Canada's immigration policy also dictates that there is a need for 1.6 million immigrants during the next five years and that for whatever reason the majority of people interested in immigrating come from Mexico, central and south America, and even Spain itself. Given that the rise of the new Spanish empire in Europe has had some sort of impact throughout the Spanish-sleaking world, would it be logical to allow 250-400,000 Spanish-speaking people into this country during the next few years while involved in this war?

[Argus]

The Statscan report also mentioned the racism associated with the newcomers. In this, it is not much different that the 1930s when Irish, Ukrainians, Chinese, Japanese and others were subject to attacks. I wonder how many of those who once faced the same problems are now the ones responsible for today's racism?

I think that's an unfair stereotype without much basis in fact. Certain racial and ethnic groups face general societal disapproval while others do not. You can't explain that by mere dislike of skin colour. Nobody much dislikes Japanese or Korean immigrants, but a lot of people have problems with Chinese and Vietnamese. Indians who are Hindus do not have the same reputation as Indians who are Sikhs, who still have higher approval than Muslims. Why? Why do Jamaicans, Somalians and Haitians stand out, among Blacks, as those considered least desirable?

And have you ever considered the possibility that some of the distrust for specific immigrant groups in the past was in some ways justified? If you get boat loads of landless, unskilled immigrants without money a number of them are going to get into trouble with the law, going to be crowding the streets begging, causing trouble, etc.

Most of the distrust of immigrants today has little to do with actual racism - ie a dislike of skin colour or ethnicity, and a lot to do with what is considered anti-social behaviour or beliefs here (crime, misuse of public services, extreme homophobia and misogyny, etc), and culture clashes among cultures whose values are in some ways diametrically opposed.

[Argus]

I agree. Lets call a spade a spade (and not a shovel)

It's xenophobia.

Why is it xenophobic to not want all your neighbours to be people who think your wife and daughter are whores and you're a godless heathen?

I happen to appreciate the fine art of girl watching. Too many Muslim women and it's more like watching a sheet sale at Sears.

[Argus]

So if this board is any indication of the larger group it is quite apparent that a majority of those who call themselves "conservative" do not like immigrants? I'm not sure yet but do conservatives dislike ALL immigrants or just the ones with non-white skin and a religion other than evangelical christion?

reminds me of the anti-chinese leaugue of the Emily Murphy days.

I dislike immigrants who don't pay taxes because they came here with no skills and unable to speak the language. I dislike immigrants who break the law. I dislike immigrants whose cultural value set says that all Canadian women are cheap sluts and that all women need to be covered in bed sheets. I dislike immigrants who are religious fanatics - by MY standards. I dislike immigrants who do not understand democracy, compromise or freedom - who love to embrace freedom - for themselves - but feel they should have a perfect right, or the state should have the right, if not the necessity, to stop any behaviour they don't like.

[daniel]

Recent immigrants born in Asia (including the Middle East) made up the largest proportion (58.3%) of newcomers to Canada. ...

More good news from Mike. Good work.

Edited December 4, 2007 by daniel

[August1991]

This country's going to hell in a hand basket fast.

And when we get there, we'll be greeted by Australia.

According to the 2006 Australian census, about 25% of Australians were born outside of Australia.

IMV, this reflects the dynamic nature of Australian (and Canadian) society. I don't see many people queuing up to live in Iran or Sudan.

Edited December 4, 2007 by August1991

[Moxie]

I have no problem with Immigrants, however if we continue the current trend of letting them live or move to Major Cities we will have problems. How is Toronto going to maintain it's infrastructor if the minority become a majority? If they aren't working or giving back to society visa vie taxes who's going to foot the bill. The Mayor of Toronto has already asked the feds to help with their crippling debt, this will only get worse. Mean while immigrants fester in sqaller and poverty and eventually civil unrest will ensue. We cannot continue to financially support Immigrants with lavish social programs if they never pay into those programs. It's financial and cultural suicide, what happens when those who get sick of paying for several generations of immigrants welfare lifestyle moves to another part of the Country. We could end up with entire cities with 60 percent of the population on welfare or another social programs.

