Calling Some One a Racist or Bigot

[Guest coot]

Well there are black muslims, asian muslims, european muslims.....fundamentalist muslims, secular muslims, sunni muslims, shia muslims, sufi muslims,.......

Did you notice the common noun at the end of all your examples? That's a feature. Besides, who cares? Arguing semantics is just a sad, pathetic way to avoid the fact it's bigoted. And no one can provide a lucid argument that it isn't.

[ScottSA]

Did you notice the common noun at the end of all your examples? That's a feature. Besides, who cares? Arguing semantics is just a sad, pathetic way to avoid the fact it's bigoted. And no one can provide a lucid argument that it isn't.

I see we've retreated from "racist" to "bigoted". Please define "bigoted."

[jazzer]

Yep, clear as mud. What race to Muslims belong to again?

Irrelevant. Racist, by the definition I provided can be someone who discriminates on race or religion.

[bush_cheney2004]

Irrelevant. Racist, by the definition I provided can be someone who discriminates on race or religion.

Nope...the English language is more sophisticated than that.

[betsy]

I read the op. It was even more racist than the thread title. So I'm asking again to explain how it isn't bigoted. I mean it is a forum, after all. Provide an argument already.

If you read it, explain then how it is bigoted?

[betsy]

I also call down the double standard of people when they forgive little brown people their idiocy but lambast Christians for their's.

Link

For those objectively reading that statement, it clearly shows the sarcasm intended towards those who readily practice their double standards!

Considering the heinous plot that was exposed which implies evidence(s) that there are indeed enemies within us, what more enemies that are sitting in government....latching on an emotionally-charged statement, taking it out of context and making such a big deal out of it not only does it render the accusation of racism so misplaced...but also gives one pause to ponder that either the accuser have no understanding of normal human reactions and normal debate procedures in a mature forum....or she/he is a sympathizer. After all, we are at war with terrorism, and we are in a battle to protect and preserve our own society and way of life.

So let's come clean. Whose side are you on?

[Guest coot]

If you read it, explain then how it is bigoted?

It makes a vast generalization about a wide group of people based on the actions of a few. Can you explain how it is not bigoted? Can you explain the extraordinary revelation I was to find by reading the context of the thread and not just the title?

[Guest coot]

After all, we are at war with terrorism, and we are in a battle to protect and preserve our own society and way of life.

This is a complete misrepresentation of reality. We are not in a battle to preserve our society. The only threat to our society is from warmongers and racists who would have us bomb other people for profit. If we are in a battle of civilizations, why are we not taking it at all seriously, as we did in WWII? Why are we not asked to contribute to the war effort, buy war bonds, conserve resources, enlist, and make sure we win at all costs? Because it's not that kind of war, that's why. Instead we're encouraged to buy more imported cars and plasma TVs and stay home and ignore it.

[margrace]

This is a complete misrepresentation of reality. We are not in a battle to preserve our society. The only threat to our society is from warmongers and racists who would have us bomb other people for profit. If we are in a battle of civilizations, why are we not taking it at all seriously, as we did in WWII? Why are we not asked to contribute to the war effort, buy war bonds, conserve resources, enlist, and make sure we win at all costs? Because it's not that kind of war, that's why. Instead we're encouraged to buy more imported cars and plasma TVs and stay home and ignore it.

Yes coot it is the war of a weak man (Bush( controlled by a group of evil men who want the power and control of money. That is the only reason for this war.

[Argus]

It makes a vast generalization about a wide group of people based on the actions of a few.

A few? How few? When 40% of British Muslims say they want Sharia law imposed in Britain that is pretty indicative of widespread religious fanaticism through the Muslim world. If you took a similar poll in Egypt you'd probably have an even higher desire. Oh wait, someone did! Over sixty percent of respondents wanted Sharia law in Egypt. And that is actually understating the facts, for over 30% wanted legislation based on Sharia. Numbers are similar in other Arab nations.

sharia law poll

Gee, I wonder what Sharia law has to say about homosexuals?

Homosexuality, moreover, is considered a grave sin. In Hadith, Muhammad clarifies the gravity of this by saying: "Allah curses the one who does the actions (homosexual practices) of the people of Lut," repeating it three times; saying in another Hadith: "If a man comes upon a man then they are both adulterers." Here, he considered homosexuality tantamount to adultery in relation to the Shari’ah punishments because it is an abomination on the one hand, and the definition of adultery applies to it on the other hand.....As for lesbians, Muhammad said about them: "If a woman comes upon a woman, they are both adulteresses." The homosexual receives the same punishment as an adulterer. This means, that if the homosexual is married, he/she is stoned to death, while if single, he/she is whipped 100 times.

You people on the Left need to wrap your minds around the fact Islam is a political system, not merely a religion, and as such criticisms of it are as legitimate as criticism of Nazism or fascism or Communism.

[M.Dancer]

A few? How few? When 40% of British Muslims say they want Sharia law imposed in Britain ...............I. Over sixty percent of respondents wanted Sharia law in Egypt.

So a majority of muslims in the UK don't want Sharia? Good

It seems like that emigres to the west are less likely than homegrown to want Sharia....

[Argus]

So a majority of muslims in the UK don't want Sharia? Good

It seems like that emigres to the west are less likely than homegrown to want Sharia....

Or less likely to be honest about it. Nevertheless, 40% is a huge number. That's getting into the area of a majority government if a political party has that kind of support. So dismissing the criticisms against Islam as if they were based only upon the few terrorists - and not the many religious fanatics of that religion - is dishonest.

[ScottSA]

So a majority of muslims in the UK don't want Sharia? Good

It seems like that emigres to the west are less likely than homegrown to want Sharia....

You're a smart guy, but this sort of nonsense belies it.

[jazzer]

Nope...the English language is more sophisticated than that.

You go with the dictionary that agrees with your beliefs apparently. I'm a little more open minded than that, and in this case, happen to agree that a racist can be a person who belittles or discriminates against another's religion. It's a semantic argument really, but I found at least two dictionaries that agree with me.

Edited October 16, 2007 by jazzer

[M.Dancer]

Or less likely to be honest about it. Nevertheless, 40% is a huge number. That's getting into the area of a majority government if a political party has that kind of support. So dismissing the criticisms against Islam as if they were based only upon the few terrorists - and not the many religious fanatics of that religion - is dishonest.

Honestly I find the question interesting....in that I would be interested to see how the numbers break down....for instance, what are the desire of those who are 2nd generation UK muslims.....1st generation.....by age and by sex.......

My gut feeling is that if someone is willing to uproot and transplant themsleves in to a foreign culture, they do it with open eyes and a degree of willingness to adapt.

But the is only my gut feeling, it would be interesting to see what the ralities are.

[ScottSA]

My gut feeling is that if someone is willing to uproot and transplant themsleves in to a foreign culture, they do it with open eyes and a degree of willingness to adapt.

But the is only my gut feeling, it would be interesting to see what the ralities are.

Your gut feeling is quite likely correct. When "visible minorities" come to foreign shores, they do it with the expectation that it will be a benefit to acclimatize and change. I know we did when we moved to India.

It's apparently when a critical mass is reached that insularity begins. The "Chinese laundry" in every western town was never an issue, and even "Chinatowns" and Little [insert visible minority]s in large cities are not remarkable, but when enough people of a given race or religion congregate in large enough numbers, it seems the muscle flexing begins. The fact that such groups are actually encouraged to do so by policies of official multiculturalism naturally makes things worse and probably lowers the critical numbers threshold, but the argument that brooks no opposition in western society today is the "rights" argument. They have a "right" to live in a country more to their liking...why should they, a generation later, still have to acclimatize?