It isn't racism to talk about the future, don't we owe the next generation fiscal responsibility. Why not impliment new Immigration Programs that FORCE new immigrants to live in rural areas where there is a need for population enhancement?

Do we want the same future currently crippling Europe? Third generation welfare recipients who have no intention of going to work or integrating into society. France, German, Belguim, Sweden, Norway, the list is endless, forcing their people to pay for a lifestyle of the "Weak, lame and lazy" lest we offend. Well I'm offended, I have to work for a living.

[Higgly]

According tot he CBC Toronto News this evening, 45% of the people living in Toronto now were born outside of the country and only 54% consider English to be their mother tongue.

Time for the feds to start ponying up more for the cities. McGuinty is doing his bit (at least in Ontario) and has already started uploading. Even Ottawa gets a break from McGuinty.

[M.Dancer]

How is Toronto going to maintain it's infrastructor if the minority become a majority? If they aren't working or giving back to society visa vie taxes who's going to foot the bill.

Couple of points.

Immigrants work.....in many cases at two jobs...they buy houses and pay property taxes.

Second, even if immigrants out number native born, there isn't a monlithic immigrant entity. look at the numbers....they arfe from all cultures and will no doubt become part of the alloy.

[M.Dancer]

Why is it xenophobic to not want all your neighbours to be people who think your wife and daughter are whores and you're a godless heathen?

I happen to appreciate the fine art of girl watching. Too many Muslim women and it's more like watching a sheet sale at Sears.

I have never viewed a sheet sale.....nor do I shop much at sears.

But seriously...how xenophobic immigramts like the one you describe woulpd want to come here, when there perfectly good land in Syria?

[jdobbin]

I have to laugh at the "racism" part. People don't want to be swamped with foreign cultures, and that's called "racism?" What trash.

You find yourself swamped? How so?

[Leafless]

Couple of points.

Immigrants work.....in many cases at two jobs...they buy houses and pay property taxes.

Second, even if immigrants out number native born, there isn't a monlithic immigrant entity. look at the numbers....they are from all cultures and will no doubt become part of the alloy.

Many native Canadians work two or even three jobs just to buy food and pay their property taxes.

Canadians do not need the eager competition from the previously 'starving have nots' from third world countries but require a government that will NOT rip off Canadians to the point where as there is no incentive to reproduce.

IMO, immigrants can stay where they came from.

[M.Dancer]

Many native Canadians work two or even three jobs just to buy food and pay their property taxes.

Canadians do not need the eager competition from the previously 'starving have nots' from third world countries but require a government that will NOT rip off Canadians to the point where as there is no incentive to reproduce.

IMO, immigrants can stay where they came from.

You should make up your mind (or have room service do it...) Half the time you say immigrants are on the dole, now you are saying immigrants are competing for jobs with impoverished Canadians....

....have your cake, or eat it....one or the other.

[M.Dancer]

I just want the Rogers Telemarketer who calls me to be able to use a neutral accent....

[jdobbin]

I think that's an unfair stereotype without much basis in fact. Certain racial and ethnic groups face general societal disapproval while others do not. You can't explain that by mere dislike of skin colour. Nobody much dislikes Japanese or Korean immigrants, but a lot of people have problems with Chinese and Vietnamese. Indians who are Hindus do not have the same reputation as Indians who are Sikhs, who still have higher approval than Muslims. Why? Why do Jamaicans, Somalians and Haitians stand out, among Blacks, as those considered least desirable?

And have you ever considered the possibility that some of the distrust for specific immigrant groups in the past was in some ways justified? If you get boat loads of landless, unskilled immigrants without money a number of them are going to get into trouble with the law, going to be crowding the streets begging, causing trouble, etc.

Most of the distrust of immigrants today has little to do with actual racism - ie a dislike of skin colour or ethnicity, and a lot to do with what is considered anti-social behaviour or beliefs here (crime, misuse of public services, extreme homophobia and misogyny, etc), and culture clashes among cultures whose values are in some ways diametrically opposed.