The factor that seems to make the difference is the 'visible' aspect. Scotsmen no longer feel the need to shag sheep, Ukrainians no longer hitch the wife to plows, and Irish no longer drink too mu...well, anyway... But that's because a few generations on, no one knows the difference anymore. That was never going to be the case with Asian immigration; a policy embarked on with a great deal of hope that society would turn colorblind. Unfortunately while most of the welcoming society seems to be more or less colorblind, few of the visible minorities are. That, I suspect, more than any newlyfound allegiance to a psychotic thug, is why second gen Muslims are regressing into the sociopathy of Islam. Naturally, anyone who is not a visible minority who points this out is immediately branded a racist and so on, but the facts pretty much speak for themselves.

And all the arguments for the muscle flexing are "valid," according to the lexicon of 21st century western society. Which leaves the only 'cure' to be a radical slowdown of immigration, in hopes that it's not too late.

Edited October 16, 2007 by ScottSA

[guyser]

It's apparently when a critical mass is reached that insularity begins. The "Chinese laundry" in every western town was never an issue, and even "Chinatowns" and Little [insert visible minority]s in large cities are not remarkable, but when enough people of a given race or religion congregate in large enough numbers, it seems the muscle flexing begins. The fact that such groups are actually encouraged to do so by policies of official multiculturalism naturally makes things worse and probably lowers the critical numbers threshold, but the argument that brooks no opposition in western society today is the "rights" argument. They have a "right" to live in a country more to their liking...why should they, a generation later, still have to acclimatize?

If true, then how does one fit the Italians who make up nearly 600, 000 in the GTA alone (1.2M total ), or the fact that Germans , @ 2.7M have not to my knowledge flexed muscle.

One in four or better in Kitchener is German descended.

[ScottSA]

If true, then how does one fit the Italians who make up nearly 600, 000 in the GTA alone (1.2M total ), or the fact that Germans , @ 2.7M have not to my knowledge flexed muscle.

One in four or better in Kitchener is German descended.

You didn't read my post very carefully, did you?

[Leafless]

If true, then how does one fit the Italians who make up nearly 600, 000 in the GTA alone (1.2M total ), or the fact that Germans , @ 2.7M have not to my knowledge flexed muscle.

One in four or better in Kitchener is German descended.

We are talking about 'third world have nots' who have never experienced the better life, power, or anything else associated with civilized countries.

Sort of like greedy wild animals wanting it all but have no idea how to go about it, but try to forcefully take it by impressing their outdated culture and primitivism.

[Argus]

You go with the dictionary that agrees with your beliefs apparently. I'm a little more open minded than that,

If by "open minded" you mean, you make up a definition and paste it in as though it were from a legitimate dictionary - hoping no one checks - then yes indeed, you're "open minded".

and in this case, happen to agree that a racist can be a person who belittles or discriminates against another's religion. It's a semantic argument really, but I found at least two dictionaries that agree with me.

Odd how when one actually goes to the dictionary sites they have a different definition than the one you pasted in.

[guyser]

You didn't read my post very carefully, did you?

I did , and read it again. I assume you think I missed something. Please show me. Is it the 2nd gen stuff?

[jazzer]

If by "open minded" you mean, you make up a definition and paste it in as though it were from a legitimate dictionary - hoping no one checks - then yes indeed, you're "open minded".

Odd how when one actually goes to the dictionary sites they have a different definition than the one you pasted in.

I gave you the link. I guess you didn't read all the definitions.

[Guest coot]

We are talking about 'third world have nots' who have never experienced the better life, power, or anything else associated with civilized countries.

Sort of like greedy wild animals wanting it all but have no idea how to go about it, but try to forcefully take it by impressing their outdated culture and primitivism.

Back to the original topic....

[Argus]

I gave you the link. I guess you didn't read all the definitions.

I followed the link. It does not say what you pasted here. You simply added in the word "religion" yourself to support your idiotic supposition on the meaning of racism.

[Guest coot]

I just followed the link and pressed control-c. Now I shall press control-v: racist, antiblack, anti-Semite (discriminatory especially on the basis of race or religion)