Don't think I was stereotyping or suggesting I new what the true facts were. Statscan doesn't break down who expressed bigotry, racism or intolerance. I was wondering out loud who was having racist views and who they might be against and what it might be about.

[Leafless]

You should make up your mind (or have room service do it...) Half the time you say immigrants are on the dole, now you are saying immigrants are competing for jobs with impoverished Canadians....

....have your cake, or eat it....one or the other.

My mind is made up and proof was previously presented that there is no net contribution to Canadian society by Canadian immigrants.

IOW, they use more resources than what they pay in taxes. Talk about impoverished.

[M.Dancer]

My mind is made up and proof was previously presented that there is no net contribution to Canadian society by Canadian immigrants.

IOW, they use more resources than what they pay in taxes. Talk about impoverished.

I'm pretty sure an stats you have posted were disected and found wanting, maiunly becuase you either misapplied them or didn't understand them. I believe Hardner did journeymans work on that already so dredging up why you were wrong then would simply be redundant

[mikedavid00]

And when we get there, we'll be greeted by Australia.

According to the 2006 Australian census, about 25% of Australians were born outside of Australia.

IMV, this reflects the dynamic nature of Australian (and Canadian) society. I don't see many people queuing up to live in Iran or Sudan.

Go do further research on Australia and look at the country of origin for their immigrants.

Then go look at their languages spoken.

I repeat. No other country in the world is in the position that we are in and it's time that action be taken..

This is very worrying what's happening. All day on the radio the general mood, even from some o fthe CBC hosts were an 'uneasy' feeling.

Those feelings are generated from the fact that deep down we know we odn't have the jobs for these people and do not have the welfare state to support them coming here. They outright said it.. albiet very nicely on the CBC radio today. Something is going to have to give soon.

[August1991]

Go do further research on Australia and look at the country of origin for their immigrants.

Then go look at their languages spoken.

I repeat. No other country in the world is in the position that we are in and it's time that action be taken.

I just looked at your thread title: 1 in 5 people in Canada are (sic) now immigrants

In the 2006 Census, 7 out of 10 Australian residents were born in Australia.

Link

IOW, 3 in 10 Australians is an immigrant.

----

MikeDavid, what are the origins of Canada's immigrants? What languages do they speak? How does this compare with Australia? I dunno. But Australia has twice as many foreign-born residents (on a per capita basis) than Canada does. You do the back-of-the-envelope math. (I haven't looked up statistics for the US but I imagine that they are comparable.)

MD, you might have a better argument if you noted that for the first time in several decades, Canada's immigrants are poorer - and stay poorer - than Canadian-born.

We live in a world where it is easier and easier for people to travel and cross borders. Some countries, such as Japan and Saudi Arabia, attempt to deal with this by strictly controlling who obtains citizenship. But even they can't really stop foreigners from living in their midst.

In a civilized, open and dynamic country such as Canada, people moving here is inevitable.

MD, you sometimes argue that we should only accept immigrants if they have a job before arriving. That's a dumb selection criteria that would quickly turn into a bureaucratic nightmare. I'll agree however that we could improve who we select and how we do it.

[Lazarus]

I just want the Rogers Telemarketer who calls me to be able to use a neutral accent....

What? Them bloody Newfies annoying you again?

[ScottSA]

In a civilized, open and dynamic country such as Canada, people moving here is inevitable.

This is quite simply wrong, defeatist, and naive. There is nothing 'inevitable' about it at all.

[Leafless]

I'm pretty sure an stats you have posted were disected and found wanting, maiunly becuase you either misapplied them or didn't understand them. I believe Hardner did journeymans work on that already so dredging up why you were wrong then would simply be redundant

Your responses are unacceptable.

Go to hell Dancer!

[Lazarus]

I've read through this thread in amazed disbelief. Since when did Canada and Canadians become such closed minded, closed hearted and ignorant gits?

Seems a vast number of you here believe that all non-white non-western European immigrants are only here to suck off our social welfare teat. That it is a piece of cake immigrating here. That the majority of non-white non-western European immigrants are a net loss to Canada as a whole. One gets the feeling many of you would just love to slam the door shut on these "undesirable" non-white non-western European immigrants.

First off, if you are not of First Nations stock, then you to come immigrant stock.

Secondly, let me tell you a couple of stories about immigrating here.

I am currently engaged to a lady from the Philippines, have been for a couple of years now (wedding is next year in Manila). She is a University educated woman who graduated with B.Comm and Finance Honours. I met her was here when she was a care-giver working with a temporary work permit/visa. She came here in order to support her family back in the Philippines. We dated for 18 months, until her permit expired and she dutifully went back home. We stayed in contact. She then went to Taiwan to work, I visited often and we got engaged. For the past year and a half we have being dancing to Immigration Canada's tune, jumping through the hoops and she still hasn't been granted her Landed Immigrant Visa and trying even to get a Temporary Resident visa (she needs one even to visit here for a couple of weeks) is a fucking nightmare. I on the other hand can just jump of a plane and go there. While going through the Immigration process, I meet dozen of other in the same boat telling the same story. Getting ones family here from overseas is not as easy as the press and talking heads would have you believe.

Second story is about a family that immigrated here from China. He was a businessman and she was a trained electrical engineer who specialized in power transmission and generation and held a Master Degree in Engineering. She taught electrical engineering in Beijing and authored a number of text books that are still in use to this day. Canada needed people with her skill sets, training and experience, so they got fast-tracked. Once they landed here, they learned that her qualifications amounted to a pile of rancid dog crap as far governing body of Electrical Engineers of BC were concerned. If she wanted to practice her profession, she would have to start from scratch, go back to University and earn her degree's all over again, and go through the whole qualifying process with the governing body. This after she and her family were lead to believe they were needed here badly. In the end, she was forced to take a job in a factory doing manual labour and he went back to China. Last I heard she is still in that factory doing manual labour while trying to raise her son on her own. Her husband has since divorced her and remarried.

We have hundred if not thousands of people like her in Canada. Skilled and dedicated professionals who came here to not only to start a new and better life for themselves and their family, but ready and willing to contribute their arts and skills in return. We have trained lawyers, doctors, engineers driving cabs and doing other low paying jobs. We have qualified and experienced nurses and teachers who can only secure work in hospitals and schools as cleaning women. And yet we cry out that we are short of doctors, nurses, engineers, machinist and other skilled trades and professions. Many of these immigrants would love nothing better then to be able to contribute to Canada with their arts and skills, but are barred from doing so because they happen to be foreign traded and educated.

And if you think that barrier only applies to those coming from Asia, think again. Back in '65 my parents came here from the UK, mom was a qualified and skilled OR Nursing Sister, an RN here. Her experience and training was not recognized here and it wasn't until the mid 80's after we kids had grown up was she able to go back to school, gain her license and practice her art.

[ScottSA]

I've read through this thread in amazed disbelief. Since when did Canada and Canadians become such closed minded, closed hearted and ignorant gits?

Seems a vast number of you here believe that all non-white non-western European immigrants are only here to suck off our social welfare teat. That it is a piece of cake immigrating here. That the majority of non-white non-western European immigrants are a net loss to Canada as a whole. One gets the feeling many of you would just love to slam the door shut on these "undesirable" non-white non-western European immigrants.

Yup to the last conclusion. They ought not come here.

Since when did Canadians get so suckered in by multicult that they want immigration for immigration's sake? Sure, it's fine to have all these allegedly hard working "new" canadians while the job market is hot and the economy booming, but unfortunately through the immigration process, they...well...don't go home. If asking that question, and pointing out to you that you specific stories are irrelevant to the general theme, is "close-minded, then I can only suggest that being open minded is akin to having a leaky bucket perched atop one's neck.